Thanks, suckers

[sandorski]

The problem is the core concept of complaint- that the system is unsustainable. It only works now due to massive deficits, which only hold because the petrodollar is the world's reserve currency.

When that changes, and it will in my lifetime, then those benefits will go away. I will pay in and get an IOU.

Only if it's not fixed before hand. The problem is that one side of the argument would rather it die. Not because it's too costly, but because they hate the concept of it to begin with.

 

[ivwshane]

I know it's already been said but anyone who thinks that



is a moron. While his point about failing to exceed the baby boomer generation is likely true this has remarkably little to do with obama and a lot more to do with our financial and trade policies for the last ~40(?) years.

Incidentally which generation has been in control the last 40 years? Yep, the worst generation ever, aka the baby boomer generation.

 

[Screech]

Some words and phrases have wisdom in them that should be universal to all. You are angry not with the author, what he is saying, or how he is "conflating two disparate topics".
You are angry at the world you were born into. You've got a lot of company. Both now and through the ages. You can't change the past and neither could those before you.

I said it in my original post. Elections have consequences. Our choices typically suck. But it's important to understand when one is being wined and dined. If anyone understands that last sentence in the context of what is happening today as a result of reading this guy's article well my posting it was not a waste.

Haha, I imagine you don't know me particularly well. I was merely being realistic and would hardly call myself angry. I do find irony in that the author probably contributed far more in his voting choices toward that situation than 'young people voting for obama' have.

As far as obamacare itself, I'm honestly ambivalent on the issue. If it leads to single payer, fine. If it stays the way it is, fine. If it gets modified, fine. As long as the no preexisiting conditions thing stays in place, I really don't have a significant preference. I guess that makes me a communist.

 

[Moonbeam]

Thanks suckers is the kind of comment a self hating egotist makes to suggest to himself that others and not he are suckers, the kind of words you get, in other words, from people suffering from self hate. They aren't actually suckers but it's exactly how they feel and why they want others to feel the pain they won't admit into consciousness.

 

[rudder]

He has a point. Republican contention against Obamacare is that it forces the young and healthy to subsidize insurance costs for older people who typically need more health care than young people (that's clearly the tone of this article). But what's the alternative? Require old people to pay vastly more for health coverage? Makes sense, it's fair, they're the ones who are using it; but what about the people who can't afford it? What is the Republican plan for dealing with a recently retired bus driver who has cancer and can't afford coverage? Do we let him die?

For all the Republican shouting about how Obamacare is broken (and it is), their only proposed solution seems to be "FREE MARKET!" But how does the free market handle people who are drains on the system, who can't make a profit for the insurance companies? A free market lets those people die. Is that actually the Republican plan for health insurance? If not, what's the alternative? You either subsidize people who can't afford care or you don't, and there's no incentive to do so in the free market solution.

So, please, enlighten me, because I'm truly at a loss; what is the Republican solution that is obviously superior and we liberals are idiots for not realizing it?

Start here... health insurance does not equal healthcare. Just because suddenly everyone will be getting health insurance does not mean everyone will get getting equal healthcare or any healthcare at all. So many dynamics which obamacare does nothing to fix.

Just look at the fine example of socialized healthcare in Venezuela. Last month the government stopped transplant surgeries. Unless of course you worked for the government and had extra insurance... which still doesn't help because that insurance doesn't cover the costs of the operations.

 

[boomerang]

Haha, I imagine you don't know me particularly well. I was merely being realistic and would hardly call myself angry. I do find irony in that the author probably contributed far more in his voting choices toward that situation than 'young people voting for obama' have.

As far as obamacare itself, I'm honestly ambivalent on the issue. If it leads to single payer, fine. If it stays the way it is, fine. If it gets modified, fine. As long as the no preexisiting conditions thing stays in place, I really don't have a significant preference. I guess that makes me a communist.

I don't foresee acceptance of someone with a pre-existing condition changing regardless of how things shake out in the end. But I think the harsh reality is going to be how that condition is dealt with. The current program provides insurance. Coverage? Well, that's another matter entirely. The pie is only so big and tens of millions of new folks will be sharing it. We're not all going to get an equal length stick.

It comes down to supporting the legislation based on assumptions or reality. We're all making assumptions but few if any know the reality. Given that we're being lied to incessantly right now, I'm really hesitant to think that there's a pony under this pile of shit.

 

[Screech]

^ What if the government took half of what it currently spends on the military, and instead of continuing that expense, instead spent that on paying doctors/building and running hospitals/etc to make the pie bigger?

Suddenly we have a much bigger pie!

Obviously, it is better that we can kill people (....../s), but it's certainly something interesting to think about. I think we have gotten too used to the idea that healthcare here cannot be made to work in a way that will make people satisfied. I suppose that does have some support though as americans generally want the best that money can buy.......for free.

 

[Jaskalas]

Maybe Pain Will Teach You Millenials Not To Vote For Your Own Serfdom

I disagree. All they know is government dependence. They were raised to be slaves, and slaves they shall forever be. If pain is what they feel, then like a battered wife they will beg forgiveness and ask for more. For the pain is their fault and the government is here to help them.

You doubt me? Watch them double down. This is only the beginning of the People's Republic.

 

[feralkid]

Damn and I thought all you Obama voters were going to see the light based on some lawyer's opinion. Oh well, it's all just one's and zero's.

Minus a couple apostrophes.

 

[Incorruptible]

Oh look another Anarchist/Nostateofmind/Incorruptable/Nehalem poster, can we soon look forward to your rants about the statists?

Oh look another brycejones liberal I'm a fake Christian post. Why are you attacking me and them? When have I ever complained about statists?

Can we soon look forward to your idiotic rants about being a Christian and supporting obama?

 

[SheHateMe]

Maybe we should just get rid of old people, then.


I once read about this stuff called Soylent Green....

 

[berzerker60]

Start here... health insurance does not equal healthcare. Just because suddenly everyone will be getting health insurance does not mean everyone will get getting equal healthcare or any healthcare at all. So many dynamics which obamacare does nothing to fix.

Just look at the fine example of socialized healthcare in Venezuela. Last month the government stopped transplant surgeries. Unless of course you worked for the government and had extra insurance... which still doesn't help because that insurance doesn't cover the costs of the operations.

Someone points out how every other first world country has better health care than us via universal health care? "They're totally different, that comparison is impossible! Don't be naive, we're completely unique!"

Someone points out that America will be better for having everyone get health care from private market insurance companies, even if that's not as good as single-payer? "Look at this third world country where UHC doesn't work! That's our sure future, because all single-payer is the same!"

 

[Incorruptible]

Someone points out how every other first world country has better health care than us via universal health care? "They're totally different, that comparison is impossible! Don't be naive, we're completely unique!"

Someone points out that America will be better for having everyone get health care from private market insurance companies, even if that's not as good as single-payer? "Look at this third world country where UHC doesn't work! That's our sure future, because all single-payer is the same!"

It takes a special kind of stupid to advocate for single payer. Socialism doesn't work and Capitalism is what's needed. A free market system would be much better than the idiotic idea of single payer.

 

[nixium]

I can only hope you aren't nearly as fucking stupid as you appear to be.

You know what I'm going to relish? Working hard, living my life, watching society getting more liberal, more fair, and watching sociopaths like you slowly lose your sanity in your rage and frustration. It'll be sweet knowing that assholes like you are living off my tax charity(which is what you've admitted you'll be using.) Even a heart attack or high blood pressure from the outrage as you see society change in ways that you hate won't end your torment. Yup, public healthcare will ensure that you will stay alive LONG to see all your blasted social conservative and sadistic fuck-everyone fiscal policies crumble one by one.

---> a very successful socially liberal millenial.

 

[nixium]

Heh. Gee, it's so surprising that the resident liberals wouldn't like hearing someone thank them for being suckers and voting for their own serfdom. I'm shocked!

I liked this comment more than the article:




Heh heh, so true.

Now, back to work all you government-worshiping serfs. You've got this guy and many other people's bennies to pay for. He's 100% right when he says the 'other guy' you thought was going to be the one paying bennies just for other big-govt worshiping serfs is actually YOU paying bennies for well-off people that think you're an idiot, and don't even like the government you worship. So back to it! Get to work! That's the serfdom you begged for... you got it.

Young people have always paid for old people throughout history, in all countries, you dumb old motherfucker, well off or not.

 

[dmens]

Young people have always paid for old people throughout history, in all countries, you dumb old motherfucker, well off or not.

The issue at hand is whether a government should forcibly confiscate money to make those payments.

By the way, your stance is economically liberal, not socially liberal, you dumb motherfucker.

 

[Moonbeam]

You know what I'm going to relish? Working hard, living my life, watching society getting more liberal, more fair, and watching sociopaths like you slowly lose your sanity in your rage and frustration. It'll be sweet knowing that assholes like you are living off my tax charity(which is what you've admitted you'll be using.) Even a heart attack or high blood pressure from the outrage as you see society change in ways that you hate won't end your torment. Yup, public healthcare will ensure that you will stay alive LONG to see all your blasted social conservative and sadistic fuck-everyone fiscal policies crumble one by one.

---> a very successful socially liberal millenial.

Maybe he's not as bad as you say. Maybe if he were your neighbor you'd be over for dinner regularly. You never know about such things. It takes time to get to know people and we are limited here to short posts that focus on narrow points sometimes presented to have a particular effect.

One thing, for example, I have in common with conservatives is the notion of pulling yourself up by your own boot straps, being self sufficient, as it were. Where I differ is in my opinion as to what holds so many people back from doing that. What many of them might refer to as weakness and lack of character, gumption and all that shit, I see as damage to self image, the inculcation in childhood of worthlessness, the feeling that help from the self is the last place anything worth anything could come. I believe that too many conservatives have come to hate weakness because they too feel worthless, but were not totally destroyed by it. Instead they have big egos because they were lucky enough to succeed. Well they were lucky and that's about it, but the methodology, to take care of yourself is still right. So you can drive yourself to succeed because you were made to hate yourself, or you can fail because of a slightly different form of self hate, but the real winner is he who succeeds in life because he loves doing things out of the personal accomplishment it brings.

 

[Ronstang]

I can only hope you aren't nearly as fucking stupid as you appear to be.

You must not read much of what he posts. He actually is that stupid or just playing so.

 

[Jeff7]

I suppose we could go for that "small government" thing that is so often touted as the solution to everything, and cut spending while we're at it.
I bet if we'd cut "cheaper insurance, my future Social Security checks, and the other benefits" though, there'd be some very loud screaming about that. Just the usual: "Well we can't cut that!"



For the record, yes, I'd love to see efficient government. Only as much as it needs to be, and no more. It's a necessary evil; a logistical operation to permit unruly primates to live together in some semblance of order and stability.
A government should stay out of my bedroom, out of my house, off of my lawn, away from my car, and keep its hands off of my data, printed or otherwise.
But there are some services just don't do well with the free market. Interstate highway system - an enormous public works project, and an incredible boon to commerce, or just a way of letting people easily travel to visit family or friends. Subsidies for drugs for rare illnesses: The free market would only take an interest in these things if it was a very wealthy person with the illness, one who was waving money in the face of a pharmaceutical company. Otherwise, "the problem" will eventually solve itself, by dying; and every time that happens, we etch another line on our collective wall to indicate just how little we give a damn about anyone but me.

 

[nixium]

The issue at hand is whether a government should forcibly confiscate money to make those payments.

By the way, your stance is economically liberal, not socially liberal, you dumb motherfucker.

Go get yourself checked for dementia already, you old fucker.

I'm socially liberal... didn't say anything about my economic leanings you retard.

Some of us believe there's a balance between "spend everything!" and "tax nothing!" but that concept is probably too erudite for dimwit assholes like you.

Get back into your cave.

 

[nixium]

Maybe he's not as bad as you say. Maybe if he were your neighbor you'd be over for dinner regularly. You never know about such things. It takes time to get to know people and we are limited here to short posts that focus on narrow points sometimes presented to have a particular effect.

One thing, for example, I have in common with conservatives is the notion of pulling yourself up by your own boot straps, being self sufficient, as it were. Where I differ is in my opinion as to what holds so many people back from doing that. What many of them might refer to as weakness and lack of character, gumption and all that shit, I see as damage to self image, the inculcation in childhood of worthlessness, the feeling that help from the self is the last place anything worth anything could come. I believe that too many conservatives have come to hate weakness because they too feel worthless, but were not totally destroyed by it. Instead they have big egos because they were lucky enough to succeed. Well they were lucky and that's about it, but the methodology, to take care of yourself is still right. So you can drive yourself to succeed because you were made to hate yourself, or you can fail because of a slightly different form of self hate, but the real winner is he who succeeds in life because he loves doing things out of the personal accomplishment it brings.

I know narrow minded selfish geezers like him and they're a drain on society. If I went over to his house it'l be to spit on his face.

 

[nixium]

Gah, I'm really losing it here. Gonna retire from P&N for a while, too many fucked up characters who need immediate psychological attention for me to deal with.

 

[dmens]

Go get yourself checked for dementia already, you old fucker.

I'm socially liberal... didn't say anything about my economic leanings you retard.

Some of us believe there's a balance between "spend everything!" and "tax nothing!" but that concept is probably too erudite for dimwit assholes like you.

Get back into your cave.

I was referring to your rant calling for wealth redistribution. That is an economic stance, not social. And since taxation is coerced confiscation, I disagree with your "balance".

By the way, a person is erudite, not a concept.

Gah, I'm really losing it here. Gonna retire from P&N for a while, too many fucked up characters who need immediate psychological attention for me to deal with.

Your rage is absolutely delectable to me. In spite of that, I suggest you take your break from P&N to get your anger issues checked out, Mr. Very Successful. Old codgers like me will still be here when you return.

 

[Moonbeam]

nixium: Gah, I'm really losing it here.

M: Indeed

n: Gonna retire from P&N for a while,

M: Good idea.

n: too many fucked up characters who need immediate psychological attention for me to deal with.

M: There is really only one you need to deal with.

 

[yllus]

That's a lot of angry about an extra 10-15 million people being granted a way to receive a minimum level of health care. This guy probably explodes in rage every time he sees a young person hold the door for the elderly.