The AT Battlefield 4 F.A.Q., News, and Discussion thread

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DeadFred

Platinum Member
Jun 4, 2011
2,740
29
91
Is this tickrate business actually a big deal? If so, how the hell could they have neglected it this bad?
I wonder if this "netcode" stuff is affecting everyone or just certain players, or if perhaps its my play style that causes me to not really notice, I mainly run and gun and will only sit and hold (camp) for only as long as people are dumb enough to keep coming to me. :D

Granted Im no networking wizard and honestly I have never heard mention of tick rates before this game, but Im pretty tuned in to lag when Im playing and I certainly havent seen all the issues some are describing. Of course I have my "WTF!?!?! just happened there?" moments but those occur in every online game Ive played.
 

hondaf17

Senior member
Sep 25, 2005
757
6
81
NEVER!!!!

I actually tried going back to BC2 after getting somewhat bored of BF3 just before BF4 released, but it looked and felt horrible. The awkwardness of character movement always kept me from really getting in the earlier Battlefield games, coming from Quake 3 Arena and CoD4 they just felt too clunky and slow. I sure liked some of BC2's maps though.

Im guessing PS2 is Planetside 2? I havent played that one, mainly because it looks like it has a lot of MMO type of stuff going on in it, and MMO's just arent my thing.

Yeah, PS2 is Planetside 2. Really fun, IMO. The teamwork/squad play is just so much better. Squads of 12 and platoons of 48 make it really fun when you're with a bunch of guys playing together and using teamwork.
 

VenBaja

Member
Dec 7, 2013
51
0
0
I wonder if this "netcode" stuff is affecting everyone or just certain players, or if perhaps its my play style that causes me to not really notice, I mainly run and gun and will only sit and hold (camp) for only as long as people are dumb enough to keep coming to me. :D

Granted Im no networking wizard and honestly I have never heard mention of tick rates before this game, but Im pretty tuned in to lag when Im playing and I certainly havent seen all the issues some are describing. Of course I have my "WTF!?!?! just happened there?" moments but those occur in every online game Ive played.

Yeah it affects everyone. It's actually coded into the game itself, so it has nothing to do with an individual's network connectivity. Basically, the time it takes for the server to get information from you (about things like: where you are, what you're doing etc...) and relay to everyone else, and then get their information and relay it to you, is very long as compared to other games. It's like they built high latency into the game. It's as if the baseline ping rate is 100-200 milliseconds, and then whatever latency you and the other players have is layered on top of that.

If you've ever played BF3 online at say...200 ping, that's pretty much what every round of BF4 is like because of the netcode. Now, games are designed to predict certain things, but it's never anywhere near perfect, and feels significantly worse than just having a low tickrate and low latency.
 
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Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,644
10
81
Turn off FOV scaling for ADS in video settings. This allows you to use a wide FOV, but still get a good zoom while ADS.
Can't believe I had this turned on since... forever? It's taking getting used to but it's obviously a beneficial setting.
 

UaVaj

Golden Member
Nov 16, 2012
1,546
0
76
a higher tick rate will eat up more cpu cycle needing more ipc. that means both the server and client side will need better hardware.

by upping the tick rate. the minimum cpu recommendation will have to increase. also the console will lag more with their fixed cpu. the server will have to be that much faster too.
 

moonbogg

Lifer
Jan 8, 2011
10,637
3,095
136
Used scout elite on hardcore sniper only TDM server. Worked out quite well for the closer fighting.
 

DeadFred

Platinum Member
Jun 4, 2011
2,740
29
91
BF3 had the same 10hz tickrate according to DICE.
Well that would explain why I see and feel no difference between the two games as far as networking goes. And since they are pretty much the only games I have played for the past two and a half years, it also explains why Im not noticing anything out of the ordinary.

If you've ever played BF3 online at say...200 ping, that's pretty much what every round of BF4 is like because of the netcode. Now, games are designed to predict certain things, but it's never anywhere near perfect, and feels significantly worse than just having a low tickrate and low latency.

As Ive posted in this and the BF3 thread, I have purposely searched out 150-250ms ping servers to give myself that high ping advantage in both games. Its probably that low tickrate that causes the high ping advantage to begin with, Id love to see it fixed so lower pings would have the rightful advantage they deserve.
 

DeadFred

Platinum Member
Jun 4, 2011
2,740
29
91
Used scout elite on hardcore sniper only TDM server. Worked out quite well for the closer fighting.
Everything works better on HC, one hit kills FTW!!!! :D

Except maybe Obliteration.....you dont want to be carrying a bomb that equals a big orange target on your back in a HC server. LOL
 

DeadFred

Platinum Member
Jun 4, 2011
2,740
29
91
A new 824MB update is out. The TDM no sound bug is back with the update :rolleyes:. They are aware of the problem though.

The change log is large so here is the link. http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf4/forum/threadview/2955065226155386316/
Ugh, I hate that bug.

March 4 PC Game Update Notes
-Several crash fixes and stability improvements
-Fixed an issue with data re-sending that was causing rubber banding on some servers
-Increased the maximum rank to 120
-Fixed an issue with the kill camera triggering before game client would display the last portion of damage being dealt, giving players the impression that they died too early
-Fixed issue with blood effects, damage indicators, and health bar updates in the HUD being out of sync. This issue meant that players would sometimes miss information about being shot at, or get the impression of too few hits occurring for the amount of bullets that hit.
-Tweaked the speed, dispersion, and re-arm duration of the IFV and MBT projectiles
-Tweaked timing for how long the kill feed stays on screen
-Fixed an issue where the message "Joining Server" sometimes didn't appear when the user tried to join the server
-Added default player slots to server browser filters
-Fix for an issue on Silk Road where players could deform the terrain to create a big, water-filled hole
-Fix for a bug that occurred with the end-of-round camera if the player was in the bomber in China Rising
-Fix for an issue on Rogue Transmission where it was impossible to capture a flag while riding the quad bike
-Prevented players from interacting with an M-COM on Siege of Shanghai after it had been destroyed
-Fixed an issue where audio for disarming M-COMs could get stuck in an infinite loop
-Added minimap details for missing carriers in Rush on Paracel Storm and Hainan Resort
-Fix for an exploit that would allow players to shoot two tank shells with not enough delay between shots
-Removed a bug where squads would get split up when transitioning between Conquest and Air Superiority
-Fixed an issue where Defuse could get stuck in an unplayable state between rounds
-Removed a bug that would cause players to sometimes get stuck in the killcam after having been killed
-Fixed an issue with revive icon not being grayed out in-game on map and minimap, when the player died after getting revived in Defuse
-General improvements and bug fixes for the Battledash and Mission create screens
-Fixed a bug where red laser dots would get stuck on textures
-Zoom dispersion fix. When zooming in while firing the dispersion did not lower to the new max value
-Fixed a bug where the enemy health always displayed as full in the kill-cam
-Fixed an issue in Defuse so killed bomb carrier can’t plant a bomb in the next round without picking up a new bomb
-The MAV has been updated to prevent players from exploiting it
-Improved repair rates for vehicles with different base healths
-Tweaked volume balance and other ambiance parameters on the majority of base game and China Rising maps
-Improved the track vehicles wheel friction so vehicles don’t get stuck at relatively minor hills
-Fixed an issue with faulty zoom levels that occurred when using click to zoom in. While sprinting and zooming, will mess up the zoom levels, from hip to zoom.
-Improved boat physics and handling, including implementation of a system that lets players push stuck boats back in the water

SPECTATOR MODE
-Fix for the EMP/Proxy Attack effects being visible in Spectator Mode
-Removed the black screen that was visible when switching between cameras and players in Spectator Mode
-Removed squad colors in Spectator Mode, now only the red and blue team colors are visible
-Decreased the user interface clutter in Spectator Mode by removing health pack, ammo pack and revive icons
-Tweaked the 1st person view in Spectator Mode so that spectators now see exactly what players see and nothing else
-Added a functionality in Spectator Mode so that, when going into Freecam from 1st or 3rd person mode, the first static freecam will be moved to behind the previously spectated player
-Added the possibility in Spectator Mode to ‘fire’ at a player from Freecam to go into 1st person view of that player
-Spectators can now see which player on the scoreboard that carries the bomb in the Obliteration and Defuse game modes

NOTE: For in-depth details on all the balancing tweaks below, head to our "Balancing BF4" articles [blogs.battlefield.com].

GRENADE TWEAKS
-Increased the number of M84 FLASHBANG and HAND FLARES the player can carry from 2 to 3.
-Increased the effect of M84 FLASHBANG grenades on friendly and enemy players.
-Increased the maximum damage for the RGO from 67 to 80, however reduced the range of explosion.
-Reduced the visual and audio effect for the detonation of the V40 Mini to highlight its smaller blast when compared to other grenades. Decreased the maximum damage from 80 to 60, and decreased the range at which maximum damage is applied.

PISTOL TWEAKS
-Increased the aimed accuracy of the M1911 to make it a viable choice once the COMPACT 45 has been unlocked.
-Increased the close range damage of the M1911, QSZ-92, FN57, CZ-75 and COMPACT 45.
-Reduced the delay between pressing the trigger and the bullet firing for the M412 REX and .44 MAGNUM.
-Increased the magazine capacity of the QSZ-92 to 20 rounds. Additionally reduced the recoil of the QSZ-92 to give it a clear difference from the FN57.
-Corrected a small error with the COMPACT 45 accuracy when crouched or prone.

WEAPON TWEAKS
-Increased the damage of all DMRs across all ranges. Additionally, reduced the penalty to accuracy for sustained DMR fire, allowing more rapid follow up shots in combat. We will continue to monitor the effectiveness of DMRs in combat, and determine if additional action is needed to make DMRs a viable mid to long range weapon.
-Increased the accuracy of pump action shotguns (870 MCS, HAWK 12g, SPAS-12, and UTS 15) while on the move and aiming.
-Reduced the long range damage of the MTAR to bring it in line with the rest of the Carbines.
-Adjusted the way inaccuracy is handled when transitioning from Hip fire to Aimed fire.
-The Heavy Barrel’s Accuracy bonus now also applies on the move, at a reduced bonus. This should give the Heavy Barrel a wider role for players who desire accuracy while aimed in all situations.
-Synchronized the timing of the aim down the sights animation of sniper rifles with their ability to fire with full accuracy. Players no longer need to wait for additional time after the aiming animation plays to get accurate shots. There is still a delay to achieve full accuracy, so Quick Scoping is still not possible.
-The SRS bolt action time has been tweaked and the rate of fire has been lowered
-The GOL bolt action time has been tweaked
-The muzzle velocity for the MP7 has been reduced
-The MTAR21 muzzle velocity has been reduced
-Updated the handling of the 1x scopes for Type95B1, A91, SteyrAug, SAR21, QBZ951, FAMAS, UTAS, MTAR, L85A2, and F2000
-Updated rate of fire for the RGP7 and NLAW

VEHICLE TWEAKS
-Reduced the total amount of missiles carried by the Mobile Anti-Aircraft vehicles from 6 to 4.
-Reduced the velocity of the MAA’s default 20MM CANNON from 1200m/s to 800m/s to match the 30MM CANNON.
-Reduced the physical impact of all Anti-Aircraft missiles to prevent helicopters from flipping uncontrollably when hit. The damage values have not been changed.
-Reduced the cone in which ACTIVE RADAR missiles search for targets, making them require a higher level of skill in predicting where a target will be when the missile is fired.
-Increased the direct damage done by the Attack Helicopter’s gunner cannon. The gunner will be better able to assist the pilot in taking down vehicle targets with this change.
-Increased the direct hit damage of the Zuni Rockets for Attack Helicopters. The rate of fire of these rockets combined with their smaller magazine pool made them a poor choice over the other two rocket types.
-Reduced the splash damage and maximum splash damage range of the Scout Helicopter 25MM CANNONS.
-Reduced the “intelligence” of the MBT LAW missiles, requiring the player to aim the missile closer to their target before the smart projectile will activate. Additionally, the MBT LAW now reloads slightly slower. Finally, a bug where the MBT LAW would pass through an ACTIVE PROTECTION shield has been fixed.
-Fixed an issue where ACTIVE PROTECTION and the MP-APS did not properly stop 12G FRAG rounds.
-Reduced the range where the M2 SLAM will do maximum damage to vehicles from 6M to 3M. The range was deemed to be too large, making the M2 SLAM far superior to the M15 AT MINE.
-Reduced the damage the STAFF shell does to all targets by 25%. This should balance the ease of use of the STAFF shell with its damage potential.

10 more ranks??? :rolleyes:
DMR's have been buffed yet again. :thumbsdown:
More flashbangs and flares. :thumbsdown::thumbsdown::thumbsdown:
Staff shell damage lowered. :thumbsup:
Bolt snipers will be able to be fired accurately faster. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Biggest issue I have and dont see a fix for is the one where buildings and walls cannot be shot through even after they have been leveled.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,820
954
126
Anyone ever get dropped from the C130? I'll be having a great gun run and all of a sudden I'm falling. Plane is fine

Had this happen last night on Firestorm. I thought maybe I had hit E instead of R but I was in the first seat so no need to reload. Had a round on the way and got a tank kill while I was falling.
 

Termie

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
7,949
48
91
www.techbuyersguru.com
Coolest tweak in that patch is being able to push boats back into the water. I've grounded the patrol boat too many times (to my teammates' chagrin) on Paracel due to underwater debris and the big waves.

Also, I can finally use a tank again, now that the the sabot/staff exploit is fixed. Getting a jump on a tank with the first shot only to be destroyed 5 seconds later was not fun.
 

darkewaffle

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2005
8,152
1
81
-Reduced the visual and audio effect for the detonation of the V40 Mini to highlight its smaller blast when compared to other grenades. Decreased the maximum damage from 80 to 60, and decreased the range at which maximum damage is applied.

Yay!

-Increased the damage of all DMRs across all ranges. Additionally, reduced the penalty to accuracy for sustained DMR fire, allowing more rapid follow up shots in combat. We will continue to monitor the effectiveness of DMRs in combat, and determine if additional action is needed to make DMRs a viable mid to long range weapon.
-Increased the accuracy of pump action shotguns (870 MCS, HAWK 12g, SPAS-12, and UTS 15) while on the move and aiming.

Why would you do such a thing :(
 

DeadFred

Platinum Member
Jun 4, 2011
2,740
29
91
Played a few rounds and along with the TDM sound bug, now we dont get to see our killer's tags or info after a death. Annoying because I kinda liked knowing who killed me and with what. LOL
 

moonbogg

Lifer
Jan 8, 2011
10,637
3,095
136
Ugh, I hate that bug.



10 more ranks??? :rolleyes:
DMR's have been buffed yet again. :thumbsdown:
More flashbangs and flares. :thumbsdown::thumbsdown::thumbsdown:
Staff shell damage lowered. :thumbsup:
Bolt snipers will be able to be fired accurately faster. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Biggest issue I have and dont see a fix for is the one where buildings and walls cannot be shot through even after they have been leveled.

I can't believe how frustrating this has been for me. Get the drop on a guy, aim down sight, pull trigger and the damn bullet wizzes way off to the upper left of the target, like WAY off crosshair. Hope its actually greatly reduced or fixed. Sounds like they let us actually fire the gun while we still had hip fire accuracy, and that's what it seemed like.
 

Tripwir3

Member
Feb 17, 2011
44
0
0
What does this line even mean?

-Tweaked volume balance and other ambiance parameters on the majority of base game and China Rising maps.

PS - Gotta love the very late hit markers while using mortar. Still not fixed.
 

AznAnarchy99

Lifer
Dec 6, 2004
14,695
117
106
I can't believe how frustrating this has been for me. Get the drop on a guy, aim down sight, pull trigger and the damn bullet wizzes way off to the upper left of the target, like WAY off crosshair. Hope its actually greatly reduced or fixed. Sounds like they let us actually fire the gun while we still had hip fire accuracy, and that's what it seemed like.

I know. Im used to the CS style awping and I hate the fact that the bullet would be no where near the crosshairs.

What's wrong with more ranks? It doesn't give you any extra perks. Im glad how they made weapon unlocks separate from ranks.
 

balloonshark

Diamond Member
Jun 5, 2008
6,601
3,086
136
Played a few rounds and along with the TDM sound bug, now we dont get to see our killer's tags or info after a death. Annoying because I kinda liked knowing who killed me and with what. LOL
The sound doesn't even come back on TDM after your first round is over. This makes TDM unplayable IMHO.

When they were making changes to the nades I wonder why didn't they nerf the lvgs?

Also, all the shotguns need fixed. I can't tell you how many times I have unloaded 5 rounds within 10 feet of someone only to have the kill me.

What do you all think of the DMR buff? I was on the wrong end of a DMR a couple times today and didn't last long. I may need to start using them.
 

balloonshark

Diamond Member
Jun 5, 2008
6,601
3,086
136
Coolest tweak in that patch is being able to push boats back into the water. I've grounded the patrol boat too many times (to my teammates' chagrin) on Paracel due to underwater debris and the big waves.
This is a good idea. I wonder how well it works?
 

darkewaffle

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2005
8,152
1
81
Yeah it affects everyone. It's actually coded into the game itself, so it has nothing to do with an individual's network connectivity. Basically, the time it takes for the server to get information from you (about things like: where you are, what you're doing etc...) and relay to everyone else, and then get their information and relay it to you, is very long as compared to other games. It's like they built high latency into the game. It's as if the baseline ping rate is 100-200 milliseconds, and then whatever latency you and the other players have is layered on top of that.

Tick rate (aka polling rate) has nothing to do with "the time it takes for the server to get information from you". It's a measure of how often information is relayed to the server: we're talking frequency, not latency.

Additionally, 10hz tick is not the same as "everything has an additional 100ms latency". Imagine you were looking at a window that every closed 100ms (for the sake of argument it doesn't need to 'open' again before closing :p) - if you wanted to stick your hand in there without getting your fingers crushed, how much time would you have to do so? You could have as much as 100ms, or as little as a single ms depending on the state of the window. The tick rate functions the same way, if you click your mouse at exactly the same time as the proverbial 'window' starts to close, then yes it may take up to 100ms before that information begins to be transmitted to the server, but at the same time if you fire just as the window is about to close, that data will be sent to the server almost instantly.

Basically what a tick rate of 10hz means is that every 10th of a second (every 100ms; for comparison, a blink of an eye typically takes 300-400ms) your client builds a packet to be sent to the server telling the server "what you are doing" essentially. How you moved, whether you switched guns, whether you threw a grenade, how many bullets you fired, what you hit, where you hit - everything. And all these things are individual, and probably fairly complex calculations/simulations.

So once all that is calculated that snapshot of action is relayed to the server. So you can essentially imagine it as though every second of gameplay is actually ten windows. Everything that you do in that window is 'bundled up' sent to the server, and then the server processes this information to reconcile it into the 'world' essentially. The server updates the 'world' 30 times every second (30 hz) [keep in mind packets from clients are going to be staggered in their arrival because of both latency and each client keeping an independent timer for their tick rate (presumably) despite them having the same tick rate] and then relays this to the client. The client then does the same thing the server does - takes the data from the server, reconciles it with the 'world' (eg: the server tells the client that tree X is no longer standing, that wall Y has a hole in it, that player Z is now dead on the floor, etc) and renders this new information. I'm not sure whether the data received from the server would be accounted for in realtime or if it would be updated at the 'close of a window' or not however - I think it would depend on how BF4 has structured it's "order of operations" as it were.

This CS resource site has a solid explanation of tick rate for further reading, as well as covers some more network related factors.

One interesting thing on that page is that it advises against CS servers running higher than 66hz tick rate if more than 20 people are playing. CS is also a markedly less complex and smaller scale game (admittedly the page was likely written relative to less powerful hardware) but still gives some idea of scaling.

Additionally, a PS2 thread which has some insightful comments on Tick Rate, server/client hit detection, and is much more reasonable than any BF4 discussion lol. Particularly the second to last post.
 

CropDuster

Senior member
Jan 2, 2014
371
54
91
DMRs were already pretty OP on HC IMO, can't believe they've buffed them again. I'm glad the staff shell and MBT LAW are getting nerfed, they are both pretty lame.
 

VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,188
2
76
Netcode seems horrificly bad now after the patch. I'm being killed by guys who are underneath me on the first floor of a building and I"m on the roof/3rd floor.

Another thing I saw, guy was on the end of a container and I got hit from the only visible corner. No one there, so I go around the other side. His character is there not moving I shoot him, he dies, and the body teleports to the other side where I got shot from originally.
 

CropDuster

Senior member
Jan 2, 2014
371
54
91
Netcode seems horrificly bad now after the patch. I'm being killed by guys who are underneath me on the first floor of a building and I"m on the roof/3rd floor.

Another thing I saw, guy was on the end of a container and I got hit from the only visible corner. No one there, so I go around the other side. His character is there not moving I shoot him, he dies, and the body teleports to the other side where I got shot from originally.

I saw a post on reddit that supposedly the killcam is bugged. Maybe that's your first issue?