Once again, a brave cop goes home tonight

[Londo_Jowo]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[The Merg]

So, here the deputy gets out of the area and gets backup for a perceived threat as opposed for running head on into it, but he is still in the wrong.

By the way, the deputy never actually drew his weapon, but was in the process when his partner was able to see what it was. The comedian even admitted that he did it in a way that would make people think it was a gun.

Deputy Love stated he was in fear for his life at this point and was in the process of pulling out his handgun when Nathen yelled, ‘It’s a banana!'” Bunch wrote.

In describing his own misinterpretation of the object, Bunch wrote that “based on training and experience, I have seen handguns in many shapes and colors and perceived this to be a handgun.”

Cuz no one would ever have a yellow gun...

 

[The Merg]

I assume you're talking about the serious TV show from 15 years ago and not the recent comedy movie remake series?

Yeah, the serious one...

- Merg

 

[Jaskalas]

A person with a "gun" was dropped while reaching. This is expected standard policy for officers and there is nothing wrong with their action.

Says who? The same officer that just murdered a 12 year old and you believe him completely.

Says who? Says you. Go watch the video and tell us that a person with a "gun" was not reaching. It's very plain for all to see.

 

[CZroe]

Yeah, the serious one...

- Merg

That was supposed to say 25 years ago.

 

[The Merg]

That was supposed to say 25 years ago.

I knew what you meant. I didn't want to admit that I'm that old.

- Merg

 

[runzwithsizorz]

Something I have noticed in this case, and many others, the veteran cop partner never fires a shot.

Well, at least in this case we might know why.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/04/justice/cleveland-police-officer-timothy-loehmann/index.html

a supervisor described him as "distracted and weepy" and "emotionally immature."
"a pattern of lack of maturity, indiscretion and not following instructions," a "dangerous loss of composure during live range training" and an "inability to manage personal stress."

"I do not believe time, nor training, will be able to change or correct these deficiencies," Independence Deputy Chief Jim Polak wrote in a November 2012 memo.
"Ptl. Loehmann's inability to perform basic functions as instructed, and his inability to emotionally function because of a personal situation at home with an on and off again girlfriend leads one to believe that he would not be able to substantially cope, or make good decisions, during or resulting from any other stressful situation,"
Another memo from a sergeant who worked with Loehmann at a shooting range described the officer as "distracted," "not fit to return" after an emotional outburst and someone who was "not following simple instructions."

 

[Jaepheth]

If a kid pulls a gun on you, you draw your firearm and take cover. You do NOT shoot first.
If you can't accept the risk to your own life, then don't be a cop.

 

[Bitek]

How is it shooting 7th graders with toy guns in the playground is justified, but then we had hostile militiamen pointing real assault rifles from defensive positions on federal officers enforcing court orders.. and nothing happens?

Better yet, the 12 yo is painted as some proto-thug, yet the actual thugs are considered patriots and become stars in right wing media..

And we wonder why there are riots

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

He had the wrong skin color. If someone calls 911 about a possibly drunk white man waving a rifle around, the police come up to you, ask you politely to drop the rifle, and then when the man refuses, the cops talk to him for about 40min.

No driving up to within 2 feet of him, no shooting him when he disobeyed a cop order and didn't drop the weapon right away. Funny how that works huh?

http://www.salon.com/2014/09/05/gun...police_treated_a_dangerous_open_carry_zealot/

It's just the kid was black.

Black man in Walmart with fake gun doing nothing wrong = shot and killed inside 2sec.

Black kid with fake gun doing nothing wrong = cops pull to within 2 feet and kill him inside of 2 sec

Black man selling cigarettes = Try to talk for 5 minutes, then choke him to death

Black man getting his license out of the car = shoot him as soon as he made "furtive" move.

White man with a real rifle - Talk politely to him for 40min. No shots fired. NOt even charged with a crime. Nice, huh?

Skin color makes a world of difference.

 

[Bitek]

He had the wrong skin color. If someone calls 911 about a possibly drunk white man waving a rifle around, the police come up to you, ask you politely to drop the rifle, and then when the man refuses, the cops talk to him for about 40min.

No driving up to within 2 feet of him, no shooting him when he disobeyed a cop order and didn't drop the weapon right away. Funny how that works huh?

http://www.salon.com/2014/09/05/gun...police_treated_a_dangerous_open_carry_zealot/

It's just the kid was black.

Black man in Walmart with fake gun doing nothing wrong = shot and killed inside 2sec.

Black kid with fake gun doing nothing wrong = cops pull to within 2 feet and kill him inside of 2 sec

Black man selling cigarettes = Try to talk for 5 minutes, then choke him to death

Black man getting his license out of the car = shoot him as soon as he made "furtive" move.

White man with a real rifle - Talk politely to him for 40min. No shots fired. NOt even charged with a crime. Nice, huh?

Skin color makes a world of difference.

You hate to think that is the case, but it's really hard to explain this in any other way.

"Patriot"

"threatening thug"

 

[shira]

completely agree. but i'm really doubting it's going to ever happen (until shit really gets real)

because cops are above all of us and can't be bothered or have their "privacy," "violated."


we just have to wait a little longer for a few more kids to die, and then it will really start to heat up.

Existing body camera technology is too limited. There are too many stories of body cameras that mysteriously weren't recording at critical times.

Body cameras need to be running 24/7, with the cop not able to control the power of this own camera. Furthermore, police laws need to be re-written: if a cop's camera goes mysteriously missing, is mysteriously damaged, or is mysteriously not running during a disputed encounter with the public, that should be grounds for job termination with prejudice of the cop. Furthermore, if a recording is for whatever reason not available, then the accused's version of events should be presumed to be true, rebuttable only by solid evidence provided by third parties.

 

[shira]

Cops cautiously approach the 12 year old kid and say, hey kid, what are you doing, playing around? Hey, nice gun, can we see it just to make sure it's safe?

Cops approach 12 year old kid and see 'black juvenile who has been reported to be brandishing a weapon in public'. Guns at easy hand (possibly drawn already - don't know in this situation). Cops' yell out, something like Don't move! or Drop the gun! Kid acts like kid and tries to show that it's not real? Kid still 'playing' in his head decides to 'play' with cops.

Whatever, the end result is that a 12 year old child who was not breaking the law in any way, shape or form and posed absolutely no threat to *anyone* was shot and killed by the police.

And you want to blame the kid. You seem to be another one of those 'special people' like merg.

btw, what the hell is this 'you're on the left' bullshit. This has nothing to do with political ideology. It's about a society where people like you write off the death of a child at the hands of the police because he *might* have been dangerous and he should have known better and being a policeman is a dangerous job and...

Fucking pathetic.

Pointing a gun (or any other object) in a threatening way at someone who doesn't know it's not a real gun is DEFINITELY a crime. At the very least it's assault, which is a felony.

My statement about being on the left was in response to the poster who claimed that "lefties" would always view incidents such as this one in an anti-police way. But I hope that everyone, regardless of their political viewpoint, can evaluate cases based on the information that was available to the police at the instant incidents happen, not based on information that the police didn't have access to (and couldn't reasonably have had access to) until after the incident was over. That's certainly what I attempt to do.

 

[iGas]

He had the wrong skin color. If someone calls 911 about a possibly drunk white man waving a rifle around, the police come up to you, ask you politely to drop the rifle, and then when the man refuses, the cops talk to him for about 40min.

No driving up to within 2 feet of him, no shooting him when he disobeyed a cop order and didn't drop the weapon right away. Funny how that works huh?

http://www.salon.com/2014/09/05/gun...police_treated_a_dangerous_open_carry_zealot/

It's just the kid was black.

Black man in Walmart with fake gun doing nothing wrong = shot and killed inside 2sec.

Black kid with fake gun doing nothing wrong = cops pull to within 2 feet and kill him inside of 2 sec

Black man selling cigarettes = Try to talk for 5 minutes, then choke him to death

Black man getting his license out of the car = shoot him as soon as he made "furtive" move.

White man with a real rifle - Talk politely to him for 40min. No shots fired. NOt even charged with a crime. Nice, huh?

Skin color makes a world of difference.

As a nation, we began by declaring that "all men are created equal." We now practically read it "all men are created equal, except Negroes." When the Know Nothings get control, it will read "all men are created equal, except Negroes, foreigners, and Catholics." When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty — to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy. -- Abraham Lincoln

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Abraham_Lincoln

 

[Annisman*]

When I was a teenager me and some friends went into the woods behind his house to play with our airsoft guns, not cheap toy ones but ones you can buy that are fairly expensive in price and look exactly like real firearms. One of my friend's neighbors called the police thinking we were going back there to hunt deer or something. A police officer approached us in the middle of our 'engagement' with one another, gun drawn and yelled for us to put down our guns. We immediately complied, there was no thought to do anything else but to do as he said, it was second nature to drop everything that split second.

Afterward we sorted everything out and all was fine, no citations no nothing. My question is why do some people not have that second nature to do what a cop tells you ? It was clearly the case with Mike Brown and I'm assuming the same for the 12 year old boy in Cleveland.

 

[ivwshane]

Lol! You know what they say when you assume right?

When I was a teenager me and some friends went into the woods behind his house to play with our airsoft guns, not cheap toy ones but ones you can buy that are fairly expensive in price and look exactly like real firearms. One of my friend's neighbors called the police thinking we were going back there to hunt deer or something. A police officer approached us in the middle of our 'engagement' with one another, gun drawn and yelled for us to put down our guns. We immediately complied, there was no thought to do anything else but to do as he said, it was second nature to drop everything that split second.

Afterward we sorted everything out and all was fine, no citations no nothing. My question is why do some people not have that second nature to do what a cop tells you ? It was clearly the case with Mike Brown and I'm assuming the same for the 12 year old boy in Cleveland.

 

[JEDIYoda]

I'm assuming the same for the 12 year old boy in Cleveland.

The 12 year old child in Cleveland was not holding his fake gun at the time he was shot....

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Here's what the so called toy gun (airsoft pellet gun) can do.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...h-pellet-gun-gravely-injured/article20388373/

A 13-year-old boy was in grave condition in a Surrey-area hospital after being shot in the head with a pellet gun yesterday evening.

The Integrated Homicide Investigation Team is investigating the shooting.

Two 13-year-old boys were playing in the backyard of a house in Surrey near 106 Avenue and 140 Street, and one of the boys was shot with a pellet in the side of his head, said IHIT spokesperson Corporal Dale Carr.

The boy was on life support last night.

 

[Bitek]

Here's what the so called toy gun (airsoft pellet gun) can do.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...h-pellet-gun-gravely-injured/article20388373/

Pellet gun or airsoft? The 7th grader in Ohio had an airsoft.

Fps for air soft is at most 350 fps. They are powered by springs or batteries. They also have over sized BBs, sometimes meant to splatter on impact.

Pellet guns can be as much as 1200, and are compressed air powered. Metal BBs meant to kill small animals


Again, the issue is the response of the police and tactics used. Did they make any effort to defuse the situation, or did they move to lethal force way too quickly?
It's about the decisions that are being made and how it is costing way too many unarmed civilians their lives.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Maybe there should be PSAs explaining that airsoft or other similar guns that resemble realistic weapons should not be treated in a threatening manner as they can be mistaken for a real weapon.

You can't expect a police officer or anyone else to place their lives in potential danger/life threatening situation by allowing a person to pull a weapon (real or not) out and having to wait to take an action. The hesitation maybe the difference between life of death of the police officer or other person who is potentially threatened by the weapon.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Maybe there should be PSAs explaining that airsoft or other similar guns that resemble realistic weapons should not be treated in a threatening manner as they can be mistaken for a real weapon.

You can't expect a police officer or anyone else to place their lives in potential danger/life threatening situation by allowing a person to pull a weapon (real or not) out and having to wait to take an action. The hesitation maybe the difference between life of death of the police officer or other person who is potentially threatened by the weapon.

of course you are correct! Pull up to scene of crime access the situation....stop your vehicle.......jump out of vehicle.....take 2 seconds to pull your weapon, fire and kill child. Hop back vehicle and continue your patrol! Know that you quite possibly saved a few lives.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

As usual you have no clue what was said by the police before getting out of the car, the video has no audio but for damned sure the police car did have a PA speaker.

 

[SMOGZINN]

Maybe there should be PSAs explaining that airsoft or other similar guns that resemble realistic weapons should not be treated in a threatening manner as they can be mistaken for a real weapon.

You can't expect a police officer or anyone else to place their lives in potential danger/life threatening situation by allowing a person to pull a weapon (real or not) out and having to wait to take an action. The hesitation maybe the difference between life of death of the police officer or other person who is potentially threatened by the weapon.

Have you ever dealt with a 12 year old? Really, there is not a shred of common sense in them. They are kids. We don't expect them to act reasonably, because they have not yet learned to reason.

It is the cops job to take risks to keep others safe. He should have tried talking to the kid first. EVEN IF HE HAD A REAL GUN.

 

[xBiffx]

Really, there is not a shred of common sense in them. They are kids. We don't expect them to act reasonably, because they have not yet learned to reason.

Congrats, you just described most criminals. Guess they should be treated different too amiright? Cops should talk to them and accept the first shot as a good faith gesture...

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Have you ever dealt with a 12 year old? Really, there is not a shred of common sense in them. They are kids. We don't expect them to act reasonably, because they have not yet learned to reason.

It is the cops job to take risks to keep others safe. He should have tried talking to the kid first. EVEN IF HE HAD A REAL GUN.

Excuse me? I knew how to handle firearms when I was 8 years old including knowing that you never point one at anything you don't plan to shoot. I have taught my children the same thing and will more than likely teaching my grandchildren or re-enforcing what they've been taught on firearm safety as well.

According to the police they told him to raise his hands, he was shot as he started to go for and/or pull the gun from his waist which is exactly opposite of what they told him to do.