So, does the 7950GX2 count as a single card solution?

[redbox]

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: Rangoric

Originally posted by: josh6079
beggerking, is your idea of a driver working correctly for it to pop up an error message to you?

If its a case where the driver shouldn't work (as in ATI dirvers for Nvidia cards), then I would think that a pop up message saying it won't work is the driver working right. Thats a very elegant method of letting the user know what is wrong and why it won't do anything else.

But thats from the software perspective. Hardware wise, that driver doesn't work with that hardware.

Sorry, perhaps I should rephrase.

The fact that a driver cannot access a part of its ability because of improper hardware is, to me, a state of disability. If hardware is indeed constricting the driver from performing all of its tasks, then it just goes to show that software can be impacted by hardware, and hardware can be impacted by software.

beggerking, do you agree that in order to compare the 7950GX2 to an X1900 you would have to utilize both the hardware and the software available in that comparison?

the driver software was designed to not access that part of code, not that is really cannot access it.

2nd bolded part. Once again, driver was designed to not perform the task, not constricted by hardware.

to answer your question: yes. we compare cards' max potential performance.

So what about DX10 on a DX9 card I would consider that to be hardware limited. Or true HT on a A64. The hardware features restrict what we can do with software plain and simple that is why the computer industry keeps coming out with new hardware and new software.

 

[redbox]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
You guys of course must know by now that beggarking is just playing this out, right?
The hole is dug and he probably knows this and just continuing with it just to have the last word and annoy? Possibly? When his almost every post seems to contradict one he made before, this all becomes quite obvious, even it he turns a blind eye to his contradictions.

whatever keys. accusing me of contradicting myself without prove.

while Josh kept changing his words. whatever.[/quote]

Proof: Beggerking in this thread: Bios, is a part of hardware

Beggerking's PM to me: Bios can indeed be considered a software

The difference is Josh can admit when he is wrong and you can't.

And from Wiki

Originally posted by: beggerking

BIOS, in computing, stands for Basic Input/Output System or Basic Integrated Operating System. BIOS refers to the software code run by a computer when first powered on

So tell me again Beggerking how is BIOS hardware?

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: Rangoric

Originally posted by: josh6079
beggerking, is your idea of a driver working correctly for it to pop up an error message to you?

If its a case where the driver shouldn't work (as in ATI dirvers for Nvidia cards), then I would think that a pop up message saying it won't work is the driver working right. Thats a very elegant method of letting the user know what is wrong and why it won't do anything else.

But thats from the software perspective. Hardware wise, that driver doesn't work with that hardware.

Sorry, perhaps I should rephrase.

The fact that a driver cannot access a part of its ability because of improper hardware is, to me, a state of disability. If hardware is indeed constricting the driver from performing all of its tasks, then it just goes to show that software can be impacted by hardware, and hardware can be impacted by software.

beggerking, do you agree that in order to compare the 7950GX2 to an X1900 you would have to utilize both the hardware and the software available in that comparison?

the driver software was designed to not access that part of code, not that is really cannot access it.

2nd bolded part. Once again, driver was designed to not perform the task, not constricted by hardware.

to answer your question: yes. we compare cards' max potential performance.

So what about DX10 on a DX9 card I would consider that to be hardware limited. Or true HT on a A64. The hardware features restrict what we can do with software plain and simple that is why the computer industry keeps coming out with new hardware and new software.

software can produce any graphic but slow.

DX10 and DX9 provide special instruction to allow graphic card (dx10/dx9) to process them to speed things up.

hardware are for performance. software can actually emulate a whole PC nowadays..but slow.

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
You guys of course must know by now that beggarking is just playing this out, right?
The hole is dug and he probably knows this and just continuing with it just to have the last word and annoy? Possibly? When his almost every post seems to contradict one he made before, this all becomes quite obvious, even it he turns a blind eye to his contradictions.

whatever keys. accusing me of contradicting myself without prove.

while Josh kept changing his words. whatever.

Proof: Beggerking in this thread: Bios, is a part of hardware

Beggerking's PM to me: Bios can indeed be considered a software

The difference is Josh can admit when he is wrong and you can't.

And from Wiki

Originally posted by: beggerking

BIOS, in computing, stands for Basic Input/Output System or Basic Integrated Operating System. BIOS refers to the software code run by a computer when first powered on

So tell me again Beggerking how is BIOS hardware?

redbox, are you not very smart?

read your Wiki link

"BIOS is sometimes called firmware because it is an integral part of the system hardware"

redbox, time to admit you are wrong? (as always)

 

[redbox]

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
You guys of course must know by now that beggarking is just playing this out, right?
The hole is dug and he probably knows this and just continuing with it just to have the last word and annoy? Possibly? When his almost every post seems to contradict one he made before, this all becomes quite obvious, even it he turns a blind eye to his contradictions.

whatever keys. accusing me of contradicting myself without prove.

while Josh kept changing his words. whatever.

Proof: Beggerking in this thread: Bios, is a part of hardware

Beggerking's PM to me: Bios can indeed be considered a software

The difference is Josh can admit when he is wrong and you can't.

And from Wiki

Originally posted by: beggerking

BIOS, in computing, stands for Basic Input/Output System or Basic Integrated Operating System. BIOS refers to the software code run by a computer when first powered on

So tell me again Beggerking how is BIOS hardware?

redbox, are you not very smart?

read your Wiki link

"BIOS is sometimes called firmware because it is an integral part of the system hardware"

redbox, time to admit you are wrong? (as always)

um no because I am not. First you have admitted in a pm that bios is software so if I am wrong you are also, but that's not the case. You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of. As far as firmware here is the wiki definition. Wiki

In computing, firmware is software that is embedded in a hardware device

It makes no difference that it is embedded in hardware it is still software.

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
You guys of course must know by now that beggarking is just playing this out, right?
The hole is dug and he probably knows this and just continuing with it just to have the last word and annoy? Possibly? When his almost every post seems to contradict one he made before, this all becomes quite obvious, even it he turns a blind eye to his contradictions.

whatever keys. accusing me of contradicting myself without prove.

while Josh kept changing his words. whatever.

Proof: Beggerking in this thread: Bios, is a part of hardware

Beggerking's PM to me: Bios can indeed be considered a software

The difference is Josh can admit when he is wrong and you can't.

"BIOS is sometimes called firmware because it is an integral part of the system hardware"

redbox, time to admit you are wrong? (as always)

um no because I am not. First you have admitted in a pm that bios is software so if I am wrong you are also, but that's not the case. You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of. As far as firmware here is the wiki definition. Wiki

In computing, firmware is software that is embedded in a hardware device

It makes no difference that it is embedded in hardware it is still software.

you cannot use that as the base of your argument. When you flash your bios, it is actually physically "changed" internally. That is how its able to retain its information.


by the way, the correct term is Firmware, not software. so, you are wrong.

 

[redbox]

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
You guys of course must know by now that beggarking is just playing this out, right?
The hole is dug and he probably knows this and just continuing with it just to have the last word and annoy? Possibly? When his almost every post seems to contradict one he made before, this all becomes quite obvious, even it he turns a blind eye to his contradictions.

whatever keys. accusing me of contradicting myself without prove.

while Josh kept changing his words. whatever.

Proof: Beggerking in this thread: Bios, is a part of hardware

Beggerking's PM to me: Bios can indeed be considered a software

The difference is Josh can admit when he is wrong and you can't.

"BIOS is sometimes called firmware because it is an integral part of the system hardware"

redbox, time to admit you are wrong? (as always)

um no because I am not. First you have admitted in a pm that bios is software so if I am wrong you are also, but that's not the case. You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of. As far as firmware here is the wiki definition. Wiki

In computing, firmware is software that is embedded in a hardware device

It makes no difference that it is embedded in hardware it is still software.

you cannot use that as the base of your argument. When you flash your bios, it is actually physically "changed" internally. That is how its able to retain its information.


by the way, the correct term is Firmware, not software. so, you are wrong.

There you go again with that stupid correct term junk. Firmware is a type of software. And to be frank this doesn't really matter if you want to keep arguing peripheral issues that is your deal.

 

[beggerking]

If you can't even get the terms right, how can you be arguing about it?

I was replying to your quote "You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of."

which was incorrect because bios does physically change when you flash it..

 

[mancunian]

The people arguing on here and keeping this thread going are incredibly sad.

Lads, go out and find some women.

 

[josh6079]

Originally posted by: beggerking
to answer your question: yes. we compare cards' max potential performance.

Good, then we need the proper software then in order to make the comparison that you care about so much, end of the software and hardware discussion. Whether or not we think it is or isn't independent doesn't matter because ultimately we'll have to use it. Stop carrying on about what is technical or not, your very own sentences are not technically constructed right, yet no one is going on for pages and pages about how those are incorrect.

The 7950GX2 needs the proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself to be compared with the X1900XTX using its own proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself. Really, you're just arguing against your own goal of comparing them since you want to seperate hardware and software as independent from one another.

 

[josh6079]

Originally posted by: mancunian
The people arguing on here and keeping this thread going are incredibly sad.

Lads, go out and find some women.

LOL. Ah ha, ah ha ha....you're so funny. Oh, man you are the coolest poster here because you can make such funny statements.

Did you get your ego boost yet? Thanks for the input.

 

[redbox]

Originally posted by: beggerking
If you can't even get the terms right, how can you be arguing about it?

I was replying to your quote "You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of."

which was incorrect because bios does physically change when you flash it..

As does just about every other storable media you use. What's your point?

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: beggerking
to answer your question: yes. we compare cards' max potential performance.

Good, then we need the proper software then in order to make the comparison that you care about so much, end of the software and hardware discussion. Whether or not we think it is or isn't independent doesn't matter because ultimately we'll have to use it. Stop carrying on about what is technical or not, your very own sentences are not technically constructed right, yet no one is going on for pages and pages about how those are incorrect.

The 7950GX2 needs the proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself to be compared with the X1900XTX using its own proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself. Really, you're just arguing against your own goal of comparing them since you want to seperate hardware and software as independent from one another.

I'm not arguing against my own goal but you are trying to avoid the point. Its not about whether hardware needs driver to perform, its about whether hardware functions independently from software. I was actually replying to your statement

"The fact that a driver cannot access a part of its ability because of improper hardware is, to me, a state of disability. If hardware is indeed constricting the driver from performing all of its tasks, then it just goes to show that software can be impacted by hardware, and hardware can be impacted by software. "

which was incorrect because the driver software was designed to not access that part of code. hardware does not control software to make the software not accessing part of its code.

 

[Nightmare225]

Could you guys please just stop, we all know you're smart and know a lot about computers, that's the point of this forum.

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: redbox

Originally posted by: beggerking
If you can't even get the terms right, how can you be arguing about it?

I was replying to your quote "You can change bios without changing the hardware it is a part of."

which was incorrect because bios does physically change when you flash it..

As does just about every other storable media you use. What's your point?

so your were wrong to say" because bios can change without changing hardware, its a software". Bios does physically change when you flash it. So with your logic, bios is hardware.

ram, on the other hand, fits your definition, which runs OS(software).

fine. I'm done here. bye.

 

[josh6079]

Originally posted by: beggerking

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: beggerking
to answer your question: yes. we compare cards' max potential performance.

Good, then we need the proper software then in order to make the comparison that you care about so much, end of the software and hardware discussion. Whether or not we think it is or isn't independent doesn't matter because ultimately we'll have to use it. Stop carrying on about what is technical or not, your very own sentences are not technically constructed right, yet no one is going on for pages and pages about how those are incorrect.

The 7950GX2 needs the proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself to be compared with the X1900XTX using its own proper drivers, OS, bios, and itself. Really, you're just arguing against your own goal of comparing them since you want to seperate hardware and software as independent from one another.

I'm not arguing against my own goal but you are trying to avoid the point. Its not about whether hardware needs driver to perform, its about whether hardware functions independently from software. I was actually replying to your statement

"The fact that a driver cannot access a part of its ability because of improper hardware is, to me, a state of disability. If hardware is indeed constricting the driver from performing all of its tasks, then it just goes to show that software can be impacted by hardware, and hardware can be impacted by software. "

which was incorrect because the driver software was designed to not access that part of code. hardware does not control software to make the software not accessing part of its code.

It doesn't matter whether the hardware is designed to be constricting it or not, the fact still remains that it is causing improper performance and not correctly executing certain functions to its design. That's the whole reason why the OS bothers to tell you that there is a problem (i.e that's why you get the pop-up).

All of this has nothing to do with why the 7950 is a single slot solution however. You yourself said that all you want is a comparison between it and the X1900XTX. That has happened....several times. And in order to make those comparisons they have to utilize both the proper hardware and software available. Why you wanted to try and explain the difference between hardware and software when it wouldn't even matter to begin with is beyond me.

 

[Rangoric]

Originally posted by: beggerking

ram, on the other hand, fits your definition, which runs OS(software).

Ram does change. And the CPU runs the OS not the Ram.
Your Harddrive that stores the OS physically changes.

You are forgetting that nothing, and I repeat, nothing has the ability to do something without movement or change.

In computing, firmware is software that is embedded in a hardware device

Enjoy

 

[BFG10K]

Pentium bug is a bug in floating point operation,

That would be why my example used floating point code.

above code is using integer.

Uh, no. Read what you quoted:

But the Pentium FPU bug wasn't exposed unless the software [if (x=1) then {do floating-point operation(s)}] so therefore your own reasoning would claim the Pentium FPU bug is actually a software problem.

Your arguments are obtuse and simpleton.

stop making up terms and pretend you know something when you obvious don't.

What the hell are you talking about?

bios, is a part of hardware.

Utter rubbish.

fine. I'm done here. bye.

Sadly I doubt that very much.

 

[Nightmare225]

I honestly hope he is done.

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Pentium bug is a bug in floating point operation,

That would be why my example used floating point code.

above code is using integer.

Uh, no. Read what you quoted:

But the Pentium FPU bug wasn't exposed unless the software [if (x=1) then {do floating-point operation(s)}] so therefore your own reasoning would claim the Pentium FPU bug is actually a software problem.

Your arguments are obtuse and simpleton.

BFG, you are a freaking lier. Where did I say "do floating operation" ?
besides, IT DOESN"T MATTER in the above code what it does, that isn't the flawed part. its x=1 that is flawed. BFG, if you don't understand the code, please ask. Don't pretend like a dumb ass that you are and misquote me intentionally.

 

[AnandTech Moderator]

I have an idea.
Keep this thread on topic.
Stop with the name calling and trolling.
Failure to do so will be detrimental to your ability to post.

 

[thilanliyan]

nm

 

[mancunian]

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: mancunian
The people arguing on here and keeping this thread going are incredibly sad.

Lads, go out and find some women.

LOL. Ah ha, ah ha ha....you're so funny. Oh, man you are the coolest poster here because you can make such funny statements.

Did you get your ego boost yet? Thanks for the input.

No thanks necessary Josh, glad you found it amusing. Always happy to help. It's a great suggestion, certainly worth a punt. Can highly recommend it.

Because think about it, then you wouldn't look so sad persisting in trying to beat another buffoon in a totally pointless and off-topic argument. I was actually interested in this thread at the start. However, there's nothing more annoying than wanting it to get back on topic, yet always discovering that it's still an argument between two childish gits who obviously do not like each other.

So no, I aint the coolest poster here. Luckily, I'm also not the saddest.

You present your arguments or point of view so well sometimes, it's a shame when you waste bandwidth with sh!t like this.

And if you think my ego can be boosted by something that's written on an Internet message board, you seriously need to get real.

Getting an offline life might just help as well.

Toodle pip.




See you in a week.
One down, who's next?
AnandTech Moderator

 

[Nightmare225]

Originally posted by: AnandTech Moderator
I have an idea.
Keep this thread on topic.
Stop with the name calling and trolling.
Failure to do so will be detrimental to your ability to post.

Thanks for the help, mod.

 

[BFG10K]

BFG, you are a freaking lier. Where did I say "do floating operation" ?

Where did I say you did? I didn't.

I said I did and you quoted me.

besides, IT DOESN"T MATTER in the above code what it does, that isn't the flawed part. its x=1 that is flawed.

My example showed floating point code and that would be to prove that software triggers the problem.

This would then mean by your reasoning the Pentium FPU bug is a software problem.

Don't pretend like a dumb ass that you are and misquote me intentionally

I find it ironic that this individual reported me for personal insults and is still carrying on after being warned by the mods.