Palestinians say Netanyahu speech obstacle to peace

[Zebo]

Arabs stole it in the first place.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_conquests

 

[Abwx]

Arabs stole it in the first place.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_conquests

Yet, spaniards are still spaniards, algerians are still berbers
and iranians are still persians..

Amazingly, Spain s Cordoba became the capital of the west side
of the colored parts..
Indeed, it would be very insightfull to read about Spain s
"invasion", wich you have not, of course...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Andalus

Had ever an inhabited country colonised by an european country
been made the most rich part of the said empire?...

What did France or UK with her African or India possessions?..
Truth is that they invaded only too grab the ressources, as
is currently doing the US that himself started its history
with the indian genocide...
How many people killed?..ho, there were no statistics..

 

[EagleKeeper]

All 4 CC arguments are complete bullshit.

But still somewhat weird arguments. Based on the dubious argument that if somewhat Israel can maintain that The Arabs and Pals have had past misbehavior, Israel is therefore justified in being even bigger rat finks.

<snip>

How far back does one need to go to look at Palestinian past behavior and then choose to forgive/forget? The Palestinians are not Christians nor are the Jews. "forgive them for they do not know what they did" does not work here.

Attacks from Gaza still continue. Gaza is controlled by a group that sits in the "new" Palestinian government

Protests incited by the Palestinians still call for the destruction of Israel.

This month. Should they be ignored?

The Palestinians are their own worst enemy in terms of becoming a state. A demanding attitude stating that you deserve something and ignoring requests to cleanup ones behavior is not going to get what you want. It may impress others in your gang; but the responsible adults are not amused by such behavior.


You can not handle the facts.

You claim that they are bull; yet where is the disclaimer proof. I have presented my proof. Now I will make the questions on the four items very clear and concise for your understanding.Feel free to use Google or Wiki to find your rebuttals; but provide the actual links and do not take words/phrases out of context.

• When did the Arabs/Palestinians allow the Jews to visit Jerusalem prior to the '67 conflict and after the Arabs were granted control of Jerusalem
  
• Were there not demonstrations incited by the Palestinians and attended by the Palestinians in the West Bank and Jordan that denounced Israel and stated that Israel should be wiped of the map?
  
• Were there not statements from Hamas regarding the plan issued immediately after the plan was presented. Did the plan get presented right after attacks on Israel by the Palestinians? Yet you say the Palestinians wanted peace with Israel? How do you spell peace? WAR or EXTERMINATION
  
• Is Hamas a part of the New Palestinian government. Has Hamas renounced it's goal of destroying Israel. Has Hamas stopped incidents from within Gaza against Israeli settlements.

In other words; if you can not refute what the Palestinians are doing based on facts - you again weave and dodge!

Your credibility is being sliced and diced every day that you continue to make up ideas on how to reinterpret events to meet your desired specifications.

Your arguments are always being shot down with actual facts/links/statements.

Hamas PM has no authority

What about Abbas not showing up for 8 months after Israel froze new settlement activity as requested by Abbas?
Why - because he did not have the authority to negotiate - he is/was a puppet, not a leader. You choose to deny/overlook that fact.

flotillas will be running the Israeli blockade escorted by the Turkish Navy.

When? It has been over a year - two sets of civilians only have come through; both intercepted.


When you can come into a thread with actual facts to back up your ideals; then worthwhile discussions can happen.
Until then; you are just a target of falsehoods and will continue to be attacked based on your track record.

At present; you have one outstanding prediction that is about to go up in smoke. You yourself are starting to realize it and have been back pedaling for the past month.

Those of us that are your "Israeli fan boys" are not going to allow you the luxury of ignoring your idiotic statements and will continue to expose you for what you are.

Note that no one else steps in to try to defend your position - that states something about your strength.

 

[JEDIYoda]

When you can come into a thread with factual acts to back up your ideals; then worthwhile discussions can happen.
Until then; you are just a target of falsehoods and will continue to be attacked based on your track record.

At present; you have one outstanding prediction that is about to go up in smoke. You yourself are starting to realize it and have been back pedaling for the past month.

Those of us that are your "Israeli fan boys" are not going to allow you the luxury of ignoring your idiotic statements and will continue to expose you for what you are.

Note that no one else steps in to try to defend your position - that states something about your strength.

It could be said that Lemon Law is the Palestinians worse enemy........lol

 

[Zebo]

Bibi raising the roof ::woot::

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=W0A8ySu0_xQ#at=48

You know that's gotta put a monkey in LL's jihad when Netanyahu got more standing ovations than Obama got for SOTU Address.

 

[Lemon law]

There have been and always will be orators and demagogs. Ole Hitler was among the best of that breed, got cheering crowds eating out if his hands, but at the end of day, things didn't work out too well for Adolph. Or we can cite Wallace who stood at a school house door screaming, segregation now segregation forever. The list of examples are endlessly long, but a gift for public speaking is a seldom a substitute for brains and wisdom.

 

[Zebo]

Wrong again. Adolfs book is bestseller in Muslim world. Gone but still revered by your pals (pun intended)

Or maybe it's just taking lessons how they can solve the "jewish problem" once and for all. Either way that should give you pause on who you support.

 

[EagleKeeper]

The message and delivery that the speaker puts out has much to do with the reception it receives

What Obama delivered did not make an impact.

What Bibi did, made an impact!

And the impact on congress is the telling issue for the future of Israeli and US relations.

Obama has to follow Congress politically on this issue or he will be dead meat. He started backpedaling immediately after the original screwed up speech. He knew what he said was wrong and not just potentially mi- interpreted. That is why the cleanup crew was out in force.

 

[Lemon law]

Its easy for the US congress to cheer NOW, what we in the USA don't know yet is how much will our totally one sided support of Israel cost us?

We cheered as a people going into Vietnam too, ditto Iraq, and Afghanistan. Now almost all of us have buyers regret as we are a hell of a lot poorer than before.

What diplomatic prices we in the US will have to pay in the future is yet to be known, so we will see.

 

[Lemon law]

Just to demonstrate that my thinking is shared within Israel, here is an article from Jpost.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Article.aspx?id=222086

Or this one from Haaretz.

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/strenger-than-fiction/netanyahu-s-win-is-israel-s-loss-1.364022

 

[Zebo]

There were Jews who openly collaborated with the Nazis so what? We call them useful idiots nowadays but you always have people like that. (cough) That is not the majority.

 

[lupi]

Has that betting window opened yet?

 

[EagleKeeper]

Its easy for the US congress to cheer NOW, what we in the USA don't know yet is how much will our totally one sided support of Israel cost us?

We cheered as a people going into Vietnam too, ditto Iraq, and Afghanistan. Now almost all of us have buyers regret as we are a hell of a lot poorer than before.

What diplomatic prices we in the US will have to pay in the future is yet to be known, so we will see.

Freedom does not come cheap.

What are we going to do, piss off the Arab community?:hmm:

They already are upset with us but ask for us to do their dirty work (ex: GW-1, Libya)

They can not afford an embargo of the US. They have tried before to manipulate oil prices and it burned them. Such affects the complete world- they was what happens to their investments when the economies tumble.

South America - their political influence is nill - Brazil has some economic influence but they do not want to destroy their economy if a fit of spite.

Europe - they are not going to do anything.

The Communist bloc -they think economicaly - their political influence is limited to their own sphere.

Asia - Japan and Korea have their own recoveries to worry about. They also have no interest in the ME other than what oil is on the way. They get a large amount from Alaska - closer than the ME supplies.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Just to demonstrate that my thinking is shared within Israel, here is an article from Jpost.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Article.aspx?id=222086

Or this one from Haaretz.

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/strenger-than-fiction/netanyahu-s-win-is-israel-s-loss-1.364022

And if you look at the comments within your links - not everyone agrees.

This is typical for any political issue within any country.

Some people to not see the same picture as the others. Understandable

But to ignore facts is different that how one interprets facts.

You ignore facts that will not meet your requirements.

 

[Lemon law]

Now CC states, "Freedom does not come cheap."

But ah yes that is the rub, freedom for whom? Hard to talk about Israeli freedom, when they totally oppress the Palestinians? Especially when we note Israel is doing it on lands it can never own, in a 44 year military occupation.

No one is questioning Israeli freedoms, after they return to their 1967 borders.

 

[Zebo]

They earned treatment with incessant attacks, cruelty from right when jews just got done being genocided, to their most holiest day, and rockets still fly today, and thier doctrine of hate. Everyone knows non violence is the way to go in 21st century but Muslims just can't control themselves and they get less and less every year because of it.

Here's what's really going to happen. Israel will stall Arab will go ape shit blow up some children more Israel gets more sympathy and takes over more property/fuck over pal rights more.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Now CC states, "Freedom does not come cheap."

But ah yes that is the rub, freedom for whom? Hard to talk about Israeli freedom, when they totally oppress the Palestinians? Especially when we note Israel is doing it on lands it can never own, in a 44 year military occupation.

No one is questioning Israeli freedoms, after they return to their 1967 borders.

The Arabs and Hamas seem to think otherwise.
The '67 borders are an excuse for the Arabs and Palestinians to avoid responsibility for their actions.

Israel oppress the Palestinians? It has been their choice to be "oppressed" by their actions taken.

They accepted Arab promises of total Jewish annihilation
They chose to have Arafat lead them and rob them. Arafat started the infadias. (sp)

Hamas chose to continue to attack Israel and have in their charter the destruction of Israel. The people of Gaza chose Hamas to lead them.

Egypt and Jordan force the Palestinians into the camps - not Israel.
The Arab states did not give nor promote a separate state for the Palestinians; instead promising that they would be able to have ALL of the Palestine Mandate for themselves. And the Palestinians decided that they should have it all.

The Palestinians could have had a free state of their own had they made proper choices. And they still can have one; but they chose to stay at war instead of peace.

And in doing so; it makes the prospects for peace harder; makes the possibility of a state harder; makes the amount of land less and increase the chances that when a state does happen, another war will break out that will damage the Palestinians even worse.

Instead of trying to blame Israel for the faults of the Arabs and Palestinians; one should present to them how their actions are affecting themselves.

 

[Portly Penguin]

I like how when Palestine retaliates against Israel it's "terrorism", but when Israel bulldozes Palestinian communities and bombs thousands of civilians on the US taxpayer's dime, they are "defending themselves".

 

[EagleKeeper]

I like how when Palestine retaliates against Israel it's "terrorism", but when Israel bulldozes Palestinian communities and bombs thousands of civilians on the US taxpayer's dime, they are "defending themselves".

Maybe the Palestinian militants should consider what the results of their actions will be.

They are not thinking for their community but for their own glory.

They do not care what happens to the population. They seem to think that the world is going to help them slay the big bad dragon.

They are warned well in advance what the repercussions will be and chose to continue down that path. and then they complain that Israel will not roll over and give them what they want.

It is a never ending spiral that hurts the Palestinians worser everytime.
They could have had their state at the '67 or even the '48 borders but they wanted it all. And what have they got - nothing.

such greed.

 

[Portly Penguin]

They are warned well in advance what the repercussions will be and chose to continue down that path. and then they complain that Israel will not roll over and give them what they want.

I'm pretty sure they want Israel to stop bombing their impoverished country and bulldozing settlements. Seems pretty reasonable to me.

 

[BeauJangles]

I'm pretty sure they want Israel to stop bombing their impoverished country and bulldozing settlements. Seems pretty reasonable to me.

And I'm pretty sure Israel wants the Palestinians to stop crying "woe is me" while simultaneously preaching and encouraging the destruction of the Israeli state. That also seems pretty reasonable.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I'm pretty sure they want Israel to stop bombing their impoverished country and bulldozing settlements. Seems pretty reasonable to me.

How difficult would it be to stop the attacks against Israeli settlements.

All Hamas has to do is enforce such from Gaza. The wall has stopped it from the West Bank. Slapping Hezbollah silly worked on the Northern border. Instead Hamas encourages attacks; reward such behavior and complains when Israel retaliates by bombing locations of militants and destroying settlements where the militants are hiding.

It has worked before

 

[Lemon law]

Maybe the Palestinian militants should consider what the results of their actions will be.

They are not thinking for their community but for their own glory.

They do not care what happens to the population. They seem to think that the world is going to help them slay the big bad dragon.

They are warned well in advance what the repercussions will be and chose to continue down that path. and then they complain that Israel will not roll over and give them what they want.

It is a never ending spiral that hurts the Palestinians worser everytime.
They could have had their state at the '67 or even the '48 borders but they wanted it all. And what have they got - nothing.
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I know you are an pro Israeli fan clubber, but that is about the most self deluded set of Statements I have ever seen

You seem to thing the Palestinians are a single and united entity so that actions of bad apple are the sins of a group. But when it comes to Israelis, they are individuals without sins.

What will be your next trick, maybe saying being born a slave is the sin of the individual, and if they just act like good little slaves, their masters will grant them their freedom.

But right now in the eyes of the larger world, people like Abbas are behaving far far better than Netanyuhu. So in that sense maybe you are right, if Israel acts in total greed, yes the world is going to have to dope slap the Israeli big bad dragon.

At the rate Israel is going, CC, you may get your answer in the UN even before 9/2011.

And in another piece of bad news for Israel, Egypt will throw wide open its border crossing into Gaza to people and goods this coming Saturday. Effectively ending the Israeli blockade of Gaza. Can Israel count on all those cheering US legislators to do anything about it? As for Mubarak, that great Israeli peace partner, he will be tried by Egypt for murder and corruption.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Separate Fatah from Hamas.

Hamas is not behaving.

Fatah is

However, Fatah/Abbas made a deal with Hamas - that contaminates the new government again.

When the new government is able to demonstrate that it is clean; then expect Israel to be in a talkative mood.

Israel has already laid out the guidelines. They are not asking anything unrealistic that the rest of the world community w/ the exception of the Arabs and some Muslims have asked.

If the Palestinians do not want to provide such; they have to accept the results of their actions.

It is great that Egypt opens its borders; they were the ones that created the Gaza camps in the first place. See if they allow an exodus of Palestinians from Gaza into Egypt.

Hopefully weapons will not be coming back. If Hamas initiates and/or allows a new conflict that will destroy the world opinion of the "new" Palestinian government.

I would expect that more than a third of the world states are on the fence - start of hostilities by the Palestinians would destroy that fence.

 

[lupi]

I'm still waiting for the US to return to her original chartered colonies. As we all know, the UN and the world won't recognize any territorial conquest.