Recent Palestinian Suicide Bombings
- Thread starter RDWYTruckDriver
- Start date
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,862
- 84
- 91
not to mention incidental civilian deaths when going after terrorist leaders and criminals is not the same as trying to kill as many civilians as possible.
when police accidentally shoot the wrong person in a shootout, are they like a suicide bomber? or kill someone in a police chase? absurd of course.
simple things...easily ignored
when police accidentally shoot the wrong person in a shootout, are they like a suicide bomber? or kill someone in a police chase? absurd of course.
simple things...easily ignored
lozina
Lifer
- Sep 10, 2001
- 11,709
- 8
- 81
Unfortunately, some people are so biased they think all Palestinians are terrorists. So when innocent Palestinians die time after time in Israeli "collateral" damage or "mistakes" people either ignore it or just justify it by telling themselves they're all terrorists anyway.
Like the fact the Palestinians are living in oppressive conditions for many years now.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,862
- 84
- 91
not really. the israelis go after terrorist leaders after many israeli civilians die. people justify the israeli actions because its justified use of force due to the circumstances. the alternative of doing nothing in the face of terror is unjustifiable.
no, like the fact that the palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state, which is why they'd rather fight in this condition then live in peace with only part of the pie. and they've attacked and lost time and time again, siding with nazi's and asorted scum in the process. remember, they always united under the statement that no israel exists or has a right to exist at all in their mind.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,101
- 5,640
- 126
You guys drawing distinctions between the actions, targets, and reasong of the Israeli's and Palestinians are correct. However, it's a pointless distinction and only perpetuates the situation.
Facts:
1) Palestinians do not have a military
2) Palestinians do not have a Homeland(at least the Palestinians in question)
3) Israelis do have a military
4) Israleis do have a Homeland
5) Israelis are coopting land where the Palestinians live
6) Palestinians not only do not have a Homeland, but their only hope to establish a Homeland dwindles with each day as Israelis develop Settlements
Facts:
1) Palestinians do not have a military
2) Palestinians do not have a Homeland(at least the Palestinians in question)
3) Israelis do have a military
4) Israleis do have a Homeland
5) Israelis are coopting land where the Palestinians live
6) Palestinians not only do not have a Homeland, but their only hope to establish a Homeland dwindles with each day as Israelis develop Settlements
lozina
Lifer
- Sep 10, 2001
- 11,709
- 8
- 81
Palestinians have always opposed a partitioned state? Where did you come up with that one? Palestinians have only wanted their own state, with EQUAL rights as any other state: not a 'slave' of the Israeli state.
Who do you think really does not want a partitioned state, but the whole pie? Could it be the people who are building a wall far beyond their mandated boundaries? Could it be the people who are subsidizing settlers to occupy land far inside the other party's territory, even though there is plenty of barren land within their own mandated borders? Hmmm...
And what about siding with nazis? Ever read about Adolf Eichmann ?
so you think that all palestinians think this way? that's like saying all americans think one way. Plenty of innocent Palestinians and Israelies die from this conflict, both sides are doing plenty of wrong. If you believe either side is completely innocent you are clueless.
You guys do realize that pointing fingers back and forth and blaming one side over the other is precisely why we've seen virtually no progress in the cycle of violence? Or do you not see that?
you do realize that the west bank, gaza and the golan heights (what most people consider 'palestinian' territory) once belonged to jordan, eqypt and syria, respectively. they had this land from 1948-1967. thats 20 years where arab states had a chance to give that territory to their brothers who so badly need a homeland today. they say thats all they really want, but the fact is that they already had it. guess what they did. ammassed five arab armies (egypt, jordan, syria, iraq, kuwait) and prepared to invade.
the rest is history and more land was lost each time israel was attacked. if you honestly believe all they want is a state of their own you need to read some history.
the first point implies a moral contradiction of your second statement. you cannot make excuses for criminal behavior. yes, not all palestinians
are terrorists. bravo. i simply wish you would be more consistent. leftists always exhibit these schizophrenic tendencies. you argue they
are not all terrorists and yet note they 'are living in oppresive conditions'. why bother with peace negotiations ? if these people cannot
take responsibility for their own behavior how can you entrust them with national peace obligations ? figure that out.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,101
- 5,640
- 126
If your arguement was logical, it would help us understand your point.
So what are you saying? Are they all terrorists because they live in oppressive conditions?
"Responsibility for one's behaviour" means the Collective?
I'm trying to "figure that out", but it makes no sense.
RDWYTruckDriver = anti-Islam and anti-Arab and pro-Israel
Look at all the topics he post. Whenever a palestinian dies you won't see him posting about that here, but the second and Israel dies he is all over it.
Look at all the topics he post. Whenever a palestinian dies you won't see him posting about that here, but the second and Israel dies he is all over it.
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,862
- 84
- 91
only about 18% of palestinian dead are actually innocent civilians. this is from the idf so some of you won't care. the fact is, israeli dead have 4 times as many women. does that sound statistically normal for innocent civilians targeted by both sides like some would love to assert? obviously not. israeli deaths are dominated by random civilian deaths. palestinians have the gall to count the suicide bomber as victims. they count gunmen, people throwing rocks and firebombs, they even count palestinians killed by other palestinians, they count everyone indiscrimantly.
not to mention the fact that the number of israeli dead is artificially supressed by their excellent health care. their terrorism response teams are rather well developed now. life threatening injuries from the palestinian attacks have been made less lethal thanks to these medical teams. lowering the body count.
note this medical care has been offered to the palestinians, who have refused it completely. they probably rather their people die to boost their body count. body count is good for palestinians, and bad for israelis regardless. for the palestinians, dead palestinians are marytres, and dead israelis are dead jews. for israel, dead palestinians get shown on arab news with no coverage of dead israelis, and they get complaints from less then fair minded parties.
not to mention the hundreds of attacks prevented by the israeli defense forces which also artificially lower the israeli death count. if nothing were done, the death count would be extremely high as the palestinians are out for mass murder. theres a huge difference between trying to maximize civilian body count as your primary goal and accidental but minimized casualties in targeted operations against enemy combatants.
mass murder? yes. the palestinian bombers have started to use biological warfare. bombers infected with HIV and hepatitis have been found.
not to mention the fact that the number of israeli dead is artificially supressed by their excellent health care. their terrorism response teams are rather well developed now. life threatening injuries from the palestinian attacks have been made less lethal thanks to these medical teams. lowering the body count.
note this medical care has been offered to the palestinians, who have refused it completely. they probably rather their people die to boost their body count. body count is good for palestinians, and bad for israelis regardless. for the palestinians, dead palestinians are marytres, and dead israelis are dead jews. for israel, dead palestinians get shown on arab news with no coverage of dead israelis, and they get complaints from less then fair minded parties.
not to mention the hundreds of attacks prevented by the israeli defense forces which also artificially lower the israeli death count. if nothing were done, the death count would be extremely high as the palestinians are out for mass murder. theres a huge difference between trying to maximize civilian body count as your primary goal and accidental but minimized casualties in targeted operations against enemy combatants.
mass murder? yes. the palestinian bombers have started to use biological warfare. bombers infected with HIV and hepatitis have been found.
His bias, as well as others here, are so transparent. There's already more than enough people taking sides, the trick is to see both sides and bring them together to some common ground so we can put a stop to this crap once and for all.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,101
- 5,640
- 126
Originally posted by: syzygy
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
That still doesn't make sense in light of Lozina's post. sure, it kinda reads odd, disjointed, but it is not contradictory. The political/social/economic state of the Palestinians is very much oppressed and that oppression does indeed extend to the General group, though Terrorism doesn't.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
That still doesn't make sense in light of Lozina's post. sure, it kinda reads odd, disjointed, but it is not contradictory. The political/social/economic state of the Palestinians is very much oppressed and that oppression does indeed extend to the General group, though Terrorism doesn't.
i said moral contradiction, not a logical one. the implcation of lozina's second statement was that because palestinians are living
in oppresive conditions this somehow explains or can serve to justify a minority's murderous actions, when in his first statement
he corrected popular misconceptions about all palestinians being perceived as terrorists.
the correction he made about 'all palestinians being terrorists' does not jibe morally with the implication that oppresive conditions
produce terrorism. if all palestinians live in poverty and are therefore oppressed, why are not the majority - or all of them - terrorists ?
that was my understanding.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,101
- 5,640
- 126
Originally posted by: syzygy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: syzygy
my 'arguement' was not an arguement. it was a tit-for-tat response to lozina's first post. 'responsibility for one's behavior' does mean
the collective where the point i was addressing was lozina's conflciting generalizations. re-read his first point for additional help
the collective i would address would be the palestinian authority, the only legitimate, popularly elected voice the palestinian people
possesse. they have not exercised the needed force to crush these savages. to prove this point, the palestinian authority had this
to say in response to the latest mass murder:
palestinians promise new anti-terror tactics . . . "measures not seen before" . . .. "After what happened last night, the rules of the game have changed," said Palestinian Interior Ministry spokesman Elias Zananiri of the suicide bombing.
capish ? we'll see what this amounts to and how effective this newfound conviction will be. if these 'new anti-terror tactics' prove to be
more than the lifeless talk and surveillance policies of yore then perhaps we will move forward. they need to act decisively.
That still doesn't make sense in light of Lozina's post. sure, it kinda reads odd, disjointed, but it is not contradictory. The political/social/economic state of the Palestinians is very much oppressed and that oppression does indeed extend to the General group, though Terrorism doesn't.
i said moral contradiction, not a logical one. the implcation of lozina's second statement was that because palestinians are living
in oppresive conditions this somehow explains or can serve to justify a minority's murderous actions, when in his first statement
he corrected popular misconceptions about all palestinians being perceived as terrorists.
the correction he made about 'all palestinians being terrorists' does not jibe morally with the implication that oppresive conditions
produce terrorism. if all palestinians live in poverty and are therefore oppressed, why are not the majority - or all of them - terrorists ?
that was my understanding.
"Moral Contradiction"? Is it so surprising that oppressed people lash out? If there is a "Moral Contradiction" here, it might be between these 2 situations:
1) Alleged Bad: Palestinians: The Palestinians live in limbo neither having the right to Sovereign Self Determination nor do they have the ability to Defend themselves. There land is slowly yet surely being taken from those who have clearly stated that that's there intention, they've been cut off from their employment, and they regularly are subjected to Marshal Law.
2) Alleged Good: Americans: The American's lived in a collection of Colonies. After a Tax Increase, they went apeshit.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 10K
-
Discussion Speculation: Zen 4 (EPYC 4 "Genoa", Ryzen 7000, etc.)- Started by Vattila
- Replies: 13K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 7K
-
Facebook
Twitter