• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

Star Citizen: Chris Robert`s new space sim (the Wing Commander guy)

Page 102 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
So you're OK with games like BF3+ allowing you to buy the weapons that you normally need to unlock? Some of those weapons taking hundreds of hours of gameplay giving players a bit of an advantage? Sure, you can get them yourself, but not without spending the next month in game...
"Pay to get things faster" is not "pay 2 win", it doesn't get you pay-only items it just saves you playing time.

I play games to have fun, so if someone else wants to pay money instead of having fun playing that doesn't really affect me.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
23,535
2,887
136
"Pay to get things faster" is not "pay 2 win", it doesn't get you pay-only items it just saves you playing time.

I play games to have fun, so if someone else wants to pay money instead of having fun playing that doesn't really affect me.
I used to be quite opposed to the "pay to save time" arguments; then I became an adult with a full time+ job and it turns out occasionally spending some real life money to save valuable time spent grinding is a very reasonable alternative. Totally against pay exclusive items, though.
 

Harabec

Golden Member
Oct 15, 2005
1,371
1
81
I'm one of those who would pay once the basic content is out. I simply have no wish to beta test another game...too many other things to do and pay for :p
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,943
126
I used to be quite opposed to the "pay to save time" arguments; then I became an adult with a full time+ job and it turns out occasionally spending some real life money to save valuable time spent grinding is a very reasonable alternative. Totally against pay exclusive items, though.

The fact that a game would design in boring grind to get you to pay money to not grind is bullshit.
 

SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
The fact that a game would design in boring grind to get you to pay money to not grind is bullshit.
Almost every game ever designed has some sort of grind. I agree, if it's designed to be boring in order to force you to pay money (think mobile F2P games), it's bull. I haven't seen that in SC at all, so not sure how relevant that will be.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
The fact that a game would design in boring grind to get you to pay money to not grind is bullshit.
I agree, however, I don't see evidence to support that approach in SC.

There is no leveling or XP to grind for.

The most entry level ship available is capable of doing a lot of different tasks right off the bat, especially when outfitted for specific purpose. Exploration, light cargo, combat, etc.

It looks like there's going to be a variety of ways to move up, and most of them look pretty fun to me.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
23,535
2,887
136
The fact that a game would design in boring grind to get you to pay money to not grind is bullshit.
I don't believe there's an intention to make the grind boring, but "the grind" in inherently boring because that's just what it is. Nearly every game has a "grind" for some sort of "resource," and it's generally always boring after the first XXX minutes.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,943
126
I don't believe there's an intention to make the grind boring, but "the grind" in inherently boring because that's just what it is. Nearly every game has a "grind" for some sort of "resource," and it's generally always boring after the first XXX minutes.
Grind as design needs to be in a way to be fun. That's the art of it. Diablo, sacred and the like have interesting grind. We will see if sc has good grind or not when/if it comes out.

All pay to win allows those who didn't pay to grind their way to the power. So right now sc is pay to win. Sorry.
 

SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
Grind as design needs to be in a way to be fun. That's the art of it. Diablo, sacred and the like have interesting grind. We will see if sc has good grind or not when/if it comes out.

All pay to win allows those who didn't pay to grind their way to the power. So right now sc is pay to win. Sorry.
See previous explanation. You still don't understand P2W.
 
Feb 4, 2009
31,365
11,773
136
I don't get the anger JSt0rm. Sell your account you'll break even with minimal effort or accept that maybe you got caught up in hype and purchased something you regret. Hell we all have spent more than $30 on a game that's been not what we expected.
Bottom line is you are letting a small purchase upset you too much its not worth the time. I do appreciate the concern and I do appreciate some of the links but that is enough.
 

Kelvrick

Lifer
Feb 14, 2001
18,438
5
81
Can you guys stop responding to JSt0rm? Putting him on my ignore list doesn't work if you guys keep quoting him.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
Can you guys stop responding to JSt0rm? Putting him on my ignore list doesn't work if you guys keep quoting him.
Meh. It's just discussion. I welcome dissent. It keeps forums interesting, but it's a lot more productive when the opposing argument is presented with intelligence.

I'm more than happy to change my view on a subject if someone can convince me with a logical argument.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,943
126
I think this situation is funny so I keep following it and talking about it. Sorry but I find it entertaining to watch unfold.
 

chimaxi83

Diamond Member
May 18, 2003
5,648
61
101
Meh. It's just discussion. I welcome dissent. It keeps forums interesting, but it's a lot more productive when the opposing argument is presented with intelligence.

I'm more than happy to change my view on a subject if someone can convince me with a logical argument.
Yeah no, it's ThinClient 2.0.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
Sorry but I find it entertaining to watch unfold.
I find it entertaining to play the released modules. Spent over 30 hours so far in Arena Commander.

I think my time has been better spent.
 
Last edited:

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,943
126
I find it entertaining to play the released modules. Spent over 30 hours so far in Arena Commander.

I think my time has been better spent.
Well I haven't spent 30 hours laughing at star citizen yet. I'll let you know when I get there.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
23,535
2,887
136
Grind as design needs to be in a way to be fun. That's the art of it. Diablo, sacred and the like have interesting grind. We will see if sc has good grind or not when/if it comes out.

All pay to win allows those who didn't pay to grind their way to the power. So right now sc is pay to win. Sorry.
Diablo has an interesting grind? 600x MF Meph runs are fun? Please. You do it because you want gear, but it's not exactly a riveting gaming experience. How many people have a TV on in the background during "the grind?" They don't do it because the grind is an art.

If you wanted to talk about more expensive enjoyable grinds you could have at least mentioned something like Planetside where the grind is essentially just playing the game. Though I suppose Planetside is pay 2 win in your eyes, too.

Quite simply grinding is boring by it's very nature. It's absurdly common in any "gear acquiring" game, the nature of the beast.

Don't know why people like you and TC are so bitter. Hell, I made a few bucks profit on this game months ago and now I've got two ships left that I essentially have for free. The game could be epic (I hope, but am not holding my breath as there is no way it could possibly live up to the hype, and that's obvious) or fail hard, and I'm not going to be losing sleep over it.

Some people just like to be angry/cynics I suppose?
 

preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,755
61
91
Is Arena Commander no longer buggy? How many different ships can be in one battle?

As an adult with a full time job, I wholeheartedly support pay to get stuff faster. The only bad knews I'm paying attention to regarding features is feature creep. They should have stayed focused, like Wasteland 2 and Elite Dangerous, and they would probably have a working beta by now.

Are they actually selling any concept ships any more? I get that most backers are still enthusiastic, but at some point they have to realize putting more money into the game is foolish.
 

SunnyD

Belgian Waffler
Jan 2, 2001
32,664
120
106
www.neftastic.com
Grind as design needs to be in a way to be fun. That's the art of it. Diablo, sacred and the like have interesting grind. We will see if sc has good grind or not when/if it comes out.

All pay to win allows those who didn't pay to grind their way to the power. So right now sc is pay to win. Sorry.
Explain to us how a title which is still currently in a state somewhere between alpha and beta with absolutely no end-user content but rather is mostly a tech demo at the moment can have any notion of anything resembling "pay to win" at all?

At this point it's pay to back. Nothing more, nothing less.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
. They should have stayed focused, like Wasteland 2 and Elite Dangerous, and they would probably have a working beta by now.
If you read through Braben's developer scoping for Elite Dangerous, you'll see a lot of similarities with Star Citizen, including planet-side landing / FPS view and a single-player campaign (which got axed - probably my biggest disappointment as a departure from the original vision).

They just chose to release a playable flight combat / economics game before trying to expand it with the other mechanics.

Roberts doesn't want to do it that way, so you end up with a much longer wait to get to a released product.

I can see the pros and cons of either approach. Either way, you have to wait a long time for the final result. I'm not interested in playing any more of Elite Dangerous until they add the content they planned above, then I'll be stoked to jump back in.

Star Citizen may actually release SQ42 and PU before they get to that point, so either way, it's a waiting game.
 
Last edited:

ToySoldier

Member
Dec 17, 2003
186
0
76
I find it entertaining to play the released modules. Spent over 30 hours so far in Arena Commander.

I think my time has been better spent.
Yea I spent quite a bit of time in AC. Even made a friendship or 2 with Missouri Backers. Once multi-crew play comes out gonna build my son (7yrs old) a SC gaming pc so he can turret gunner for me using Occulus Rift... plus I learned how to use and customize Voice Attack.

I'm not much of a FPS gamer but SQ 42 will be a game-changer once that debuts. I'm glad CR's brother is in charge of that mission. I bet the crowd funding $$ double on average until the PU is ready.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY