Teenager shot dead after playing loud music

[Pulsar]

There's no evidence that they pointed a shot gun at him outside of what the shooter claims.

Don't we kind of have to go with what he stated happened, since we have no other point of view?

To ignore his statements and assume something completely different happened would be even worse speculation than assuming he's telling the truth (and I'm sure he's not telling the whole truth).

 

[They Live]

Welcome to the USA, where people are innocent until proven guilty.

He says that they verbally threatened him, what evidence is there thus far to prove him wrong?

The teens who were in the SUV with the dead kid.

And I never said the man was guilty.

 

[QueBert]

Ugh... I'm not saying that's what happened, it was in response to someone saying everyone is assuming the guy was civilized.


Civilized or not, it gives them no right to threaten to take the guy's life. And if that is what they did, then he has every right to defend himself.

What if he threatened them 1st??

 

[They Live]

Don't we kind of have to go with what he stated happened, since we have no other point of view?

To ignore his statements and assume something completely different happened would be even worse speculation than assuming he's telling the truth (and I'm sure he's not telling the whole truth).

What have the other witnesses in the SUV with the dead kid said?

If they say the shooter is lying, then what then?

 

[Corporate Thug]

Maybe he didn't know he hit anyone? Maybe he was running to his car while shooting, and thankfully left before it escalated.

Don't you think it's a good idea to call the cops when you discharge several rounds into an occupied vehicle "in self defense" even if you aren't sure what you hit?

If I had to guess, I would say that most likely one of the kids had one of those realistic BB guns. They pointed it at the guy and he started shooting. They tossed the BB gun before the cops showed up.

Your guessing is not nearly as convincing as no weapons being found.

There's no law (in my state, anyway) that requires someone to call the police in that situation.

Flight from the scene of the crime is often used to establish a guilty conscious in criminal cases. Common sense would dictate that one would call the police shortly after firing guns in self defense.

 

[spidey07]

What have the other witnesses in the SUV with the dead kid said?

If they say the shooter is lying, then what then?

Then it goes to grand jury and or charged.

 

[Pulsar]

What have the other witnesses in the SUV with the dead kid said?

If they say the shooter is lying, then what then?

Do you have a cite or article that states they've said that?

 

[Capt Caveman]

Don't we kind of have to go with what he stated happened, since we have no other point of view?

To ignore his statements and assume something completely different happened would be even worse speculation than assuming he's telling the truth (and I'm sure he's not telling the whole truth).

No. If the police did, he wouldn't be charged with murder.

 

[They Live]

Do you have a cite or article that states they've said that?

Keyword is "IF".

I never said they said that, but it doesn't seem like they are backing the shooters account. At least right now.

 

[Corporate Thug]

I'm looking at the kids pic and judging by his hoodie and alternate factors, I'd say he was probably up to no good.

Zimmerman, you out already bro?

 

[Pulsar]

Don't you think it's a good idea to call the cops when you discharge several rounds into an occupied vehicle "in self defense" even if you aren't sure what you hit?

Your guessing is not nearly as convincing as no weapons being found.

Flight from the scene of the crime is often used to establish a guilty conscious in criminal cases. Common sense would dictate that one would call the police shortly after firing guns in self defense.

I was thinking the same. Leaving the scene of an accident is illegal. I wanted to believe leaving the scene of a shooting is as well. But it's not. That's just... wierd.

 

[Pulsar]

Keyword is "IF".

I never said they said that, but it doesn't seem like they are backing the shooters account. At least right now.

I haven't seen any reference to their ages. I sincerely hope they aren't minors, but they probably are.

If they are, then this is already done with: their names and statements won't be published and we'll be left to speculate into eternity =/.

 

[spidey07]

I was thinking the same. Leaving the scene of an accident is illegal. I wanted to believe leaving the scene of a shooting is as well. But it's not. That's just... wierd.

"I wanted to remove my self from the threat and situation as quickly as possible, so I fled"

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Zimmerman, you out already bro?

Welcome to reality............ As much as you hate it, you are treated based on how you choose to represent yourself.

Represent yourself as a thug, with hoodie in deep cover specifically to prevent ID? You will be treated like a thug by society. Personally I wait until I can have a conversation before judging anybody, but most don't want to judge as I do.

 

[Geosurface]

I don't know why ATOT mods allow racists like Geosurface and Spatially Aware to post here.

TRANSLATION:

Waaaah! Waaaah! Mommy!!!! Make the bad men stop saying things I don't like to hear!!! WAAAAAAH!!!

Also, your working definition of "racist" appears to be "someone who disagrees with me."

You're not the only one around here who uses that definition, unfortunately.

There's a difference between being realistic about demographic trends and who's committing what type of crime, and being a racist.

If you feel that blinding your eyes and covering your ears to the realities of the world around you is a necessary step for you to feel you have preserved your "non-racism" and moral standing, then have fun with that. Just don't expect the rest of us to join you.

 

[Corporate Thug]

Actually, he's exactly right.

If the people in the SUV had said "Oh, sorry, didn't mean to bother you" and turned it down, this wouldn't have happened.

If the people in the SUV had said "No, call the cops if you don't like it" this wouldn't have happened.

It's not about "had it coming". It's about conflict resolution versus escalation.

Instead, I have absolutely NO doubt that they said what was stated. It's pretty much common fare for teens / young adults in many areas to react like that with profanity and aggression. Zero respect, and very large egos. Sort of like people on internet message boards.

New defense in court: the victim's conflict resolution skills were not up to par! Good luck w/ the one...

I swear, if this was a ATOT member, we would have had a thread the same day saying "Some asshole at the gas station had the nerve to tell me to turn down my music."

 

[Corporate Thug]

As much as I loathe that law, yes. I'm sure Spidey will be here soon to explain it in detail.

...but that's not the law. Maybe you loathe your mistaken understanding of it?

 

[Corporate Thug]

Talk about making wild guesses and speculation. Could you perhaps point to a single shred of evidence that supports that wild theory?

Not any more wilder than other posters speculating the passengers had a BB gun which is directly contradicted by the police not finding any guns now is it?

 

[They Live]

...but that's not the law. Maybe you loathe your mistaken understanding of it?

If you shoot somebody, claim self defense by saying they verbally threatened you, and there are no witnesses to dispute your claim, why should you be arrested?

Regardless, I don't feel like arguing about that again. So if you believe I'm "mistaken", so be it.

 

[wirednuts]

Dunny has gotta gun
Dunny has gotta gun
The whole worlds come undone
From lookin after shootin the awesome dude

What did this daddy dooooo?
Why did he shoot you blue!?!

Now i FIND you irritating
Like somethin sharp up in my aaAASSSS
But man you sit there happy like your life isnt sappy
You aint never gonna live to see another daaaaAAYYY!

Dunnys got a gun
Dunnys got a gun
His dog ways finally shine
Now bow to him unless youre white

Tell me now its just you
The lone stoner saying go fuck youUUUU
He CAPPED the little teenager
Like a man whos two faced two faceeeEE!!

They say the spell that he was under
The reason WHY he tried murder
Was nothing more or other then way hes raaaiisssEEEDD!!!!

Run away, run away from the caucasian yea yea yea
run away, run away from THE. WHITE. PAIN. yeah yeah yeah yeah eyah yea
Run away, run away, RRRRRRRUUUUUUUUNNNNNN run away yea yea yae yeayeyeaeyayeaeyaeayea

(dir dir dirgh dir digh dir dooo dir dirgh dir dir dir doooo)

im tired of this if anyone wants to finish the song go ahead

 

[Geosurface]

Anyone care to deny that the entire reason young punks blast their music at ear-shattering levels is specifically to antagonize, intimidate, and annoy the members of real society around them?

That their hope is to impose themselves upon others, at least on some level, that is at least part of their motivation...

It's basically a way of throwing down a gauntlet, laying out a challenge to the society around them "do something about it." they get a little buzz off the feeling that they are going around annoying people, probably especially the feeling of annoying white people, and I think that's a big part of the appeal.

The type of people who do this, who attempt to intimidate those around them like this, are VERY OFTEN also the type who would react exactly how he describes, with profanity, threats, etc.

This guy may be a trigger happy scumbag who should rot in jail, but I wouldn't be so fast to jump to that conclusion. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss his account. It's not that hard to believe.

EDIT:

Oh and btw I acknowledge there are some who do this and are just total posers who would cower when confronted... though, numbers certainly embolden. I also acknowledge there are probably some who do NOT wish to annoy those around them, but I feel this is a small percentage.

 

[Corporate Thug]

Doesn't matter. If he thought he saw a weapon, there doesn't NEED to be a weapon.

The verbal threats against his life are enough to justifiably shoot, regardless of a weapon. In florida that is a assault, an imminent threat to life, that means OK to shoot.

you realize that there is a believability aspect that a jury needs to be convinced of right? If you can just THINK you saw something and use that as the basis of self defense, then nobody would ever get charged or go to jail.

Also, still waiting for a plausible explanation of leaving the scene/not calling cops...

 

[They Live]

Anyone care to deny that the entire reason young punks blast their music at ear-shattering levels is specifically to antagonize, intimidate, and annoy the members of real society around them?

That their hope is to impose themselves upon others, at least on some level, that is at least part of their motivation...

It's basically a way of throwing down a gauntlet, laying out a challenge to the society around them "do something about it." they get a little buzz off the feeling that they are going around annoying people, probably especially the feeling of annoying white people, and I think that's a big part of the appeal.

The type of people who do this, who attempt to intimidate those around them like this, are VERY OFTEN also the type who would react exactly how he describes, with profanity, threats, etc.

This guy may be a trigger happy scumbag who should rot in jail, but I wouldn't be so fast to jump to that conclusion. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss his account. It's not that hard to believe.

The shooters account could very well be true. It could also be completely bogus, including whether or not the music was truly blasting. Right now, all we have is the shooters account, nothing more.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Not any more wilder than other posters speculating the passengers had a BB gun which is directly contradicted by the police not finding any guns now is it?

You know just as well as I do that if they were in fact "little thugs" that they aren't going to toss a gun on the dashboard after something like this happening.

IF they had a gun, they most definitely would have disposed of it LONG before police arrived.

Continue ignoring logic, being naive, and promoting your agenda.

 

[Corporate Thug]

Rofl.... What a totally screwed viewpoint.

Rofl, the irony of you calling anyone else's viewpoint screwed.