The AT World of Warcraft Thread (Where do you play) and general BS

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269

Originally posted by: Dangerer
random based loot is how the game will always stay in my opinion. On my warrior, the first week I ran kara I picked up 4 tanking items in the same run. I've ran kara 3 additional times since then and haven't gotten a single piece of tank dropping. It's not like I'm being outrolled, it's not even dropping at all! Sitting at over a hundred badges now.

As DPS numbers i really hate the RNG. One night during RWC I pulled 1800 DPS as full fire without any fancy T6 gear. Checked wws, and crit rate was well over 50%. Next boss anetheron. I stood in one spot and spammed fireball the entire fight and was under 1200 dps. Check wws logs, and crit rate was 20%, 15% under my normal crit rate fully buffed w/ a shaman in the group.

We ran Kara for 4-6 months before either of the dps daggers dropped. Spiteblade dropped one time and went to a hunter because I had to log in my Pally for healing purposes. And we had no stinking badges!

you wanna talk about shitty RNG drop luck, here goes

ZA was released like Oct/Nov of '07
I have run ZA 2x a week EVERY week for 10 ish months now
# of times i have seen Hex Shrunken Head Drop = 1
when did it drop, something like 9 months ago

i really wouldent care if it droped and i just kept loseing the rolls for it but just not seeing it for 6+ months straight 2x a week is really really annoying

we pretty much only run ZA no to see if i can get my trinket, im the only one without it now i think, people alts have it from random Pug runs


I actually think ill have a DST for LOL Mele Lock before i get the Hex Head

 

[BenSkywalker]

I think the easiest example to show that a 10 man cannot necessarily ready you for a 25 man is the Four Horsemen in Naxxramas.

You didn't seriously type that out did you man? I would love to hear you explain why the 4 horseman, a 40 man raid boss, gives proof that you can't tune encounters between 25 and 10 man content? Obviously they will be changing the boss up for 25 man, now think of fighting them in different phases in 10 man, 2 at a time.

I could also see Instructor Razuvious changing in 10 vs 25 man (he probably won't change from 40 to 25) as you simply won't have enough people to handle is 4 adds.

CCable in 10 man, not 25. Really, you aren't giving a challenge

But then again, having 4 tanks in a 25 man fight isn't horrible unheard of (Mu'ru uses 3 if I remember correctly), but it's still probably the most you'd have.

We always use 5 for Alar. I know the tanks could platform dance, it's just much simpler with 5(also handy to have 3 kitties with nice bear sets ). To your general point- ever considered the people that don't plan on ever running 25 man content? You know, most people who play WoW?

One of the reasons i wanted the looting system changed from tank and healer bias to a DKP or RPP ( which i just learnt from the above post) system is once people get there loot they dont have much motivation to do that content anymore.

In all honesty, if they have run Kara to the point where they have even gotten all of their badge gear and epic gems, it shouldn't be asked of them to run it ever again(if they want to, then that's all good). If you are trying to transition into 25 man content you should be focusing on people that could fill those people and get them geared. For Tier 4 at least, 25 mans are two Kara groups and any 5 scrubs(scrubs are entirely optional).

Another reason is the senior officers with 3 or more alts wanting to get all of there toons kara geared! theres like 4 senior officers in my guild that has literally 5 alts or more each and almost all of them in kara gear. This kind of trend is not going to help the guild in 25, because its not like they're dual or quad boxing there toons.

I don't know your exact situation, but I know that a lot of people in my guild have geared alts to fill in whatever slot is needed. For myself, I can OT through T5 and heal or dps T6 content. What do I bring to a raid? Although I like to take my mage, I bring whatever it is that will benefit the raid the most. If the alts are being used in this capacity, then it can be a considerable benefit to the guild. If they are used as just another toon to mess around with, then that will end up creating problems.

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: pravi333


Another reason is the senior officers with 3 or more alts wanting to get all of there toons kara geared! theres like 4 senior officers in my guild that has literally 5 alts or more each and almost all of them in kara gear. This kind of trend is not going to help the guild in 25, because its not like they're dual or quad boxing there toons.

this part of your post made me chuckle, when i joined my current guild i was in a mix of t5/6 and crafted gear, there were people in the guild with alts that were my class with better gear then i had which i thought was funny

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Skilled players never travel alone or in unbalanced groups.

That'd make sense if WoW were actually a PVP game but it's not. The fact that you cannot level through PVP (don't even say "but you can do dailies!") shows that PVP isn't a full-fledged portion of the game but more of a side activity. Personally, I think you should get experience from PVP kills (similar to mob kills), but that's just me.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Of course, doing that all of the time cannot always be achieved by even the most skillful individual players because the other players on their team are less skillful and just do not cooperate or they are not even around such as the many ganking scenarios in world pvp.

I don't know what world you live in, but it ain't Azeroth (or Draenor). People don't group up on quests for the fear that someone's going to gank them. Also, if I'm a level 61 and a 70 decked out in S3 swoops in on their leet epix mount to kill me, how is having 3 other people really going to stop them?

Originally posted by: Xavier434
That's part of multiplayer PvP in any type of game though whether it be an MMO or FPS.

Except in a FPS I never have to deal with something like levels or gear... it's much more based around skill. I'm always annoyed at how fucked over I get in BGs simply because my gear is lacking and half of those clowns could never even get me to half health if I were in the same quality gear.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
There is little one can do about it except only play with select team members.

Or how about some real PVP? Objective-based PVP does nothing more than make a smart player realize ways to speed up the process to reach their goal. Like why would I try to win an AB (unless I knew we could) if I knew I could simply get 1 token every 2 minutes? I never fought at Tarren Mill vs Southshore battles to get gear... I fought because I was actually having fun.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
When it comes to BGs in WoW, the winners are supposed to be the strongest group with the best teamwork.

Except there's always a disparity between the actual better players and the winners because of simple factors like gear. Yet, what makes that silly is how you actually have to play to have competitive gear and it's not even like you're playing seriously, because that's not possible in your current state.

The pure nature of WoW itself is one thing that also screws up PVP. People in WoW don't give a rat's ass about each other. It's so easy to see this when you're questing and people would rather fight to tag a mob spawn rather than just group and everyone gets credit. People have no desire to work together because there's rarely ever a need to. That plus the horrible sense of entitlement that most WoW players have makes the game pretty damn unbearable at times. One guy made a remark in trade chat about playing the game his way because "I play for it." Congratulations, mister, so do the rest of us, so don't shit on our fucking game.

EDIT:

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
You didn't seriously type that out did you man? I would love to hear you explain why the 4 horseman, a 40 man raid boss, gives proof that you can't tune encounters between 25 and 10 man content? Obviously they will be changing the boss up for 25 man, now think of fighting them in different phases in 10 man, 2 at a time.

Who said anything about tuning? I'm talking about how going to a raid that uses less people doesn't necessarily help you learn the same encounter with more people. I'm not saying anything about these encounters being unable to be toned down. Although, the Four Horsemen will probably be the only fight in Naxx that won't be the same (that I can think of).

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
CCable in 10 man, not 25. Really, you aren't giving a challenge

Which changes the fight and that's my point. It's not the same thing and you don't necessarily have the same situation going from a 10 to 25 man raid. Especially since you'd really have to keep a good rotation on your Understudies to ensure you've got the right one's sheeped and letting the proper one be tanked to be used next where you just tanked them all (except the one tanking Razuvious) before.

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
To your general point- ever considered the people that don't plan on ever running 25 man content? You know, most people who play WoW?

No idea what you're trying to get at. The reason I even bring up their idea of limiting the 10-man versions is the fact that I think Blizzard is fucking up the entire purpose of having them in the first place. I look at the 10-man as the "casual" version of the same raid... not necessarily easier, but easier to form a 10-man squad than try to find 25 (which some guilds may experience having that trouble switching from 10 to 25 in TBC).

 

[Anubis]

Skilled players never travel alone or in unbalanced groups

shit i must be terrable then, because i always travel alone

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Aikouka
That'd make sense if WoW were actually a PVP game but it's not. The fact that you cannot level through PVP (don't even say "but you can do dailies!") shows that PVP isn't a full-fledged portion of the game but more of a side activity. Personally, I think you should get experience from PVP kills (similar to mob kills), but that's just me.

Experience would be worthless. Everyone would hit the "pvp level cap" in no time at all and then you would be back to square one.

Originally posted by: Aikouka
I don't know what world you live in, but it ain't Azeroth (or Draenor). People don't group up on quests for the fear that someone's going to gank them. Also, if I'm a level 61 and a 70 decked out in S3 swoops in on their leet epix mount to kill me, how is having 3 other people really going to stop them?

He chose to attack in a scenario where he would most likely win. I am sure there are other scenarios where you attack when you will most likely win. What's the issue? You are not supposed to be capable of winning in every possible scenario in this game. Now, whether you enjoy that or not is clearly up to you.

Originally posted by: Aikouka
Except in a FPS I never have to deal with something like levels or gear... it's much more based around skill. I'm always annoyed at how fucked over I get in BGs simply because my gear is lacking and half of those clowns could never even get me to half health if I were in the same quality gear.

Actually, there are FPS games which incorporate an XP like system such as Enemy Territory or Quake Wars. Doesn't TF2 also have a similar system? I thought it did but I have never played. The point is that PvP comes in a variety of flavors. Just because more than one flavor exists does not mean that it leans more to what you are describing as real PvP over the other. They are simply different and that is a great thing because that provides everyone with choices to play games which suit their interests the most. No one is forcing anyone to play a game that they do not enjoy playing.

Originally posted by: Aikouka
Or how about some real PVP? Objective-based PVP does nothing more than make a smart player realize ways to speed up the process to reach their goal. Like why would I try to win an AB (unless I knew we could) if I knew I could simply get 1 token every 2 minutes? I never fought at Tarren Mill vs Southshore battles to get gear... I fought because I was actually having fun.

You have every right to not enjoy objective based pvp. I believe the problem you are having is that the type of PvP in WoW that you enjoy the most tends to happen the least which is World PvP. Blizz does try to stimulate world PvP but there is only so much one can do unless they practically start from scratch with how the game works and particularly how it tries to incorporate the interests of all types of players. The rest is up to the players and it just so happens that there are limited numbers of servers where enough players really gather randomly in the world for some classic World PvP. Hopefully the new zone in WotLK will satisfy players that enjoy this kind of thing more such as you and I. It is supposed to incorporate more goals worth pursuing which is a point you made in an earlier post and I very much agree with it. None of that means that what they currently have in BGs and the Arena is not a genuine flavor of PvP though. You just don't like it very much which is fine. I am not a big fan either.

Originally posted by: Aikouka
Except there's always a disparity between the actual better players and the winners because of simple factors like gear. Yet, what makes that silly is how you actually have to play to have competitive gear and it's not even like you're playing seriously, because that's not possible in your current state.

The pure nature of WoW itself is one thing that also screws up PVP. People in WoW don't give a rat's ass about each other. It's so easy to see this when you're questing and people would rather fight to tag a mob spawn rather than just group and everyone gets credit. People have no desire to work together because there's rarely ever a need to. That plus the horrible sense of entitlement that most WoW players have makes the game pretty damn unbearable at times. One guy made a remark in trade chat about playing the game his way because "I play for it." Congratulations, mister, so do the rest of us, so don't shit on our fucking game.

You complain about how people feel entitled to play as individuals because they pay for it yet here you are talking as if you are entitled to force others to play how you want them to play just so that you can have more fun because you pay for it as well. Two sides on opposite ends of the spectrum. Both are equally as selfish and inconsiderate. However, only one is truly supporting freedom of game play and it is not your POV since the only true solution to your issue is to force other players to do something that they do not want to do. The truth is that both are given the opportunities and freedoms to do whatever they wish. The only issue is that you cannot do whatever you want whenever you want because certain opportunities may not always be available as a result of needing others to participate doing something your way. There is an answer that mostly solves this problem. That is, joining or starting a guild with common interests. Forcing the entire player base to play as team whenever an opportunity arises would destory WoW because too many players would not enjoy that lack of freedom. Players in WoW hate not being able to do what they want, but they hate being forced to do something that they do not want to do even more. You gotta pick the lesser of two evils. The choice is clear.

 

[lupi]

Saw a note on the forums that there are a couple pvp-pvp realm transfers up. Several of the source realms look like familiar attendees.


DKP for kara, ugh. The time added to the run for bidding after each oss there would be insane.



I was on the warrior in ashenvalle last name near BFD. Saw a human lock walk near me,a couple levels above mine, and just let him go figuring if he was competent it probably wouldn't end well and I generally give other lowbies a chance when I don't recognize the name. He didn't start anything and after a moment I didn't see him. So a couple minutes later just after I finish a mob I get hit with a SB. He had a huntard with him now so he was willing to fight. So I rez back up and follow them around. After a couple minutes I caught the lock at 1/3 health and charged. The hunter was near 100% but focused on the target that just died and didn't turn to look at me till his friend was going down. Nelf boy only had a staff and a bow for weapons so I put down a rend and hamstring and just wacked at him where he couldn't do much more than watch his pet nibble at me. Was a sweet victory as I was near constantly proccing overpower and kept spammimg it on him. If it wasn't for dinner being served I may have camped their higher level than me butts a couple times for fun.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Experience would be worthless. Everyone would hit the "pvp level cap" in no time at all and then you would be back to square one.

Uhh there would be no PVP level cap.. experience is experience. The only cap would be when you hit whatever the max level is (right now, it being 70). In other words, it lets people that enjoy PVP actually level that way and "make a living" doing PVP.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
He chose to attack in a scenario where he would most likely win. I am sure there are other scenarios where you attack when you will most likely win. What's the issue? You are not supposed to be capable of winning in every possible scenario in this game. Now, whether you enjoy that or not is clearly up to you.

I don't gank people. I also wouldn't choose to fight against someone that vastly outgears me. I enjoy a good fight, not one where I'm overpowered by someone that chooses to PVP more often than I do.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Actually, there are FPS games which incorporate an XP like system such as Enemy Territory or Quake Wars. Doesn't TF2 also have a similar system? I thought it did but I have never played. The point is that PvP comes in a variety of flavors. Just because more than one flavor exists does not mean that it leans more to what you are describing as real PvP over the other. They are simply different and that is a great thing because that provides everyone with choices to play games which suit their interests the most. No one is forcing anyone to play a game that they do not enjoy playing.

Yes, a few games chose a level-based system and quite a few do not. I've mostly played Quake and Unreal games in the past and they've always been very fun.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
You have every right to not enjoy objective based pvp.

Especially when it doesn't promote actually fighting. But don't get me wrong, I'm still not stupid. In AV, I don't fight with the opposing faction unless I have to. I'm not PVPing in AV, I am simply getting honor to reach the goal. When I fought in Hillsbrad Foothills, I was not PVPing for some piece of gear, I was PVPing to simply kill the Horde.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
I believe the problem you are having is that the type of PvP in WoW that you enjoy the most tends to happen the least which is World PvP.

Sometimes I like duels too. I just like getting the adrenaline rush you get when you know you had a good fight. Ganking some lowbie doesn't do shit for me... fighting undergeared noobs usually isn't fun unless it's multiple that actually promotes a challenge.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Blizz does try to stimulate world PvP but there is only so much one can do unless they practically start from scratch with how the game works and particularly how it tries to incorporate the interests of all types of players.

The problem is that there's no point to world PVP anymore. When I suggested experience for PVP, I don't mean that you get exp in battlegrounds... I mean only in non-instanced portions of the game. But going off of there being no point... I mean, I could do a stupid daily... whoop-de-doo, I could just go to Quel'Danas and do 10 dailies in maybe three times as much time as it takes to do those. I could ensure that I get spirit shards... which are mostly worthless unless you want the alright meta gem (which doesn't cost many spirit shards anyway).

Originally posted by: Xavier434
The rest is up to the players and it just so happens that there are limited numbers of servers where enough players really gather randomly in the world for some classic World PvP.

'Cause there's really no reason to anymore. I mean, the honor gain is so pitiful and it doesn't make you competitive in what Blizzard deems as "PVP."

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Hopefully the new zone in WotLK will satisfy players that enjoy this kind of thing more such as you and I.

I may find it fun for a bit, but I'm sure it will seem droll when the novelty wears off. I think it depends on how fun this new Starseige Tribes wanna-be will end up being. Tribes was a fun game, but then again, gear will still matter. Tribes did have a sense of gear when you chose what type of armor you wanted, but they all were balanced in terms of defense, mobility, allowed firepower, etc.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
You complain about how people feel entitled to play as individuals because they pay for it yet here you are talking as if you are entitled to force others to play how you want them to play just so that you can have more fun because you pay for it as well.

When do I tell people how to play the game? I'm merely expressing my opinion on the state of the game.

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Two sides on opposite ends of the spectrum. Both are equally as selfish and inconsiderate. However, only one is truly supporting freedom of game play and it is not your POV since the only true solution to your issue is to force other players to do something that they do not want to do.

Yeah, the people that spam trade chat with Thunderfury links because it's their $15 a month are really helping the game :roll:.

Believe it or not, but it's actually a super idea to learn how to play with others when to actually have success in end-game, you kind of have to play with other people :Q!!! I don't think that WoW should force everyone to group constantly (and I disliked that aspect in other games), but if you think that the logical choice for five people is to fight over mob spawns rather than to just group, then wow... I have nothing more to say.

The largest problem is that you're penalized too much for grouping up. For a kill quest, it's fine (which is largely what I'm talking about), but when a drop quest has drops that are not party lootable, it's a problem. Although, since I always play more than one character at a time, I'm very used to how things loot and my second character always seems to have better luck with loot than the first character to get all of his quest items did. Don't ask me why, but I literally spent 30 minutes getting Mana Remnants on my Shaman once and my Mage got four in a row :Q.

 

[Xavier434]

Well, one thing that we most certainly agree upon is that their needs to exist more goals that are difficult to obtain, are valuable and worth obtaining, and are fun to obtain when it comes to World PvP. I am really crossing my fingers that the new PvP zone will contribute a lot to that. Only time will tell.

In the end, most of our disagreements revolve around choice and freedom. There are many ways to play the game. There are many goals available to pursue in the game. Amongst the many ways to succeed in those goals there will be some which are much more effective than others. However, just because one way is more effective than another does not mean that way is also the most fun for everyone and that is what it is all about. People have different amounts of fun doing things in different ways. The freedom to choose how to do something in the game which is the most fun for you is an aspect of WoW which acts a cornerstone of its success. Of course, you cannot make everyone happy with every part of the game in that way. There will always be scenarios where the choice that one may wish to make in order to have the most fun succeeding with a goal either does not exist or is impossible. A simplified example would be the fact that it is impossible to solo Illidan. Another would be conflicting goals and how to reach them such as a case where one wishes to solo a quest and another wishes to group for a quest at the same time in the same place and neither wishes for the other person(s) to interfere with what they want to do at the time that they wish to do it.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Well, one thing that we most certainly agree upon is that their needs to exist more goals that are difficult to obtain, are valuable and worth obtaining, and are fun to obtain when it comes to World PvP. I am really crossing my fingers that the new PvP zone will contribute a lot to that. Only time will tell.

I'm really wary of thinking that it'll be fun if there's really any "monetary" goal. I mean, look at the old PVP... like I said, we didn't get items out of it... we didn't really get anything!

Originally posted by: Xavier434
In the end, most of our disagreements revolve around choice and freedom. There are many ways to play the game. There are many goals available to pursue in the game. Amongst the many ways to succeed in those goals there will be some which are much more effective than others. However, just because one way is more effective than another does not mean that way is also the most fun for everyone and that is what it is all about. People have different amounts of fun doing things in different ways. The freedom to choose how to do something in the game which is the most fun for you is an aspect of WoW which acts a cornerstone of its success. Of course, you cannot make everyone happy with every part of the game in that way. There will always be scenarios where the choice that one may wish to make in order to have the most fun succeeding with a goal either does not exist or is impossible. A simplified example would be the fact that it is impossible to solo Illidan. Another would be conflicting goals and how to reach them such as a case where one wishes to solo a quest and another wishes to group for a quest at the same time in the same place and neither wishes for the other person(s) to interfere with what they want to do at the time that they wish to do it.

Dood, I'm talking dailies and crap... they're not fun and you only do them for monies. Why not finish it quicker? But maybe I just expect too much out of others? It wouldn't surprise me since I seem to be a lot like my dad and he was always a pain with that.

In that situation, unless you have a reason to do it solo, just suck it up and stop being a baby about it. Usually, ya gotta remember that you're not playing alone and even though yes, you are paying to play, that sometimes you really should consider other people in your decisions. I think a lot of the times, problems in game and out of game come because people do not consider others in their decisions.

The only reason I'd want to solo something would be just the sheer fact of soloing it. But even with me talking about "solo partying" the Gronns, I still have no problem inviting people that actually need it. I can go up and solo them anytime, but hell... I know it can be a pain to find people for certain groups.

 

[Xavier434]

People have the right to play solo just as much as you have the right to to form a group. In the end, both of you have the opportunity to have a lot of fun. You do not have any more of a right to tell people to suck it up and play how you feel the game should be played any more than they have a right to tell you to suck it up and play it their way.

You argue that these people are not being considerate of others, but you need to ask yourself whether or not you are being considerate towards them. Are you being considerate towards their desire to play the game in the way that they have the most fun which may happen to be soloing? Why is their way being inconsiderate while your way is not? It doesn't matter which way gets "the job" done faster or more efficiently. What matters is having fun while doing it.

 

[Fingolfin269]

Originally posted by: Anubis

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269

Originally posted by: Dangerer
random based loot is how the game will always stay in my opinion. On my warrior, the first week I ran kara I picked up 4 tanking items in the same run. I've ran kara 3 additional times since then and haven't gotten a single piece of tank dropping. It's not like I'm being outrolled, it's not even dropping at all! Sitting at over a hundred badges now.

As DPS numbers i really hate the RNG. One night during RWC I pulled 1800 DPS as full fire without any fancy T6 gear. Checked wws, and crit rate was well over 50%. Next boss anetheron. I stood in one spot and spammed fireball the entire fight and was under 1200 dps. Check wws logs, and crit rate was 20%, 15% under my normal crit rate fully buffed w/ a shaman in the group.

We ran Kara for 4-6 months before either of the dps daggers dropped. Spiteblade dropped one time and went to a hunter because I had to log in my Pally for healing purposes. And we had no stinking badges!

you wanna talk about shitty RNG drop luck, here goes

ZA was released like Oct/Nov of '07
I have run ZA 2x a week EVERY week for 10 ish months now
# of times i have seen Hex Shrunken Head Drop = 1
when did it drop, something like 9 months ago

i really wouldent care if it droped and i just kept loseing the rolls for it but just not seeing it for 6+ months straight 2x a week is really really annoying

we pretty much only run ZA no to see if i can get my trinket, im the only one without it now i think, people alts have it from random Pug runs


I actually think ill have a DST for LOL Mele Lock before i get the Hex Head

This is why I was always for badge type drops but for the specific instance. I'm not a big fan of people farming kara and in 2 weeks having T5+ equivalent gear. But that's because I walked uphill both ways through Kara to get geared up for Gruuls/SSC.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
People have the right to play solo just as much as you have the right to to form a group. In the end, both of you have the opportunity to have a lot of fun. You do not have any more of a right to tell people to suck it up and play how you feel the game should be played any more than they have a right to tell you to suck it up and play it their way.

You argue that these people are not being considerate of others, but you need to ask yourself whether or not you are being considerate towards them. Are you being considerate towards their desire to play the game in the way that they have the most fun which may happen to be soloing? Why is their way being inconsiderate while your way is not? It doesn't matter which way gets "the job" done faster or more efficiently. What matters is having fun while doing it.

Why in God's name are you preaching at me like you love to do so much? I don't give a shit how someone else plays unless it directly affects me. It's quite hard to miss how in some situations it's advantageous for everyone to group up. I actually prefer playing alone because I hate playing with shitty players, but if I'm trying to kill something that's a single spawn and someone else comes along and is looking for the same thing... what does it honestly hurt to toss an invite? Nothing. The people that don't are just self-centered.

Yet again, you're missing the point like Michael J. Fox in target practice. You're going on some preachy mission to try to point out "me not being considerate" where yet again, I never force anyone to do anything. Kill stealing is not being considerate... you ever have that happen? I get it at least once a day and worst off, I tend to get the super asshole douche bags that make sure to do it just right so I have aggro on the mob and it's not like I can polymorph the mob because I didn't tag it ~_~.

But you know what makes that the worst? If they'd just quit trying to be a douchebag for a minute and say "hai2u, let's group" they wouldn't have to pull out asshole tactics. I remember one warrior tried to do this to me and I stopped the cast in time then I laughed at him and derided him when he almost died .

Also, it seems you missed the point that dailies are not fun. They are simply a way of getting money. I play two characters at once to get money faster. Sure, I could play one at a time, but that would simply be dumb... especially with how easy it is.

Fact of the matter is, I'm probably the most considerate player you'll ever meet in WoW. I'm also the most fair, which may make some think I'm not exactly nice, but fuck them. For example, I do not donate to the guild bank as I never use it. Why should I donate so cheap fucks can get free repairs when I do dailies to support my repairs? Fuck them! If they say, "well, I'm a hooooly priest, therefore I can't do it." That's 100% bullshit. My holy priest may group with my warrior, but he regularly kills things by himself... like when doing the Darkspine Ore quests, I typically send him out on his own after my warrior attacks a target. With the change a couple patches ago giving healing gear +damage... it's simply silly. There are plenty of examples, but with me acting in a way that I'd like to have done unto me (and such rarely happens... which is usually the source of my anger, but oh well).

 

[BenSkywalker]

what does it honestly hurt to toss an invite? Nothing. The people that don't are just self-centered.

I wouldn't say self-centered, I'd say allies. Isn't the allies motto 'For me'? It's how they play in almost all aspects of the game.

I think a lot of the times, problems in game and out of game come because people do not consider others in their decisions.

Roll Horde.

Which changes the fight and that's my point. It's not the same thing and you don't necessarily have the same situation going from a 10 to 25 man raid.

How is that, in any way, different between heroic and non heroic?

No idea what you're trying to get at. The reason I even bring up their idea of limiting the 10-man versions is the fact that I think Blizzard is fucking up the entire purpose of having them in the first place. I look at the 10-man as the "casual" version of the same raid... not necessarily easier, but easier to form a 10-man squad than try to find 25 (which some guilds may experience having that trouble switching from 10 to 25 in TBC).

You are elitist and don't want others to be able to enjoy content, you can just come out and say it Blizz is scaling the gear to compensate for the difference in challenge, is it really that much of an issue if others get to enjoy more of the game?

 

[Anubis]

You are elitist and don't want others to be able to enjoy content, you can just come out and say it Blizz is scaling the gear to compensate for the difference in challenge, is it really that much of an issue if others get to enjoy more of the game?

YES screw them thar casuals


seriously tho i have no issues with people that play casually, i did for a while, i have issues with bliss catering to people that are BEYOND FUCKING HORRIABLE AT THIS GAME

its really not that hard yet the majority of players totally fucking suck at it, and because of that blizz caters to them

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
I wouldn't say self-centered, I'd say allies. Isn't the allies motto 'For me'? It's how they play in almost all aspects of the game.

It really isn't much better on the Horde side of things =\. Although, I do think there are more idiots on the alliance side than there are on the Horde side. I just wish we could get rid of all those stupid people that spam trade and crap. I need to see if somebodies needs mah enchantin'! :Q

But talking about tradeskills... I really hate Prospecting. Not only did Blizzard screw us over with removing green gems from veins (which they're undoing in 2.4.3)... they have it so the blue gem drop is so horrible. I seriously prospected around 12+ stacks of Adamantite and received maybe 5-6 blue gems? Two of those were worthless Talasites, so we won't even count those. Maybe I should start selling my green gems before 2.4.3 comes out and they start dropping in price?

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
Roll Horde.

I already have a 70 Undead Rogue that I never play.

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
How is that, in any way, different between heroic and non heroic?

Are you trying to confuse a poh and tired ol' man here .

Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
You are elitist and don't want others to be able to enjoy content, you can just come out and say it Blizz is scaling the gear to compensate for the difference in challenge, is it really that much of an issue if others get to enjoy more of the game?

Now I think you're really tryin' to confuse poh lil' ol' me . I'm advocating not blocking the 10 man versions of raids (until someone beats the 25 or whatever they may decide on) because I don't think they serve as a good learning tool.

Although I'm not sure even 10 mans could really help the guild I'm in... their new start-up kara group couldn't even beat Attumen for Pete's sake! I remember how the original Kara group couldn't beat Attumen for awhile either.

 

[Xavier434]

Aikouka, I know I was harsh, but I really did not mean for you to take anything too personally. Based upon what you are saying and what I am arguing, my best guess is that we are much more on the same page than we realize, but it is probably going to be many posts until we come to that conclusion. Therefore, in hopes of this flame war ceasing, I am just going to stop here with my argument.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
Aikouka, I know I was harsh, but I really did not mean for you to take anything too personally. Based upon what you are saying and what I am arguing, my best guess is that we are much more on the same page than we realize, but it is probably going to be many posts until we come to that conclusion. Therefore, in hopes of this flame war ceasing, I am just going to stop here with my argument.

You're giving me something to do, so don't feel too bad . Essentially, in a MMO the idea is to be social... if you want to be antisocial, just go play Final Fantasy, Morrowind or whatever. It doesn't mean you always have to be with others, but hell... when it's advantageous to everyone, why not? On Quel'Danas, it's not like there are super awesome drops that you'd have to be worried about losing (especially since scryer's rep items are so cheap anymore). In a game like this, you really cannot be too self-centered. I mean for example, I could've taken a drop in Karazhan the other day on my priest. It was a very minor upgrade in my opinion and the one druid expressed some interest in it ( he had a healing staff and this was an off-hand, so he obviously couldn't use it yet ). So I just let him have it. If it drops again, maybe I'll try for it, but it doesn't mean that much to me. Only negative thing would have been if the mace dropped off prince and I lost it to him now that he had more of a reason to get it :laugh:.

Oh and 'nubis, as much as bad players are still terribad, 10 mans are just easier to gather people for. You can still have good people do 10 mans .

Speaking of Terribad, I had this hunter in my Mech group the other day (and I probably mentioned this once.. but since I'm so old I forget ). The guy wanted the cloak from the cache of the legion... which I will remind you is a flat stat cloak (agil, str, stam). I just kinda thought, "whatever... maybe his current cloak is utter garbage. In that case he should do the egg quest in Nagrand, but whatever." Then we kill Sepethrea and the throwing weapon drops... he's like, "can I have that?" At this point I just ask, "why would a hunter want a throwing weapon!?" Felt kinda bad when he won the Abacus off Panthaleon when the Shaman seemed like she had been trying to get it for awhile (especially since he technically already won something). I never really looked, but I think he was PVP geared too =\. Just like in real life... sometimes welfare is good and most of the time it's abused.

 

[Soccerman06]

Just got Sunflare /dance and a shitty badge Offhand.

Iccy

 

[Dangerer]

grats, fetish sure as hell went a loooooong way for you.

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: Dangerer
grats, fetish sure as hell went a loooooong way for you.

lol i still have mine and my Orb lol

Chronicle was a myth for our guild, when i get sunflare ill be useing Fetish as well

one of our SPs just picked up the mace from Brut, hes useing it with Orb, lol

 

[Aikouka]

Hmm I keep seeing an advert of this one guild looking for a "spirit priest" (I find that an amusing thing... a holy priest can just alter their build regardless... but anyway) for T5 content... now being that my guild can only manage Gruul at the most (and very rarely do they ever get a run off), I might try and go for it. Just not sure if I feel like getting into the "second job" again =\.

Also I'm working on epic'ing out some of my characters. No real reason why as I mentioned I don't know if I really want to get back into the swing of things. I decided that I would just get spellstrike for my mage and I'll also try and ready a set for my warlock (67 at the moment).

So my current goals are...

- Get Warlock and Paladin to 70
- Get Epic Flying for Shaman (about 200g off)
- Max out enchanting on priest (359 at the moment... kinda want 360)
- Get Spellstrike for Mage (maybe Warlock) and "enchant" it up
- Finish getting the desired (chest, legs and weapons) PVP gear on warrior (only decent source of plate dps gear)
- Get Cenarion Expedition revered on warrior.
- Get Kara keyed on warrior (he's been arms.. no one wants a shitty arms warrior... I've tried to get him in after Murmur and stuff, but people just ignore the nice healer).
- Get Rogue's Leatherworking to 375
- Get some of the (the mob-specific drops) recipes that I'm missing in Alchemy, Engineering, Jewelcrafting and Enchanting.

I'm kinda also deciding between certain crafted gear and just waiting out getting set pieces on my Shaman. Storm Helm and Cobrascale Hood are the two crafted pieces.... Storm Helm has MP5 which shamans don't need but provides 3 gem slots (which I'd throw some +crit/+str gems into). Hmm I think even based on some rough calculations, Cobrascale is by better even without gem slots (which means I can save those gems for something else). Although when gemmed, the T4 helm is kinda equal to Cobrascale as the AP and crit will be a little higher, but Cobrascale has +hit, which isn't as useful for a Shaman, but certainly isn't worthless. Although, I do like the T4 set bonuses... they actually seem a lot more useful than most set bonuses do :laugh:.

 

[Soccerman06]

Originally posted by: Dangerer
grats, fetish sure as hell went a loooooong way for you.

Lol actually I've been using Zar'Doom but I finally got Sunflare and this is the best OH I could get. We don't run Hyjal no more so I'll either have to pug 10 people from my guild or buy it from another guild that clears it every week. I would use the one off Brutallus but I just don't have it and I'll need the hit over the haste eventually.

BTW I believe my guild is considering selling Brutallus gear, so If anyone is on Greymane and is looking for T6 belts, Well be happy to take your monies.

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: Soccerman06

Originally posted by: Dangerer
grats, fetish sure as hell went a loooooong way for you.

Lol actually I've been using Zar'Doom but I finally got Sunflare and this is the best OH I could get. We don't run Hyjal no more so I'll either have to pug 10 people from my guild or buy it from another guild that clears it every week. I would use the one off Brutallus but I just don't have it and I'll need the hit over the haste eventually.

BTW I believe my guild is considering selling Brutallus gear, so If anyone is on Greymane and is looking for T6 belts, Well be happy to take your monies.

lol we are to the point where no one needs main spec T6 anything from Sunwell, its kinda sad when T6 belts and boots go for PVP items turnins

recruits seem to like picking up 4 T6 parts in 1 night however because no one needs anything,

we also started running a Hyjal on a non raid night like the weekend for alts/friends/puggers pretty much only for Chronicle for main raiders because it never wanted to drop

Just like we still do weekly Gruuls for DST

 

[sourceninja]

I"m back playing again on etrigg. I'm a level 60 horde shammy. Looking for a fun guild to group with and hang out. Characters name is Rathmar.