Rape victim is coveted status - George Wills

[Victorian Gray]

Innocent until proven guilty. I bet no real court would convict the man under the flimsy "evidence". Sex offender not found.

Simple assault?

 

[nehalem256]

I've climbed into bed with a cousin before. I didn't assume it meant I could fuck her.

Hell, if I'm climbing into bed with a woman who specifically tells me that sex isn't happening, I'll think of my grandma doing the truffle shuffle; anything to help prevent an awkward erection. Horniness isn't a valid excuse for rape.

(1) The woman climbed into bed with him

(2) They had been hooking up for the past 3 months. I am just going to assume you hadn't been hooking up with your cousin 😉

 

[nehalem256]

First you deflect with family, then you veer off into the rape. I was very specific about the point I was making. That climbing into bed with someone is intimate, it's an invitation. That's all.

Now you seem very interested in the broader subject, so let's have at it. If this goes before a Jury and I'm on it, what am I supposed to base a decision on. On what evidentiary basis am I supposed to objectively quantify the crime and pass a judgement?

The problem isn't that I agree with his actions. It's that I wasn't there to witness it. I don't know the truth of it and without violence, without force, I've got nothing to see. The entire case would be He said... She said... And from word alone I'm going to pass judgement and issue a sentence of 10, 20, life?

The further problem is that she is likely presented the most biased toward the "it was rape" side possible.

And unless the guy had never heard of foreplay it likely leaves out some important details.

My guess is it went down something like.

(1) She climbs into bed with him
(2) He starts initating sex: ie the undress menetion
(3) She brushes him off, "I don't want to", the "basically" say no
(4) He says "ok"
(5) A little later he initiates sex again, minor foreplay etc, which she doesn't say no to
(6) He escalates to undressing her, which she doesn't say no to
(7) He undresses himself and whips out his dick, which she doesn't say no to
(8) He does his business

Its 5-7 that in my mind makes it not rape. He may be an asshole, but he isn't a rapist

 

[Atomic Playboy]

First you deflect with family, then you veer off into the rape. I was very specific about the point I was making. That climbing into bed with someone is intimate, it's an invitation. That's all.

Now you seem very interested in the broader subject, so let's have at it. If this goes before a Jury and I'm on it, what am I supposed to base a decision on. On what evidentiary basis am I supposed to objectively quantify the crime and pass a judgement?

The problem isn't that I agree with his actions. It's that I wasn't there to witness it. I don't know the truth of it and without violence, without force, I've got nothing to see. The entire case would be He said... She said... And from word alone I'm going to pass judgement and issue a sentence of 10, 20, life?

The problem is that you seem to equate intimacy with an invitation to sex even when she explicitly said "no sex." You're essentially saying that unwanted sex should be deemed consensual if someone doesn't defend themselves hard enough, and I don't agree with that. I've been in situations where I've been sleeping beside someone that I wanted to have sex with but didn't have consent, and I always managed to not have sex with them. It sucks and it makes for a shitty night of staring at the ceiling praying that the situation will change, but that doesn't change the fact that it's not on women to prevent rape by fighting harder, it's on men to prevent rape by not forcing sex on someone who explicitly does not want it.

I can't speak to how I'd vote as a juror in this specific instance, because we don't have all the evidence as presented in court. But I can say that the notion that "not fighting" is the equivalent of consent is wrong. I can say that "being invited to an intimate setting means you get to have sex" is wrong. As far as "he said, she said" cases like this, yes, it's hard to know what really happened and easy to pass armchair judgment based on our personal prejudices. I just hope those prejudices aren't based around a notion that women are somehow responsible for rape.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Climbing into bed with someone is definitely intimate.

Intimacy is not an invitation for sex. Seems like a pretty easy concept to understand.

 

[Victorian Gray]

The further problem is that she is likely presented the most biased toward the "it was rape" side possible.

And unless the guy had never heard of foreplay it likely leaves out some important details.

My guess is it went down something like.

(1) She climbs into bed with him
(2) He starts initating sex: ie the undress menetion
(3) She brushes him off, "I don't want to", the "basically" say no
(4) He says "ok"
(5) A little later he initiates sex again, minor foreplay etc, which she doesn't say no to
(6) He escalates to undressing her, which she doesn't say no to
(7) He undresses himself and whips out his dick, which she doesn't say no to
(8) He does his business

Its 5-7 that in my mind makes it not rape. He may be an asshole, but he isn't a rapist

simple assault?

 

[nehalem256]

I would also like to extend an open invitation to answer the question I posed earlier:

What if he started undressing her when they woke in the morning? What about the next night? Exactly how long is one "no" good for when the girl otherwise appears to be acting willing?

 

[Victorian Gray]

I would also like to extend an open invitation to answer the question I posed earlier:

You ever going to answer whether it should be legal for heterosexuals who don't want, or can't have, children to marry?

 

[blankslate]

I wonder if George Will covets this status enough to get himself raped....

Somehow I doubt it.


....

 

[nehalem256]

I wonder if George Will covets this status enough to get himself raped....

Somehow I doubt it.


....

Somehow you missed the point of the article.

They don't actually want to get raped. The point is to get rape victim status without actually being raped. Its basically street cred for feminists.

So basically its like having an attractive woman, whom you had an intimate relationship with for months, start sucking your cock while you are still sleeping to wake you up and then claiming you were raped. Technically since you were asleep, you would be unable to consent, and said blow job would therefore constitute rape.

 

[blankslate]

-snip-

Let your misogynist flag fly.



....

 

[Matt1970]

No one who has ever actually had sex with a willing partner would think that if someone had said no to you before and then lay there motionless while you undressed them and had sex with them that such a thing implied they wanted it to happen.

From this thread, I am increasingly unsure that you've ever had sex with a willing partner.

And from your response I am pretty sure you have never been in a relationship longer than 1 year. Unless he used some other form of intimidation, as soon as she let him take off her panties, that is consent.

 

[Matt1970]

If a woman said no, then a guy proceeded to continue. Don't you think she'd jump out of bed when she started feeling a penis enter her or his hands going around her panties and sliding them down and said "WTF are you doing? Get out of this bed! What didn't you understand about the No?"

But she let him... That is consent.

Some guys are persistent, or think someone may be joking around, etc I'm sorry to say, but she consented. If I was her, I would have done exactly what I said above. If they continued, I'd fight them tooth and nail. But she submitted and gave in to his demands. That is consent.

Using an analogy. Let's say you are shopping for a car, and the used car salesman said "You really want this car don't you?" And you said "No..." And he tried again later : "But it's really fast, and has shiny wheels! Let's go inside and sign the paperwork." And you went in and did it although you already said "No" doesn't mean you were conned. If you didn't want it, you keep saying no until they get it, or you leave.. Simple as that.

I'm surprised that you honestly don't get this.

This.

 

[fskimospy]

And from your response I am pretty sure you have never been in a relationship longer than 1 year. Unless he used some other form of intimidation, as soon as she let him take off her panties, that is consent.

I am zero percent surprised by your response.

According to you dumbasses it is the woman's responsibility to stop the man from taking her pants off, not his responsibility not to do it.

This thread is amazing. It really separates out the total shit stains.

 

[fskimospy]

This is one of those threads where you realize just how much this is an all male tech board.

Not fighting someone off equals consent to sex? Talk about fucking creepy.

 

[Matt1970]

I am zero percent surprised by your response.

According to you dumbasses it is the woman's responsibility to stop the man from taking her pants off, not his responsibility not to do it.

This thread is amazing. It really separates out the total shit stains.

This is a pretty big clue "I was just tired and wanted to go to bed. I let him finish." Get the picture? She let him have sex with her. I don't know what kind of relationship you have but when my ole' lady lets me take her panties off, that means yes. It's a pretty universal agreement.

 

[nehalem256]

I am zero percent surprised by your response.

According to you dumbasses it is the woman's responsibility to stop the man from taking her pants off, not his responsibility not to do it.

This thread is amazing. It really separates out the total shit stains.

No. We are saying that if you get in bed with a man, whom you have been hooking up with for months, and he starts taking off your clothes you should probably do something to indicate you don't want to have sex with him, if you don't want sex.

 

[Matt1970]

This is one of those threads where you realize just how much this is an all male tech board.

Not fighting someone off equals consent to sex? Talk about fucking creepy.

Oh stick it up your ass. Telling someone no a second time or even grabbing their hand as they start to take off your panties is not fighting them off. If he forced her panties off than ya, you have assault, but she let him. You know damn well in the back of your mind that is what happened.

 

[Paratus]

Well Matt, Nehalem, BrandonB and Jasklas have taught me something valuable tonight.

I never understood why conservative candidates kept trying to talk down rape. I now realize it's because a large portion of conservatives actually ARE RAPISTS.

So Matt tell us about these "relationships" you've had where you've taken a girls clothes off after she said no. Please provide names dates and places.

 

[OBLAMA2009]

ive noticed a lot of the college rape victims who speak out are these diesel looking chicks, it almost like they went out and did something so they would have that to be activist or something

http://news.kron4.com/news/video-st...andling-of-sexual-assault-case-standwithleah/

 

[Paratus]

I am zero percent surprised by your response.

According to you dumbasses it is the woman's responsibility to stop the man from taking her pants off, not his responsibility not to do it.

This thread is amazing. It really separates out the total shit stains.

Oh stick it up your ass. Telling someone no a second time or even grabbing their hand as they start to take off your panties is not fighting them off. If he forced her panties off than ya, you have assault, but she let him. You know damn well in the back of your mind that is what happened.

Quick eskimospy! You better say no now and again a little later or Matt's going to take that as consent to stick something up your ass!

 

[Zaap]

It's bizarre watching a bunch of clueless leftwing creeps that it's painfully obvious have never gotten laid argue this subject. What a freakshow.

 

[Darwin333]

Well except for the whole letting the dude undress her part.

What does that have to do with her saying no to sex? Are you implying that at a certain point that a woman should be compelled to have sex with a man (or woman for that matter)? What if she let you watch her undress herself, is that an irrevocable "yes" for sex? Is there a time period that said yes is good for or can the guy come back a few days later and get what was evidently already "agreed to"?

 

[Paratus]

It's bizarre watching a bunch of clueless leftwing creeps that it's painfully obvious have never gotten laid argue this subject. What a freakshow.

Nothing like watching a bunch of rightwing assholes being rapist apologists.

When you do finally get a date, make sure you tell her dad that as a "real man" unless she fights you off your having sex with her whether she says no or not.

 

[nehalem256]

What does that have to do with her saying no to sex? Are you implying that at a certain point that a woman should be compelled to have sex with a man (or woman for that matter)? What if she let you watch her undress herself, is that an irrevocable "yes" for sex? Is there a time period that said yes is good for or can the guy come back a few days later and get what was evidently already "agreed to"?

If you don't know what taking off a girl's clothes has to do with sex I suggest consulting some pornography to elucidate you on the subject.