Rangoric
Senior member
- Apr 5, 2006
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The Bios is software. And it is the software I am talking about.
I think you are restricting the kind of virus we are talking about. Many Virus that use AIM or Outlook utilize a flaw in the design of said applications to do what they want.
And this proves it. A virus can also be a self contained executable with no need to attach its code to anything else.
How about this:
A video card is only completely a single graphics solution (anyway you spin it) if it appears so through a hardware standpoint AND a software standpoint. Once a company adds "dual" anything, whether it be pcb, GPU, etc. It loses a part of its "single" attribute and thereby cannot be classified as purely a single graphics solution "anyway you spin it".
However, that does not mean that one cannot compare the difference between it and other traditional "single" cards. (When SLI first hit the motherboards, they had to compare it to something didnt' they? Now that SLI has hit the single PCI-E lanes, they have to have something to compare it to, right?)
I see computer hardware as a computer component that you can physically touch and somthing that stores or allows software traffic to run throughout its design. Since you are arguing so extensively on how the two relate and differ, how do you see hardware? Do you disagree with my definition? How long are you going to go on with this tangent before you come back to the relative material?
Yes, IF a monitor was made that could do any resolution and any refresh rate (that would be a nice monitor) then a failure in displaying those resolutions/refresh rates would be a hardware flaw. Do you know of a monitor that can do that? downlow was talking about "real" moniotrs, meaning those in use today and yesterday. With a real monitor you can cause damage to it if forced to a unsupported resolution/refresh rate through the software simply because any monitor in existence has a limit. But it was a nice attempt for you to get everyone concentrating on unrealistic theories that involved imaginary monitors.
That's like asking if hydrogen "broke" without oxygen. No, I've never seen hardware "break" without a driver or software, but I've seen hardware break with software and due to it (overclocking)--implying that there is indeed a relation between them when you think there is not.
Ignorant? If you can't adhere to realism and understand the functionality of hardware without software who is being ignorant?
If that is true, then why is a pop up presenting itself and notifying one that they "don't have the correct hardware"? If hardware works correctly regardless of the software, and improper software installed is still "correctly working" then why is there any need for a pop up? Why does the computer tell you that something is wrong?
(Because something IS wrong. Software does have somthing to do with hardware. So much to the point that you have to have just the right type of software before hardware can function correctly).
??? :roll: I'm sure if we made another thread with a pole asking that question that it wouldn't be as close as the pole to the question in this thread.
Answer these questions:
1) How do I flash a GPU with a NIC BIOS? ("hardware has nothing to do with software").
2) Why the XP installer needs drivers to access SATA drives? ("OS fetches data from the HD").
3) Why I can force AA and AF in OpenGL games that know nothing about said features? ("the OS does it through DirectX").
4) Why Quad SLI isn't working even though the hardware is already present to support it?
5) How to get HT working on an Athlon 64? ("hardware has nothing to do with software").
(Actually answer that one instead of telling me how to go about finding out how to answer it.)
6) What are you still doing here since the 7950GX2 is already compared to the X1900XTX on multiple sites?
7) How this:
is even possible? (Give me an example of software doing anything without hardware, existing on anything if not hardware)
Answer those instead of making up imaginary pieces of hardware that actually are independent from software because they're imaginary. Answer them instead of telling us how to go about finding out an answer. Answer them directly rather than replying to one and asking one of your questions. Answer the questions without having to look in Bush's press conferance strategy guide before you supply another semantic. And answer them without having a mod interupt and distract from the discussion for crimes reported by you when they have also been committed by you.
as always, please READ before you reply.
I said, using a NV card connected to the monitor. your ATI card is not present.
I never said software won't run without any hardware. its not like your CCCsoftware won't run correctly without ATI hardware. Example given above. a messsage box pops up indicates your software is "running".
you said "my Mobo is a software OCer". its a software on your mb( hardware), not a part of OS. Therefore, your hardware manufacturer is still responsible for it, hence its still a flaw in hardware.
then its a hack.
It is possible to attach itself to an empty file.
Rangoric
Senior member
- Apr 5, 2006
- 530
- 0
- 71
And? :roll:
Since software cannot hurt hardware ever, no exceptions, then I can overclock as much as I want. There will be no loss of life in any component.
Instead I will contend, that considering your position. Software is Hardware.
Show me software that is not a set of manipulated locations on a hard drive or in memory. Then show me how to run said software.
Please think before posting, reading is too much for me to ask in return from you.
Whether it is an NV card or an ATI card doesn't matter since they are still both pecies of hardware, something you stated software can run correctly without.
Yes you did. You said this:
You did not say, "any" in that nor give any other adjective signifying specifics.
Trying to work with the wrong component is still "working correctly" in your eyes? It isn't working because it isn't being utilized correctly. There are errors all over that--trying to use ATI drivers on NV hardware. Wrong software + Wrong hardware = Wroking just fine in beggerking land.
If that is true, then why is a pop up presenting itself and notifying one that they "don't have the correct hardware"? If hardware works correctly regardless of the software, and improper software installed is still "correctly working" then why is there any need for a pop up? Why does the computer tell you that something is wrong?
(Because something IS wrong. Software does have somthing to do with hardware. So much to the point that you have to have just the right type of software before hardware can function correctly).
1) How do I flash a GPU with a NIC BIOS? ("hardware has nothing to do with software").
2) Why the XP installer needs drivers to access SATA drives? ("OS fetches data from the HD").
3) Why I can force AA and AF in OpenGL games that know nothing about said features? ("the OS does it through DirectX").
4) Why Quad SLI isn't working even though the hardware is already present to support it?
5) How to get HT working on an Athlon 64? ("hardware has nothing to do with software").
(Actually answer that one instead of telling me how to go about finding out how to answer it.)
6) What are you still doing here since the 7950GX2 is already compared to the X1900XTX on multiple sites?
7) How this:
is even possible? (Give me an example of software doing anything without hardware, existing on anything if not hardware)
EDIT:
So now you're deciding what kind of a flaw it is based upon which manufacturer supplied it?
you said "my Mobo is a software OCer". its a software on your mb( hardware), not a part of OS. Therefore, your hardware manufacturer is still responsible for it, hence its still a [/b]flaw in hardware[/b].
It is true. If you are not sure if that is true or not, then you basically don't know anything about software...please stop arguing.
it "doesn't have the correct hardware" to run other parts of the program, but the software itself is still working "correctly" as designed.
Rangoric
Senior member
- Apr 5, 2006
- 530
- 0
- 71
Say what? According to this logic, Drivers are hardware, as is the Bios.
Please, write up your definition of software and hardware, cause I don't think those words mean what you think they do.
Edit:
Heck, if there is a flaw in NVidia's control panel its now a hardware flaw, not a software flaw.
Isn't your "agenda" taken care of already? Why are you still arguing if what you wanted has already happened and will continue to happen? Also, find someone else here who understands what you are saying. Look around. You are the only one who can't understand the simple relationship between hardware and software. Are you really going to hide behind that child-like logic that everyone else is wrong and you are right? You don't even address the questions that would prove your theories true like an adult would. Instead you avoid them and persist on arguing with anyone and everyone you can in an attempt to cludder the thread up with nothing but your semantics. Stop trolling.
So basically it is like a human without control of their left side? Being unable to utilize its entire function is still working correctly to you?
please distinguish a software flaw vs a hardware flaw.
hardware flaw = ______________?
software flaw = _______________?
my def:
hardware flaw = Pentium CPU bug
software flaw = if (x=1) then {do something}
Actually, that is a controlled branching, the software was designed to Not run part of the code in case the hardware is not present. Obviously you don't know enough about coding to figure that out.
hardware flaw = What the 7900's were having with artifacting at stock speeds and proper drivers and normal temps. Gradient banding with the Dell 2007's.
software flaw = ATI drivers on Nvida hardware. Two different mods in Oblivion that result in pink ground (I know that one personally).
Judging from the pole it looks like 120 say no and 113 say yes. Technically, since some of us want to deal with "abstract technical details" (which is the biggest oxymoron I've heard next to "Holy War") the answer is no, it isn't a single card solution. If you ask me though 113 to 120 isn't that big of a gap and I think that it is basically "whatever you want it to be". Some seem to be very bent on making sure it is classified correctly though....
how does ATI drivers on Nvidia hardware a software flaw?
the person who developed CCC should also support NV cards?
Who knows, maybe this thread will eventually surpass that Rollo AEG one in the number of posts. 
beggerking, is your idea of a driver working correctly for it to pop up an error message to you?
You have said that as long as hardware is inputing and outputing, it is working correctly.
You have also said that that can happen without a driver.
Then you say that a driver is still working correctly when being used on improper hardware.
If the driver isn't hardware specific, why do you get an error message?
If everything above is working correctly, why is there an error pop-up?
Do you simply disregard this error, since you know it IS working in your eyes?
You have said that as long as hardware is inputing and outputing, it is working correctly.
You have also said that that can happen without a driver.
Then you say that a driver is still working correctly when being used on improper hardware.
If the driver isn't hardware specific, why do you get an error message?
If everything above is working correctly, why is there an error pop-up?
Do you simply disregard this error, since you know it IS working in your eyes?
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