Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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RnR_au

RnR_au

Platinum Member
Jun 6, 2021
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Interesting idea. Won't do much, but might chip away a little at Putin's 'legitimacy' as weak as it is.

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Unrolled thread.

But its an interesting view into how elections are managed in Russia. About what you would expect in a mafia state.
 
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Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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RnR_au said:
But more unemployed people means more willing soldiers. Maybe.
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Russia does not need "willing" soldiers, just men with other men to hold a gun to their backs.
When mother Russia and its brotherly love take its own men and vow to kill them unless they die in a Ukrainian field, almost all Russians choose the Ukrainian field.
 
B

bononos

Diamond Member
Aug 21, 2011
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K1052 said:
Yeah the depth of our missile magazines and having the components on hand to surge production of some items is going to be way more important than making more planes. This applies to offensive munitions and defensive ones as well.

This is why there is a lot of pressure to move missiles into multi-year procurements to secure stocks and keep expanded manufacturing lines warm.
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The root problem is that weapons manufacturing like all other privatized corporations are focused on profit and have been shrinking plants/staff and outsourcing so they have little spare capacity. There needs to be some incentive to maintain a large capacity for surge orders or maybe the govt should own the plants.
 
K1052

K1052

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Aug 21, 2003
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bononos said:
The root problem is that weapons manufacturing like all other privatized corporations are focused on profit and have been shrinking plants/staff and outsourcing so they have little spare capacity. There needs to be some incentive to maintain a large capacity for surge orders or maybe the govt should own the plants.
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The government is paying for them to expand their lines and is moving some munitions to multi year procurements. We need to reverse some of the post Cold War atrophy since we have sizable needs for those kind of products again.
 
kage69

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
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bononos said:
The root problem is that weapons manufacturing like all other privatized corporations are focused on profit and have been shrinking plants/staff and outsourcing so they have little spare capacity. There needs to be some incentive to maintain a large capacity for surge orders or maybe the govt should own the plants.
Click to expand...


It owns a few. Lake City down in Missouri is owned by the Feds. The plant in Scranton PA is too, where they make the big bore stuff. They're building a big new plant in Texas I think too. Pentagon invested in a Canadian facility getting re tooled I believe. I think having a shortage and having to hustle during a serious crisis like this will be good incentive to not let it happen again. Government and private production will both increase, and I expect will stay in 24/7 operation mode for a decade or more. Post Cold War crank downs were unavoidable, but we'll get back to where we need to be.
 
Zorba

Zorba

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Oct 22, 1999
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kage69 said:
It owns a few. Lake City down in Missouri is owned by the Feds. The plant in Scranton PA is too, where they make the big bore stuff. They're building a big new plant in Texas I think too. Pentagon invested in a Canadian facility getting re tooled I believe. I think having a shortage and having to hustle during a serious crisis like this will be good incentive to not let it happen again. Government and private production will both increase, and I expect will stay in 24/7 operation mode for a decade or more. Post Cold War crank downs were unavoidable, but we'll get back to where we need to be.
Click to expand...
They also own a plant in McAlister, OK.
 
K1052

K1052

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Aug 21, 2003
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https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/28/...ytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

American defense officials and engineers are also still testing what may be the most powerful FrankenSAM yet: a Patriot missile and launching station that operates with Ukraine’s older, domestically made radar systems.
A Pentagon official said on Wednesday that a test flight of the system this month, conducted at the White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico, successfully hit the drone it had targeted. The system is scheduled to be sent to Ukraine this winter, the official said, accompanied by donated missiles and other Patriot parts from multiple allies.
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Integrating Patriot launcher units into Ukraine’s S-300 systems. We can spare launchers. This is a needed step as ex-Soviet missile stocks dry up. MBDA is spinning up a PAC 2 missile production line also.
 
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Y

you2

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Apr 2, 2002
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Last edited:
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kage69

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
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Ukraine loves ATACMS. Would very much like to upgrade to the 300km variety. Looks like that may be happening in January (the allotment they just received earlier were the 165km versions).

Pentagon is sending them more ammo for NASAMS and HIMARS, more Stingers, TOWs, Javelins and artillery shells. Germany just gave them another IRIS-T AD system, a TRML-4D radar plus more HIMARS ammo.

Looks like pretty deliberate stuff in the Baltic. They've gotten more aggressive in the SCS lately too. Threatening to forcefully relocate an island full of Filipinos, that's just not going to fly. We've told them we will defend our allies but they don't seem to believe us. If Navy has to put a bunch of Chinese boats on the bottom, I'll understand. You can only have so much patience with bullies, eventually you have to do something.
 
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A

Ajay

Lifer
Jan 8, 2001
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RnR_au said:
Interesting idea. Won't do much, but might chip away a little at Putin's 'legitimacy' as weak as it is.

View attachment 87931

Unrolled thread.

But its an interesting view into how elections are managed in Russia. About what you would expect in a mafia state.
Click to expand...
The Russians are used to 'sham' elections. It's been happening since Soviet times (and no elections when the Czar's were in power, obv). A friend of mine who immigrated from Russia (Jewish), noted that local party elections officials would go nuts if you didn't go the the polling place to vote for the only person on the ticket. They would come to his house and ask for him to go vote. He'd say no - that it doesn't matter, there is only one choice. The party official would start to plead with him to sign a waiver allowing the party official to cast his for him. He'd do it. This was just to make sure the General Secretary had over 90% of the vote.

Anyway, my point - and I think you made yours clear as well, is that this just doesn't matter internally.
 
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P

pmv

Lifer
May 30, 2008
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Ajay said:
The Russians are used to 'sham' elections. It's been happening since Soviet times (and no elections when the Czar's were in power, obv).
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Pedantic correction - there were elections during the last decade or so of the Czarist regime. Just that the Duma didn't have any real power.
 
zinfamous

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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RnR_au said:
From my understanding, the Chinese vessel is under contract with a Russian controlled shipping firm. The entire crew was replaced just before the shenanigans in the Baltic sea occurred.
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from where do you gain this understanding?
 
F

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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@Young Grasshopper as a lover of peace you have to be happy to see all these dead Russian invaders.

After all if Russia just stopped invading there would be peace and every dead orc is one fewer orc that can start a new war somewhere else.
 
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RnR_au

RnR_au

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Jun 6, 2021
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zinfamous said:
from where do you gain this understanding?
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Found it... from here;

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Source

@shashj is the Defense Editor of The Economist magazine. He says later on that the mag will publish the report, but he is on holidays at the time of the tweet.

A couple of interesting tidbits;

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Source

The ship refused all cooperation with Baltic authorities, noone tried to stop it (there are no rules for such) and its now sailing the Northern Sea route in Russian waters;

thebarentsobserver.com

Runaway ship Newnew Polar Bear, suspected of sabotage in Baltic Sea, is sailing into Russian Arctic waters

As it was waiting for icebreaker escort, the ship operator changed name and obtained a special permission for sailing on the Northern Sea Route.
thebarentsobserver.com thebarentsobserver.com
 
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