Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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trenchfoot

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,690
8,238
136
Like how North Korea is getting around some of the sanctions they got hit with, I wonder how effective those sanctions levied on Putin and his oligarch cronies will be monitored and enforced.

It seems to me there will always be black market operators more than willing to exploit the sanctions for fun and profit. China will surely be a major avenue of clandestine trade meant to mitigate the effects of the sanctions as far as import/export of sanctioned goods and services are concerned.
 
AtenRa

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
14,003
3,362
136
Muse

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
40,562
10,019
136
Pens1566 said:
Not sure what all that has to do with a failed Russia and its stockpile ... but, Ukraine isn't about anything NATO. It's about his desire to re-control any/all of the former soviet states that he can in order to bring back the good old days. Any NATO talk is kind of a red herring, just like the de-nazification talk. There was no NATO movement. There was nothing in progress in that regard. Just an excuse.
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No, I think he had/has a real concern that UK will join NATO. If and when they do his plans/hopes to absorb UK back into Russia are thwarted. IIRC I heard some stuff in the last week about UK joining NATO.

Since June 2014, polls showed that about 50% of those asked supported Ukrainian NATO membership. Some 69% of Ukrainians want to join NATO, according to a June 2017 poll by the Democratic Initiatives Foundation, compared to 28% support in 2012 when Yanukovych was in power.

Zelensky: Yes, we would like to join NATO


 
UNCjigga

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
25,470
10,072
136
Estonian supply ship has been sunk off the coast of Odessa. Unsure if it was actively fired upon or if Russia mined the harbor.
 
trenchfoot

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,690
8,238
136
IronWing said:
I think we need to get away from American expectations for how fast an offense should move. The Russian invasion is only a week old, far too soon to declare it a failure. For comparison, the 1939 German invasion of Poland took a bit over a month and was considered astonishingly fast. Desert wars have conditioned our expectations.
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The fervor for supporting Ukraine and their fight against Putin's invaders does have an effect on how well the Ukrainian military is able to repulse the Russians is perceived. Of course, the reality of Putin accomplishing his initial objectives will eventually sink in.

Like what happened to the Russians being defeated in Afghanistan, it does seem likely the same thing will happen to them in Ukraine. The resultant guerilla war is where the Ukrainians will shine. Let's hope the overwhelming international support for the Ukrainians will last longer than Putin's willingness to bleed off his personal wealth, that of his oligarch buddies and their nation's resources.
 
Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,562
9,807
136
K1052 said:
Reports of Belarus hospitals swamped with casualties and the dead being left in the field lead me to suspect Russian losses are higher even than western estimates.
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As of last night, Ukraine was estimating over 9,000 Russian killed.
 
Pens1566

Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
13,541
10,979
136
Muse said:
No, I think he had/has a real concern that UK will join NATO. If and when they do his plans/hopes to absorb UK back into Russia are thwarted. IIRC I heard some stuff in the last week about UK joining NATO.

Since June 2014, polls showed that about 50% of those asked supported Ukrainian NATO membership. Some 69% of Ukrainians want to join NATO, according to a June 2017 poll by the Democratic Initiatives Foundation, compared to 28% support in 2012 when Yanukovych was in power.

Zelensky: Yes, we would like to join NATO


Click to expand...

Polls and statements are great, but that's not actual movement in that direction to actually make it happen. Ukraine has their intent to join NATO enshrined in their constitution.

Point being, none of that is recent. None of that is "new". None of that is actually driving the need for Putin to invade now. NATO on the border of Russia/Soviet states has been a thing as long as NATO has existed. It's a red herring. A talking point. What he's really after is not having any former soviet states look like a functional western democracy on his borders. That is his main concern. Sure, there are strategic issues with LNG/pipelines/access to Black Sea in Ukraine, but those are just gravy.

If he was really concerned about countries joining NATO, he just gave at least 2 countries with arguably stronger strategic positions (Sweden/Finland) a great reason to go that route.
 
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D

[DHT]Osiris

Lifer
Dec 15, 2015
17,278
16,498
146
UnklSnappy said:
Russian businessman puts bounty on Putins head.

www.businessinsider.com

A Russian businessman has put a $1 million bounty on Vladimir Putin's head, calling for military officers to arrest him as a war criminal

Russian crypto investor Alex Konanykhin, who is based in California, told Insider the million-dollar bounty would come from his personal funds.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
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This gives me an idea, why don't we (as in, everyone) crowdsource a hit? Like how many billions could end up in a pot to whoever puts a bullet in his head? Call it Death Note.
 
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SMOGZINN

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,359
4,640
136
vi edit said:
Last I checked, murder is still illegal whether they deserved it or not. We aren't military combatants.
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It is an interesting question. If one person pays to have someone killed it is certainly murder, but is an entire population does it? I think that transcends murder. That idea might just be the most millennial version of revolution ever dreamt up.

Edit: The Revolution will not be televised (it will be live streamed) but it will be Crowdfunded.
 
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cytg111

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
25,894
15,352
136
Meghan54 said:
Really? That callous, you are? How about rightly fuck off.

Sure is easy to serve up others for sacrifice as long as you get to suck dick and live safe, right?
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That is some trumpian righteous vile homophobic anti gay bullshit right there, you must be one of those DeSantis anti gay Nazis.
 
vi edit

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,484
8,345
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SMOGZINN said:
It is an interesting question. If one person pays to have someone killed it is certainly murder, but is an entire population does it? I think that transcends murder. That idea might just be the most millennial version of revolution ever dreamt up.

Edit: The Revolution will not be televised (it will be live streamed) but it will be Crowdfunded.
Click to expand...

I mean, if Russians went out and gave Putin the Mussolini treatment, I'm not going to lose sleep. Hell might even sleep better. But even suggesting something like this, let alone putting your name too it just sets a precedent you don't want to start.
 
D

[DHT]Osiris

Lifer
Dec 15, 2015
17,278
16,498
146
vi edit said:
I mean, if Russians went out and gave Putin the Mussolini treatment, I'm not going to lose sleep. Hell might even sleep better. But even suggesting something like this, let alone putting your name too it just sets a precedent you don't want to start.
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Are you sure? Do you know where my morals lie?
 
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