[pcper] frame metering review 690 vs. 7970 CF vs. Titan

[Fx1]

Thats great, I also have Farcry3 set up for 60fps vsync at 1440p ultra with 4xMSAA and it never dips below 60 either. Well actually 59 as I use a 59fps cap + vsync. Still doesnt have anything to do with scenarios when I want 125 or 250 fps caps, use 120hz, eyefinity etc.

Point is your solution doesnt offer any flexibility. You are basically saying if you want 7970CFX you are limited to 60fps vsync, on a single display unless you lower your settings right down in many games.

Fact is that you are unlikely to hit 120FPS consistently on any game such as Far Cry 3. I have seen 3 card setups not getting passed 90fps.

The only way you will get 120fps is that you cut down the settings.

This still doesnt explain how your going to deal with the insane screen tearing. Imagine the screen tearing on 3 monitors all at once lol.

 

[omeds]

Frame caps reduce tearing vastly. A 125 or 250 fps cap helps immensly, plus 120hz doesnt really need vsync imo. In a single player game like FC3, I think a 59fps cap + vsync is fine, but in MP games like BF3 its not a solution.

 

[Imouto]

Frame caps reduce tearing vastly. A 125 or 250 fps cap helps immensly, plus 120hz doesnt really need vsync imo. In a single player game like FC3, I think a 59fps cap + vsync is fine, but in MP games like BF3 its not a solution.

Can you please stop posting nosense? 59 fps cap + vsync guarantees crappy gameplay.

This is far worse than believing that those graphs posted by Balla could fit into a vsync enabled bench.

 

[omeds]

Can you please stop posting nosense? 59 fps cap + vsync guarantees crappy gameplay.

In what way does it guarantee crappy gameplay? It greatly reduces vsync input lag, aswell as greatly reducing microstutter which is often still present even with vsync at 60fps for whatever reason.

 

[Imouto]

In what way does it guarantee crappy gameplay? It greatly reduces vsync input lag, aswell as greatly reducing microstutter which is often still present even with vsync at 60fps for whatever reason.

If you cap your framerate to 59 fps and enable vsync your framerate is actually perma 30 fps with 1 extra frame of input lag.

 

[omeds]

No it doesn't with MGPU. The 59 fps cap actually reduces vsync input lag too.

 

[Imouto]

I think you don't even know how vsync works. For once check PCPer results with multi GPU and vsync enabled and what happens when your game dips bellow 60 fps. Your effective fps are 30 fps full stop.

 

[omeds]

No thats not true with SLI. Inspector even recommends 58 fps cap for use with 60hz vsync to remove input lag, and that's without triple buffering. Don't worry about me, I know what I'm doing.

 

[Fx1]

Frame caps reduce tearing vastly. A 125 or 250 fps cap helps immensly, plus 120hz doesnt really need vsync imo. In a single player game like FC3, I think a 59fps cap + vsync is fine, but in MP games like BF3 its not a solution.

How does a 125 or 250 cap help? I have never seen FPS that high in modern games.

 

[omeds]

It just does, its common knowledge among competitive gamers.

You will notice UE3 games have a 62 fps frame smoothening limit by default too, which does the same thing yet half as effective. Basically 62, 125, and 250 are the best values to use, but 62 isnt very good. 125 is pretty good. 250 is golden.

 

[Imouto]

What a load of bullshit. The frame smoothering parameter in the UE3 just takes away some details to raise the fps.

Looks like competitive gamers are a bunch of superstitious grannies.

I also don't know the issues a game may have to require <60 fps cap + vsync. It looks awfully retarded to me, seriously.

 

[Lonyo]

Competitive gamers don't play with everything on max settings, they play with everything on the most useful settings based on their own preferences.

 

[Fx1]

It just does, its common knowledge among competitive gamers.

You will notice UE3 games have a 62 fps frame smoothening limit by default too, which does the same thing yet half as effective. Basically 62, 125, and 250 are the best values to use, but 62 isnt very good. 125 is pretty good. 250 is golden.

i fail to see how a cap on FPS thats 125 or 250 has any effect on games when their FPS doesnt get anywhere near that cap

 

[omeds]

What a load of bullshit. The frame smoothering parameter in the UE3 just takes away some details to raise the fps.

Looks like competitive gamers are a bunch of superstitious grannies.

I also don't know the issues a game may have to require <60 fps cap + vsync. It looks awfully retarded to me, seriously.

No its not bullshit, you are just uninformed like your comments on vsync at the top of the page.

There are two frame smoothening settings in UE3 games, a min and a max. The max is usually 62 by default which is simply a frame cap.

No competitive gamers arent "superstitious grannies", they have been using 125 and 250 fps caps since quake 1 because it has very real benefits. Google it.

Theres plenty of games that benefit from a 59fps cap + vsync, Metro 2033 comes to mind when using MGPU.
Theres a reason the option in inspector specifically states it reduces vsync input lag too, and I tend to believe my own experience and the designers of inspector, plus over a decade of common knowledge, instead of you.

 

[omeds]

i fail to see how a cap on FPS thats 125 or 250 has any effect on games when their FPS doesnt get anywhere near that cap

What do you mean when their fps doesnt get anywhere near that cap? I sit on a solid 125 in BF3 and it doesnt fluctuate. I use 250 in CoD and CSS and it doesnt fluctuate.

But you're right, if you cant mainatian that cap its useless, the idea is to be able to maintain that cap.

 

[Fx1]

No its not bullshit, you are just uninformed like your comments on vsync at the top of the page.

There are two frame smoothening settings in UE3 games, a min and a max. The max is usually 62 by default which is simply a frame cap.

No competitive gamers arent "superstitious grannies", they have been using 125 and 250 fps caps since quake 1 because it has very real benefits. Google it.

Theres plenty of games that benefit from a 59fps cap + vsync, Metro 2033 comes to mind when using MGPU.
Theres a reason the option in inspector specifically states it reduces vsync input lag too, and I tend to believe my own experience and the designers of inspector, plus over a decade of common knowledge, instead of you.

What a load of crap.

Some older games used to have problems when clients ran at 250fps because clips would unload faster than they should. Server limits were put in place at 125 fps and 250 fps by the servers.

The 59 FPS cap makes sense because your monitor is 59.xx hz and thats why 60fps can cause problems.

 

[Fx1]

What do you mean when their fps doesnt get anywhere near that cap? I sit on a solid 125 in BF3 and it doesnt fluctuate. I use 250 in CoD and CSS and it doesnt fluctuate.

But you're right, if you cant mainatian that cap its useless, the idea is to be able to maintain that cap.

No monitor can run at 250hz as far as i know. So what are you gaining?

What resolution and settings do you use with what setup to get 125fps in BF3?

 

[omeds]

Whats crap about it?

 

[omeds]

No monitor can run at 250hz as far as i know. So what are you gaining?

What resolution and settings do you use with what setup to get 125fps in BF3?

You gain much smoother and far more responsive gameplay, with virtually no tearing while not using vsync. There are other benefits too like improved hit rego in conjuction swith tweaked update rates to match your frame rate, aswell as other things.

Try it yourself, load up CSS and set fps_max 250 in console, if you can maintain it without fluctuating.


In BF3 I use ultra settings, 4xMSAA + 4xtrSSAA at 120hz 1080p, or sometimes 60hz 1440p if I cant be bothered swapping displays. I have mesh quality on medium though because it taxes the CPU, and if any higher I couldnt maintain 125 on 64 player servers due to my CPU not being fast enough.

 

[Fx1]

You gain much smoother and far more responsive gameplay, with virtually no tearing while not using vsync. There are other benefits too like improved hit rego in conjuction swith tweaked update rates to match your frame rate, aswell as other things.

Try it yourself, load up CSS and set fps_max 250 in console, if you can maintain it without fluctuating.


In BF3 I use ultra settings, 4xMSAA + 4xtrSSAA at 120hz 1080p, or sometimes 60hz 1440p if I cant be bothered swapping displays. I have mesh quality on medium though because it taxes the CPU, and if any higher I couldnt maintain 125 on 64 player servers due to my CPU not being fast enough.

you will get tearing though at a rate of at least 1 tear per frame in CSS. Im assuming your trying to make the game engine update at 250 times per second? This might have benefits maybe with hit detection.

I doubt BF3 will benefit much from this since hit detection generally sucks.

 

[omeds]

Doubt it all you like but every game benefits from it. Like I said it gives you smoother motion, vastly reduced tearing, far more responsive gameplay, better hit rego and a few other benefits. Its not new, people have been doing it for like 15 years.

BF3 at 120hz with a cap is utra smooth and crystal clear in motion, even 60hz with vsync looks juddery in comparison.

 

[Fx1]

Doubt it all you like but every game benefits from it. Like I said it gives you smoother motion, vastly reduced tearing, far more responsive gameplay, better hit rego and a few other benefits. Its not new, people have been doing it for like 15 years.

BF3 at 120hz with a cap is utra smooth and crystal clear in motion, even 60hz with vsync looks juddery in comparison.

Your talking about 120hz motion. Everyone knows this is smoother than 60hz.

250 FPS wont improve smoothness at all. It will just add screen tearing.

Hit detection is far more complex and not always affected by FPS. There is latency in the system which far negates any improvement from FPS

The Median reaction time for humans is 215ms....

 

[omeds]

It does add smoothness. Due to the cap, the frames are kind of synced in multiples with the refresh rate. My comment about 120hz was just to show that using a cap without vsync at 120hz makes even 60hz with vsync look juddery, which should look smooth due to vsync.

As for hit detection, as I said earlier you set update rates, packets etc to match your frame rates. This results in the best hit rego when there are updates to match every frame, or every second frame depending on the fps cap you use (125 or 250).

Like I said its not new, its common knowledge, I'm guessing you're a bit of a n00b with online gaming if you havent heard of it before, but thats fine I'm not knocking you, its just your inexperience shows.

 

[Imouto]

No its not bullshit, you are just uninformed like your comments on vsync at the top of the page.

There are two frame smoothening settings in UE3 games, a min and a max. The max is usually 62 by default which is simply a frame cap.

Oh, sorry. Didn't know you were going to doublecap your fps.

No competitive gamers arent "superstitious grannies", they have been using 125 and 250 fps caps since quake 1 because it has very real benefits. Google it.

Theres plenty of games that benefit from a 59fps cap + vsync, Metro 2033 comes to mind when using MGPU.
Theres a reason the option in inspector specifically states it reduces vsync input lag too, and I tend to believe my own experience and the designers of inspector, plus over a decade of common knowledge, instead of you.

Diminishing returns and placebo, gaming 101.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Diminishing returns and placebo, gaming 101.

Kind of like the placebo effect of CF, when it's not diminishing gameplay with stutter?