- Jul 16, 2003
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
people throwing rocks/molatov coctails/shooting at soldiers, palestinian gunmen, palestinian terrorist leaders are NOT EQUAL to civilians minding their own business at a restaurant or bus.
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
people throwing rocks/molatov coctails/shooting at soldiers, palestinian gunmen, palestinian terrorist leaders are NOT EQUAL to civilians minding their own business at a restaurant or bus.
a consistently ignored fact
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
not really. the israelis go after terrorist leaders after many israeli civilians die. people justify the israeli actions because its justified use of force due to the circumstances. the alternative of doing nothing in the face of terror is unjustifiable.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
no, like the fact that the palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state, which is why they'd rather fight in this condition then live in peace with only part of the pie. and they've attacked and lost time and time again, siding with nazi's and asorted scum in the process. remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
Originally posted by: TheShiz
remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
so you think that all palestinians think this way? that's like saying all americans think one way. Plenty of innocent Palestinians and Israelies die from this conflict, both sides are doing plenty of wrong. If you believe either side is completely innocent you are clueless.
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: TheShiz
remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
so you think that all palestinians think this way? that's like saying all americans think one way. Plenty of innocent Palestinians and Israelies die from this conflict, both sides are doing plenty of wrong. If you believe either side is completely innocent you are clueless.
its the official palestinian government charter that denies the existence of israel. its the official stance of the terrorist groups is the same. palestinian population overwhelmingly agrees with the groups.
David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff.
From Ben-Gurion, A Biography, by Michael Ben-Zohar, Delacorte, New York 1978:
"We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population."
Joseph Weitz, head of the Jewish Agency's Colonization Department.
From Israel: an Apartheid State by Uri Davis, p.5:
"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many hilltops as they can to enlarge the settlements because everything we take now will stay ours... Everything we don't grab will go to them."
Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, 'Begin and the "Beasts"', New Statesman, 25 June 1982:
"We must do everything to ensure they [the Palestinian refugees] never do return."
Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979. Rabin's description of the conquest of Lydda, after the completion of Plan Dalet:
"We shall reduce the Arab population to a community of woodcutters and waiters."
Israeli Prime Minister Golda Meir's infamous quote:
"There is no such thing as a Palestinian."
Originally posted by: lozina
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
not really. the israelis go after terrorist leaders after many israeli civilians die. people justify the israeli actions because its justified use of force due to the circumstances. the alternative of doing nothing in the face of terror is unjustifiable.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
no, like the fact that the palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state, which is why they'd rather fight in this condition then live in peace with only part of the pie. and they've attacked and lost time and time again, siding with nazi's and asorted scum in the process. remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
Palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state? Where did you come up with that one? Palestinians have only wanted their own state, with EQUAL rights as any other state: not a 'slave' of the Israeli state.
Who do you think really does not want a partitioned state, but the whole pie? Could it be the people who are building a wall far beyond their mandated boundaries? Could it be the people who are subsidizing settlers to occupy land far inside the other party's territory, even though there is plenty of barren land within their own mandated borders? Hmmm...
And what about siding with nazis? Ever read about Adolf Eichmann ?
Originally posted by: kaizersose
Originally posted by: lozina
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
not really. the israelis go after terrorist leaders after many israeli civilians die. people justify the israeli actions because its justified use of force due to the circumstances. the alternative of doing nothing in the face of terror is unjustifiable.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
no, like the fact that the palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state, which is why they'd rather fight in this condition then live in peace with only part of the pie. and they've attacked and lost time and time again, siding with nazi's and asorted scum in the process. remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
Palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state? Where did you come up with that one? Palestinians have only wanted their own state, with EQUAL rights as any other state: not a 'slave' of the Israeli state.
Who do you think really does not want a partitioned state, but the whole pie? Could it be the people who are building a wall far beyond their mandated boundaries? Could it be the people who are subsidizing settlers to occupy land far inside the other party's territory, even though there is plenty of barren land within their own mandated borders? Hmmm...
And what about siding with nazis? Ever read about Adolf Eichmann ?
you do realize that the west bank, gaza and the golan heights (what most people consider 'palestinian' territory) once belonged to jordan, eqypt and syria, respectively. they had this land from 1948-1967. thats 20 years where arab states had a chance to give that territory to their brothers who so badly need a homeland today. they say thats all they really want, but the fact is that they already had it. guess what they did. ammassed five arab armies (egypt, jordan, syria, iraq, kuwait) and prepared to invade.
the rest is history and more land was lost each time israel was attacked. if you honestly believe all they want is a state of their own you need to read some history.
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
If your arguement was logical, it would help us understand your point.
So what are you saying? Are they all terrorists because they live in oppressive conditions?
"Responsibility for one's behaviour" means the Collective?
I'm trying to "figure that out", but it makes no sense.
Originally posted by: Aimster
RDWYTruckDriver = anti-Islam and anti-Arab and pro-Israel
Look at all the topics he post. Whenever a palestinian dies you won't see him posting about that here, but the second and Israel dies he is all over it.
Palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state? Where did you come up with that one? Palestinians have only wanted their own state, with EQUAL rights as any other state: not a 'slave' of the Israeli state.
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
If your arguement was logical, it would help us understand your point.
So what are you saying? Are they all terrorists because they live in oppressive conditions?
"Responsibility for one's behaviour" means the Collective?
I'm trying to "figure that out", but it makes no sense.
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
If your arguement was logical, it would help us understand your point.
So what are you saying? Are they all terrorists because they live in oppressive conditions?
"Responsibility for one's behaviour" means the Collective?
I'm trying to "figure that out", but it makes no sense.
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
That still doesn't make sense in light of Lozina's post. sure, it kinda reads odd, disjointed, but it is not contradictory. The political/social/economic state of the Palestinians is very much oppressed and that oppression does indeed extend to the General group, though Terrorism doesn't.
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: lozina
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
If your arguement was logical, it would help us understand your point.
So what are you saying? Are they all terrorists because they live in oppressive conditions?
"Responsibility for one's behaviour" means the Collective?
I'm trying to "figure that out", but it makes no sense.
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
That still doesn't make sense in light of Lozina's post. sure, it kinda reads odd, disjointed, but it is not contradictory. The political/social/economic state of the Palestinians is very much oppressed and that oppression does indeed extend to the General group, though Terrorism doesn't.
i said moral contradiction, not a logical one. the implcation of lozina's second statement was that because palestinians are living
in oppresive conditions this somehow explains or can serve to justify a minority's murderous actions, when in his first statement
he corrected popular misconceptions about all palestinians being perceived as terrorists.
the correction he made about 'all palestinians being terrorists' does not jibe morally with the implication that oppresive conditions
produce terrorism. if all palestinians live in poverty and are therefore oppressed, why are not the majority - or all of them - terrorists ?
that was my understanding.