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Talk to me about this stimulus bill

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dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
25,142
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Right, but my point is that it’s not a majority of Americans and more to the point they don’t need reasons to hate the other team. They will whether you supply them or not
Okay, I'm not really concerned with why people may hate Democrats or whether those reasons are valid...the point is that they do indeed hate them, or strongly dislike them, or whatever you want to call it.

So we have ~250M VAP in Murica. ~66M voted for Hillary and if we really want to quibble, I will say IMO some significant percentage of that 66 even hate Dems but at least acknowledge that GOP is worse. ~63M voted Trump and a huge percentage of those people HATE Democrats, while again, some significant percentage maybe don't hate them but for some strange reason just though President Trump had a nice ring to it. I'm willing to concede that the Dem voters that hate Dems cancel out the GOP voters that do not hate Dems if you are. That leaves us with 66M do not hate Dems, 63M do hate Dems, and we can start to analyze the remaining 121M. We need to find 62M more Americans that hate Democrats for my statement to be true. If there were a way to prove the exact number, would you be willing to put up money that more than half of "independents" don't hate Democrats? Keep in mind that people that hate Republicans and hate Democrats still count as "hating Democrats." Also keep in mind that people that are completely apathetic about politics or hate politics are likely that way because they hate both parties equally. I would certainly not make that bet.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
66,627
14,102
136
You do realize those are LOANS, right? It's not a slush fund if you have to actively pay back the funds you take derpington.


It's very clear that Dems are trying to pass random shit to try and use to win the upcoming election. Overall just things that have nothing to do with the situation at-hand.

I'll stand beside them on one factor: Provision the bailout loans to say "If you take a loan (which is obviously optional), you must be within guidelines to not lay off more than x amount of workers, no stock buybacks, and no fat bonus' for x # of years".

All of the other shit? You want to talk about a slush fund lol....
You cannot possibly be this naive.

Yes though, you’re probably right that they wanted to give Trump a half trillion dollars where they could waive whatever terms they wanted and keep recipients secret until after the election for totally non-corrupt reasons.

Like who is genuinely stupid enough to believe that.
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
14,669
2,395
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Yeah, I could totally see his Wall funds magically appearing, just in time for the election (and that's just the tip of the iceberg as to what he'd do).

Talk about picking Winners & Losers...
 
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Nov 8, 2012
14,684
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Watching tonight's PBS news - I'm seeing that loans will be given to small businesses that will be forgiven IF they do maintain their workforce. Anyone else think it's not ridiculous to say that these loans should be paid back if they successfully get them out of the hole and back in business? I'm not saying huge interest rates, or immediate payback - but forgiven just seems pure stupidity....

Of course, at this point until something is passed it's all speculation...
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
13,662
1,771
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My logic is pretty simple, really. If most Americans didn't hate Democrats, then everyone who wasn't a die-hard Republican would be a full-blown Democrat by now in order to rid our country of the GOP scourge. The ONLY way a person can justify remaining independent in the current political climate is by pretending both sides are the same, and in order to maintain that illusion you have to be seriously handicapping Democrats before you even start the comparison.
Thank the corporate media who relentlessly #bothsides everything and act like republicans are acting in anything resembling good faith. Democrats are playing by the rulebook from the 60s/70s. All options should be on the table to pass things from the progressive "wish list" as it's better for the country. If republicans can push for bullshit environmental deregulation and giant secret corporate giveaways in the name of "stimulus", then dems are free to try to secure elections and clean energy.

You do realize those are LOANS, right? It's not a slush fund if you have to actively pay back the funds you take derpington.


It's very clear that Dems are trying to pass random shit to try and use to win the upcoming election. Overall just things that have nothing to do with the situation at-hand.

I'll stand beside them on one factor: Provision the bailout loans to say "If you take a loan (which is obviously optional), you must be within guidelines to not lay off more than x amount of workers, no stock buybacks, and no fat bonus' for x # of years".

All of the other shit? You want to talk about a slush fund lol....
Only a republican would call trying to protect voters from contagious diseases irrelevant. If Dem voters have to wait in lines for hours to vote, then catch the next virus and get sick and die, that's just a bonus for them.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
57,948
10,331
126
That's at least a better response than @Jhhnn's shitpost, but why aren't independents becoming Democrats as the GOP further radicalizes? Why are there millions of people that think bothsides is actually true?
How far can you move those goalposts, anyway? Your original contention was that most Americans hate Democrats, a claim for which you offer no proof other than the "logic" of what you want to believe. It's the simulated rationality of motivated reasoning.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
25,142
4,648
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How far can you move those goalposts, anyway? Your original contention was that most Americans hate Democrats, a claim for which you offer no proof other than the "logic" of what you want to believe. It's the simulated rationality of motivated reasoning.
Feel free to poke a hole in the logic instead of just talking shit and making stupid statements like "moving the goalposts" when they clearly don't apply. If you don't believe me go ahead and try to explain where the goalposts were originally and where you think they are now.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
57,948
10,331
126
Feel free to poke a hole in the logic instead of just talking shit and making stupid statements like "moving the goalposts" when they clearly don't apply. If you don't believe me go ahead and try to explain where the goalposts were originally and where you think they are now.
Gawd. Logic dictates that winning the popular vote in 2016 means that most Americans don't hate Democrats. Winning the House in the midterms says the same thing. Start from observable facts, not from your feelings.
 
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dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
25,142
4,648
126
Gawd. Logic dictates that winning the popular vote in 2016 means that most Americans don't hate Democrats. Winning the House in the midterms says the same thing. Start from observable facts, not from your feelings.
Maybe if more than 50% VAP voted your point would stand. Sadly, roughly 121 million didn't, but I'm sure most of them love Democrats just not enough to actually vote for them when their opponent is the dumbest con man to ever walk the earth.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
57,948
10,331
126
Maybe if more than 50% VAP voted your point would stand. Sadly, roughly 121 million didn't, but I'm sure most of them love Democrats just not enough to actually vote for them when their opponent is the dumbest con man to ever walk the earth.
And now a straw man.
 

pete6032

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2010
4,364
430
126
Conservative media is lighting up tonight with rumors of Obama phones included in the bill.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
30,665
1,781
126

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
66,627
14,102
136
Oh look. Democrats approval rating is 35% and disapproval rating is 62%. Totally not because of hatred though, I'm sure.

That’s about equal with republicans and it’s one pollster from two weeks ago.

Don’t cherry pick.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
25,142
4,648
126
That’s about equal with republicans and it’s one pollster from two weeks ago.

Don’t cherry pick.
Hey, I never said Americans don't also hate Republicans.

Also, I'm not trying to cherry pick. If you have access to better statistics please share them. I'm not very good at finding stuff like that myself.

The difference between Democrats' and Republicans' approval ratings of course, as we both know, is that Republicans have earned their dismal ratings while Democrats get those ratings for free.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
66,627
14,102
136
Hey, I never said Americans don't also hate Republicans.

Also, I'm not trying to cherry pick. If you have access to better statistics please share them. I'm not very good at finding stuff like that myself.

The difference between Democrats' and Republicans' approval ratings of course, as we both know, is that Republicans have earned their dismal ratings while Democrats get those ratings for free.
All I’m trying to say is that people don’t really care what either one does, much to all of our detriment.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
25,142
4,648
126
All I’m trying to say is that people don’t really care what either one does, much to all of our detriment.
I'm sure that is the case for a lot of people. Doesn't really explain why Democrats have roughly the same approval ratings as Republicans. Hatred explains it though.
 
Nov 8, 2012
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Stimulus bill was agreed to last night. Still working on the text - but we will see whats in it hopefully today....
 
Feb 4, 2009
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Stimulus bill was agreed to last night. Still working on the text - but we will see whats in it hopefully today....
Been reported that the President doesn’t like this bill.
I suspect he will have more limits as to what the money can be spend upon & accounting as to where it goes.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
26,100
746
126
Been reported that the President doesn’t like this bill.
I suspect he will have more limits as to what the money can be spend upon & accounting as to where it goes.
According to Vox

Schumer’s office also announced they secured a provision that will “prohibit businesses controlled by the President, Vice President, Members of Congress, and heads of Executive Departments from receiving loans or investments from Treasury programs.” The children, spouses or in-laws of lawmakers and executive officials also cannot receive these loans.
 
Feb 4, 2009
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Honestly I’m okay with the Presidents businesses getting loans or bailout money, provided they qualify under the same rules as everyone else and the money is applied in the same manner as everyone else.
I’m not okay with arguably the greediest man on Earth getting a pool of billions to trillions that he can divvy out in nearly any manner he chooses.
 

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