Possibly the most important science breakthrough happened today (not really)

[Born2bwire]

What's this? Oh, he's still scamming people. Right, back to the real world.

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

Yes, exactly. I thought it was hilarious when Defkalion basically painted Rossi's stuff as unsafe after they had that issue (melted something). They also openly admitted they don't even know what is going on inside their system, but they're saying theirs is so much safer than Rossi's? Of course they claim they have safety systems that will shutdown the reaction whereas Rossi doesn't.

Likewise to him talking about safety at the end of the Ted talk video. He acts like he was so concerned, but they went through those early experiments without the shielding (he says they added lead sheeting later)? Seriously, they think they have a nuclear reaction and they have it contained in some pipes and rubber hoses?

Plus if you read that link I posted, you'll see he writes about the radiation and how the "shielding" shown on Rossi's stuff would not hold up to even the radiation he mentions. It also touches on the copper "proof" and how they can rig it to produce heat after its supposedly turned off (big surprise, it wouldn't take much).

Speaking of turning it off, how do they do it? Can't just flick a switch, because a process that's more than 100% efficient would be kind of self-sustaining, wouldn't it? And if they don't actually know how it works, how do they know what to do to turn it off?

And people - please quit saying that "an independent" validation of the result is needed...It is not true and it is not going to happen.
Poor Fleischmann–Pons were trying that "independent validation" route and look what happened. They got totally discredited and LENR got shelved for 20 years - because of few troll scientists with a hidden agenda. In case of LENR the regular "peer review" process has failed and it should NOT be used.

Excuse me? What Pons and Fleischmann proved was that the peer review process worked perfectly.

 

[Born2bwire]

Excuse me? What Pons and Fleischmann proved was that the peer review process worked perfectly.

Exactly. The lesson from Pons and Fleishchmann is not to do EXACTLY WHAT THE OP AND ROSSI ARE DOING. Pons and Fleischmann's work was released to the media and whipped up into a frenzy before there was time for the scientific community to digest the results and try and replicate the experiments. When they were able to do so, they all came up with null results.

 

[LOL_Wut_Axel]

LOL, I can't come to terms with how some people still believe this crap.

 

[sdifox]

LOL, I can't come to terms with how some people still believe this crap.

Philosopher' stone exists I tell ya.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I have been reading about cold fusion and the Fleischmann–Pons experiment.

I am amazed by reading about the Mössbauer effect. That gamma rays can be produced inside a solid and absorbed again in that same solid. Also amazing is that the transmitting atom experiences a recoil effect.

But to return to the subject of cold fusion or LENR (Low Energy Nuclear Reactions) :

I have this`from the wikipedia :

Martin Fleischmann of the University of Southampton and Stanley Pons of the University of Utah hypothesized that the high compression ratio and mobility of deuterium that could be achieved within palladium metal using electrolysis might result in nuclear fusion.[22] To investigate, they conducted electrolysis experiments using a palladium cathode and heavy water within a calorimeter, an insulated vessel designed to measure process heat. Current was applied continuously for many weeks, with the heavy water being renewed at intervals.[22] Some deuterium was thought to be accumulating within the cathode, but most was allowed to bubble out of the cell, joining oxygen produced at the anode.[23] For most of the time, the power input to the cell was equal to the calculated power leaving the cell within measurement accuracy, and the cell temperature was stable at around 30 °C. But then, at some point (in some of the experiments), the temperature rose suddenly to about 50 °C without changes in the input power. These high temperature phases would last for two days or more and would repeat several times in any given experiment once they had occurred. The calculated power leaving the cell was significantly higher than the input power during these high temperature phases. Eventually the high temperature phases would no longer occur within a particular cell.

You know what i have to think about when reading this ?
Cosmic rays bombarding from a source in space.
Or neutrinos bombarding the earth from a source in space.
It reads as a spurious event.

Has there ever been checked if at the times these so called anomalous temperature peaks would arise, there was an increase of neutrinos bombarding the earth ? Perhaps from solar activity ?
There is research done that atomic clock decay can vary depending on the activity of the sun. Another interesting perspective is the comparison of cosmic ray activity during the Fleischmann–Pons experiments.

It should be possible to check if such a setup as described in the Fleischmann–Pons experiment, would start to exhibit similar behavior, the 50 degrees celcius peaks, when bombarded in a particle accelerator.

It would mean it is not really a dead end, but that the magic can be found in high power nuclear particles.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I just found this in the article : Muon-catalyzed fusion.

Could these muons be present in cosmic rays ? No but it seems that when cosmic rays hit atmospheric gases, muons can be produced.

Could the spurious events from the Fleischmann–Pons experiment, be caused by muon-catalyzed fusion ? And the muons being produced by random cosmic rays hitting the earth ? This could very well explain these anomalous events.
It may very well be that more of these experiments may have had some nuclear process started because of highly energetic particles form space.

Then it is a dead end. Because we need to input a lot of power to generate such particles.

 

[adlep]

New Conference about LENR

All presentations are great, but the demo by Prof Hagelstein is especially interesting.
He claims energy gain of 14x and an ability to repeat the result.

http://theatomunexplored.com/?page_id=74

 

[sdifox]

even bigger news. I have discovered a method to harness the enormous hot air output of snake oil salesmen and provide free power!

 

[adlep]

even bigger news. I have discovered a method to harness the enormous hot air output of snake oil salesmen and provide free power!

This has nothing to do with Rossi. One of the presenter is a Prof. Paul Hagelstein from MIT. But I guess it des not matter what I type, what I say, and what kind of material I'll point to. It will be always called a fraud and apparently no one will bother to look at it.
Mr. Hagelstein conducts his research independently from Rossi.

Mr. Hagelstein claims COP of 14 and the duration of experiment is 1000 times higher that possible out of any chemical reaction.

Also, he states:

There are many other experiments on my wish list, one is to do a replication of the Piantelli experiment which I consider to be one of the most important experiments that’s out there in the field. And there are many other things on the list.”

“The other issue is how to get support for such work. In the United States at the moment, outside of a program under Dennis Bushnell at NASA there is no, currently as far as I’m aware, there is no other government support for any work in this area for such experiments. I recently had the experience of working with a large company in the U.S. who’s interested in pursuing experiments in this area and helping out. So we put in, we discussed with the technical people at this company of the possibility that they might put in some money for the support of the replication of the Piantelli experiment. So they got the agreement, they got the money, they got it to MIT, and we thought: good, now we can make some progress.

However, a very famous physicist at MIT who is involved in the energy program found out what we were trying to do, and he cancelled the program and he called up the vice president of the company and said some things that weren’t very polite about the research. And not only did the funding not come and the experiments didn’t happen, but my colleagues at the company were very worried about where the’re going to work next. As you know, there’re unemployment issues currently in our bad economy, so there’s a fundamental difficulty with respect to getting support for the experiments, and what that means is that the science can be expected to go very slowly for these reasons, until a solution is found to this problem.”

Cliffs: Prof Hagelstein claims a major scientific fraud and that is why so called "peer-review" process is impossible.

But do not take MY word for it, see the presentations for yourself and interpret the results for yourself. Do not let anybody tell you what to think...
http://theatomunexplored.com/?page_id=74

 

[halik]

Are you being paid by the scam artists?

 

[Born2bwire]

Bullshit. It's dirty disingenuous associations like this that make Rossi's scams work. NASA's legitimate research into LENR in no way legitimizes Rossi. Trying to associate it with Rossi is just another way that he is able to gull people into such scams.

What's this? A new update. This still seems relevant so I'll just keep quoting my previous statements.

 

[PowerEngineer]

Yet another update that consists of presentations made by believers to other believers. More claims; no more proof.

Peter Hagelstein is not exactly a new voice for cold fusion. Here's a link to a Washington Post article from seven years ago that contains the same kind of "any day now" promises featuring Hagelstein.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A54964-2004Nov16_2.html

And quite clearly he hasn't produced that "science breakthrough" since he took up the cold fusion crusade in 1990.

And I find this amusing (where ever it came from)

"However, a very famous physicist at MIT who is involved in the energy program found out what we were trying to do, and he cancelled the program and he called up the vice president of the company and said some things that weren’t very polite about the research. And not only did the funding not come and the experiments didn’t happen, but my colleagues at the company were very worried about where the’re going to work next. As you know, there’re unemployment issues currently in our bad economy, so there’s a fundamental difficulty with respect to getting support for the experiments, and what that means is that the science can be expected to go very slowly for these reasons, until a solution is found to this problem.”

This isn't a "problem". I am not surprised that those who are responsible for the wise use of MIT funding might be dismayed to find it earmarked for more cold fusion investigations instead of other more promising areas of research. I'll also observe that it couldn't have been a very "large company" if the loss of this funding becomes an immediate employment issue.

 

[adlep]

This isn't a "problem". I am not surprised that those who are responsible for the wise use of MIT funding might be dismayed to find it earmarked for more cold fusion investigations instead of other more promising areas of research. I'll also observe that it couldn't have been a very "large company" if the loss of this funding becomes an immediate employment issue.

He actually got the grant dedicated for this specific purpose from the company. So he was not jeopardizing the research budget; quite to the contrary. He was getting additional funds FOR the MIT and into the research pool.

And quite clearly he hasn't produced that "science breakthrough" since he took up the cold fusion crusade in 1990.

He did according to the presentation. COP of 14 is a great result.

Yet another update that consists of presentations made by believers to other believers. More claims; no more proof.

These people are scientists. They do what typical scientist do - conducting experiments and sharing their data/findings. Also, the general public is welcome to checkout the still running experiment (since January) in Prof Hagelstein's lab (proof?).

 

[Double Trouble]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. The same flim flam that parted people from their money 400 years ago gets updated to modern science and continues to be effective.

Until I see actual evidence, verified by independent labs and reproduced by the scientific community at large, this is bullshit.

 

[Jeffg010]

Anther sighting of Bigfoot I mean cold fusion bla bla bla....

 

[0roo0roo]

Are you being paid by the scam artists?

yea gotta wonder

if this guy were so awesome he'd be kidnapped by the chinese by now.

 

[PowerEngineer]

He actually got the grant dedicated for this specific purpose from the company. So he was not jeopardizing the research budget; quite to the contrary. He was getting additional funds FOR the MIT and into the research pool.

If I got this backwards, the I apologize. However, if this unnamed company was providing all the research funds and the researchers (i.e. the colleagues worried about unemployement), then it makes no sense to claim that MIT's withdrawal is the reason that the "experiments didn't happen". It's more logical to conclude that MIT was on the hook to provide significant funds, facilities, and/or people.

He did according to the presentation. COP of 14 is a great result.

...according to the presentation... Sorry. Powerpoint does not make it true.

These people are scientists. They do what typical scientist do - conducting experiments and sharing their data/findings. Also, the general public is welcome to checkout the still running experiment (since January) in Prof Hagelstein's lab (proof?).

What "these people" are is still up for debate. "Typical scientists" provide detailed descriptions of the experiments they run and the results they produce, knowing that replication by other scientists is a key to establishing scientific truth. Why are "these people" unwilling or unable to do this?

And I can't help adding this quote from Peter Hagelstein in the course description for his non-credit short course on cold fusion. In answer to the question of whether or not the course would address Rossi's work, he said:

“I would expect to mention Rossi briefly. But my part of this is intended to be scientific, and there is very little available from Rossi that is of scientific value. For example, there is no useful description of the experiment. There is no reliable data. There is no reliable assay of samples before and after. There are no scientific papers of high quality that I can direct people interested to.

http://www.infinite-energy.com/iemagazine/issue101/mit.html

It seems that even some true believers have trouble believing Rossi.

 

[adlep]

Speaking of Rossi,
Here is a newest flyer about 1MW ECat produced by his Australian subsidy:

http://www.fusor.net/board/getfile.php?bn=fusor_other&att_id=9525 (pdf link)

 

[Number1]

Speaking of Rossi,
Here is a newest flyer about 1MW ECat produced by his Australian subsidy:

http://www.fusor.net/board/getfile.php?bn=fusor_other&att_id=9525 (pdf link)

"The E-Cat technology works by taking a small amount of micron sized nickel
powder, applying a catalyst, putting it all in a pressurized hydrogen
atmosphere, and applying heat to the setup. Truly novel nuclear reactions
start to take place between the nickel and hydrogen atoms, and the result is
a huge release of energy."

Now I got it, it's because it's a truly novel nuclear reaction.

Seriously, why in the world do you spread this manure?

Serious question here, are there any ecat generator installed anywhere in the world?

Let me guess, no?

 

[sdifox]

My hot air power generator is better!

 

[sdifox]

http://www.lifeslittlemysteries.com/2143-cat-cold-fusion-machine-claims-fraud-heating.html

 

[sdifox]

http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/03/10/rossis-financial-and-environmental-criminal-history/

scammer will always be scammer

 

[sdifox]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/markgibbs/2012/02/14/e-cat-proof-challenge-1000000-is-a-clownerie/

Think about it, dick smith is building Titanic 2 and offered 1M challenge to Rossi and Rossi pounded sand.

 

[sdifox]

See? I can find URLs too.