Good point about Denmark and it's monarchy, I did not know that. However I don't see this as an issue about abusing the freedom of press to be disrespectful anymore. It is now more about the fact that free societies should not tolerate someone using or suggesting the use of violent force to restrict their freedoms. When other newspapers reprint the offending images I think they should put them into context and state that they are publishing them as a show of support for freedom of the press, and that they will not be bullied by religious fanatics.
Good point about Denmark and it's monarchy, I did not know that. However I don't see this as an issue about abusing the freedom of press to be disrespectful anymore. It is now more about the fact that free societies should not tolerate someone using or suggesting the use of violent force to restrict their freedoms. When other newspapers reprint the offending images I think they should put them into context and state that they are publishing them as a show of support for freedom of the press, and that they will not be bullied by religious fanatics.
Though I say that's taking the situation a little too far, I don't say it might not happen. It's a sad day that in the modern world people still have enemies, and unfortunately it had to start with fundamentalists. Would this world be different if there were no muslim extremists? I don't think so, as humans will be humans; someone's bound to incite something.
So in the signed letter the joint cheifs threatened to kill the publisher, her family and everyone at the paper right? I mean you want it to be comparible so I'm SURE you chose a similar level of outrage, right?
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
Sigh... does the US have only ONE church that is eligible for the property tax exemption? Does the US have ONE church that is considered to THE state church, and the authority for Congress?Originally posted by: 1prophet
Actually it is an indirect tax.
Section II. Status of Religious Freedom
The Constitution stipulates that the Evangelical Lutheran Church is the national church, the reigning monarch shall be a member the church, and the state shall support it. The Evangelical Lutheran Church is the only religious organization that can receive state subsidies or funds directly through the tax system. Approximately 12 percent of the Church's revenue comes from state subsidies; most of the rest comes from the church tax that is paid only by members. No individual may be compelled to pay church tax or provide direct financial support to the national church or any other religious organization. Members of other faiths, notably Catholics, have argued that the system is unfair, and that the Government does not provide religious equality, despite providing religious freedom. Allowing other religious organizations to be given the same status and privileges as the Evangelical Lutheran Church would require changes to the Constitution.
Their is a similar indirect tax in the United States, not so much on the national level but on the local and state levels. Religious groups are exempt from property taxes forcing those who do pay to make up the difference. In some cases it is significant.
To pay for the schools as well as services offered by the city and county, property taxes are high. Yet, property amounting to 47 percent of the value of all the buildings and land within the city limits is not taxed at all.
Tax exemption of churches raises two conflicting concerns. One is that the exemption might be considered a subsidy and therefore might establish the exempted religion as an arm or endorsed faith of the state. The second is that if tax exemptions were not granted, the expense of paying taxes might inhibit the free exercise of religion by making that exercise unaffordable
The town of Fallsburg in New York State has 40 percent nontaxable property, much of it from religious organizations.
I wonder when an atheist is going to successfully take this all the way to the Supreme Court and win?
No.
Any "church" can get the tax exemption in the US, from Christians to Muslims to Jews to Buddhists to radical cults to even atheist organizations (if they so choose and qualify).
Now, how is that similar to the situation in Denmark? Or were you just pounding your own pulpit?
I doubt that, The state does collect taxes for the church here in Germany too. However, only if you are member of a church (Baptized). So you only have to pay the church taxes if you are member of a tax collecting church (in Germany: Lutheran and Catholic)
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,026
- 559
- 126
I looked for those cartoons on the 'net, and i found a few, but I'm not sure if they're the ones in cause... probaly not. But the following are fun, anyway:
http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/file13/319648 (there's a navigation option, for more stuff)
Aaah, here's the real thing, the controversial cartoons... enjoy!
http://islamcomicbook.com/pdfs/MBOE.pdf
http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/file13/319648 (there's a navigation option, for more stuff)
Aaah, here's the real thing, the controversial cartoons... enjoy!
http://islamcomicbook.com/pdfs/MBOE.pdf
New reuters link.
This is why I think the european newsagencies must not bow down. I can agree with the idea that it was disrecpectful to print images that would knowingly offend muslims, but now its about making them recognize that murder (or calls to murder) of those that offend you is not tolerated in free societies. They should not let a repeat of the Rushdie case happen again, where virtually no one came to his support.
This is why I think the european newsagencies must not bow down. I can agree with the idea that it was disrecpectful to print images that would knowingly offend muslims, but now its about making them recognize that murder (or calls to murder) of those that offend you is not tolerated in free societies. They should not let a repeat of the Rushdie case happen again, where virtually no one came to his support.
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,026
- 559
- 126
biostud
Lifer
- Feb 27, 2003
- 19,966
- 7,058
- 136
The monarchy has nothing to do with this. They're completely non political and don't have any power. It's like a living museum. And while we have a state church you don't have to be a member and you can go your tax office and renounce paying the church tax very easily. I've done it and there were no problems. So while it officially looks very christian in reality it's not. In most churches the sunday service has less 20 visitors.
If a bully calls a person names and makes jokes about his shoes is the person justified to retaliate by murdering the bully? Thats what this is now about, the message needs to be sent that you can't murder everyone who offends your beliefs or does not share your beliefs.
Originally posted by: Vic
Sigh... does the US have only ONE church that is eligible for the property tax exemption? Does the US have ONE church that is considered to THE state church, and the authority for Congress?Originally posted by: 1prophet
Actually it is an indirect tax.
Section II. Status of Religious Freedom
The Constitution stipulates that the Evangelical Lutheran Church is the national church, the reigning monarch shall be a member the church, and the state shall support it. The Evangelical Lutheran Church is the only religious organization that can receive state subsidies or funds directly through the tax system. Approximately 12 percent of the Church's revenue comes from state subsidies; most of the rest comes from the church tax that is paid only by members. No individual may be compelled to pay church tax or provide direct financial support to the national church or any other religious organization. Members of other faiths, notably Catholics, have argued that the system is unfair, and that the Government does not provide religious equality, despite providing religious freedom. Allowing other religious organizations to be given the same status and privileges as the Evangelical Lutheran Church would require changes to the Constitution.
Their is a similar indirect tax in the United States, not so much on the national level but on the local and state levels. Religious groups are exempt from property taxes forcing those who do pay to make up the difference. In some cases it is significant.
To pay for the schools as well as services offered by the city and county, property taxes are high. Yet, property amounting to 47 percent of the value of all the buildings and land within the city limits is not taxed at all.
Tax exemption of churches raises two conflicting concerns. One is that the exemption might be considered a subsidy and therefore might establish the exempted religion as an arm or endorsed faith of the state. The second is that if tax exemptions were not granted, the expense of paying taxes might inhibit the free exercise of religion by making that exercise unaffordable
The town of Fallsburg in New York State has 40 percent nontaxable property, much of it from religious organizations.
I wonder when an atheist is going to successfully take this all the way to the Supreme Court and win?
No.
Any "church" can get the tax exemption in the US, from Christians to Muslims to Jews to Buddhists to radical cults to even atheist organizations (if they so choose and qualify).
Now, how is that similar to the situation in Denmark? Or were you just pounding your own pulpit?
All approved churches in Denmark are exempt from various taxes, including property tax, as well. What they don't have, is the equivalent of the "IRS" handling the administrative burden of collecting member-taxes. Now I'm not in the mood for translating the list from danish to english, but I'm sure we can agree that the list is non-empty, and it includes Christian(Kristne), Islamic(Isalmiske), Jewish(Jødiske), Buddhist (Budhistiske) ones like you mentioned above, plus various others.
German citizen kidnapped by Palestinian gunmen in Nablus
So they are kidnapping an innocent German citizen as a retaliation? Great... :thumbsdown:
update: he was freed.
So they are kidnapping an innocent German citizen as a retaliation? Great... :thumbsdown:
update: he was freed.
I (and several others) asked you several times and you never provided a shred of proof. If you will do so now, it would be good.
Exactly. I am of Danish descent and have many relatives who still live in Denmark (one of whom is, I am told, the youngest member of Parliament, although I'm still a little sketchy on the Danish political system), and it's not a monarchy by any strech of the imagination, nor is the "state church" an entity that commands anything like real power.
My take on this whole thing: If the New York Times published a picture of me taking a dump on a nativity scene, three quarters of the US would go absolutely nuts. It's the same thing.
So according to your thinking we should teach people not to bully by calling them names? I'm confused.
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,026
- 559
- 126
ughhh... dude, read the thread, i posted two links alreadyOriginally posted by: Aimster
Can someone show me a picture of this cartoon?
I want to see
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 25K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 23K
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
-
Facebook
Twitter