***OFFICIAL*** Ryzen 5000 / Zen 3 Launch Thread REVIEWS BEGIN PAGE 39

[zinfamous]

Now, I guess shady will have to tell us why wafers required for the sameZen3 7nm node, also for Zen2 and RDNA2 on PS5, XSX, and XSXS don't count as "OEM" supply.

Even then, NvIdia still can't keep up with the supply that AMD has so far managed.

 

[zinfamous]

Man, just give it a rest. Ampere launched 2 months ago. TWO MONTHS.

but 54 people on Newegg now have one! It's amazing!

 

[xblax]

What I'm showing is plaintively obvious to people who aren't brainwashed with brand loyalty, and for the 3rd time I think Ampere was largely a paper launch too. Zen 3 was simply worse.

And I'm really not stating it for the brainwashed AMD brand loyalists, though I knew they would have something meaningless to say about it.

Mindfactory in Germany has sold 2.600 Ryzen 5600x already and they don't take preorders. More than the 1.000 10600k they sold since launch ;-). For comparison: they sold ~100.000 Ryzen 3600 so far. The numbers are not bad, the demany is just very high.

Prebuilds also seem to be available:
https://www.csl-computer.com/aufruest-pc-948-amd-ryzen-9-5900x.html 899€ (GPU excluded).

 

[shady28]

Now, I guess shady will have to tell us why wafers required for the sameZen3 7nm node, also for Zen2 and RDNA2 on PS5, XSX, and XSXS don't count as "OEM" supply.

Even then, NvIdia still can't keep up with the supply that AMD has so far managed.

Lol! What brain-dead analysis that is. I compared one single model of a 3080 (not the entire list of all cards using a 3080) to the supposedly best selling 5900X. And that one model had >6X the number of verified purchaser reviews.

And now you're trying to throw in PS5 and Xbox X. That's really a bit of a stretch don't you think?

It's really obvious this is a paper launch. And as I said, I consider Ampere to be a paper launch as well. I said that early on, look back in the thread.

 

[shady28]

Mindfactory in Germany has sold 2.600 Ryzen 5600x already and they don't take preorders. More than the 1.000 10600k they sold since launch ;-). For comparison: they sold ~100.000 Ryzen 3600 so far. The numbers are not bad, the demany is just very high.

Prebuilds also seem to be available:
https://www.csl-computer.com/aufruest-pc-948-amd-ryzen-9-5900x.html 899€ (GPU excluded).

Hopefully you realize there are > 15M PCs sold per quarter. That's about 170K per day. Like I said, AMD appears to have released a few hundred thousand chips to some of the popular DIY sites. It is not generally available. Paper launch.

Mindfactory GPUs sold in 2019 :


What's really being used :




Stop with the thread derailment.

This is a Ryzen 5000 thread. Next post(s)
gets infractions.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director

 

[maddie]

That's garbage. 98% of the market has zero visibility to Zen 3. That's paper to start with. The remaining 2% DIY can't get it either. More paper. The AMD mob wants to give them a pass but that's ridiculous.

I can go to Dell's site right now and order an Alienware with either RTX 3080 or 3090 and it will deliver by or before Dec 8th. There are many other OEMs that had 30xx systems available, some sold out some have not.

Edit: I think Ampere was mostly paper too, but way better availability than Zen 3 - see next comment.

If you think Ampere was paper and Zen 3 was not, I think you need to check your bias.

You should really say it's a tissue launch if you think Ampere was a paper one.

 

[Mopetar]

You're probably not going to get very far posting steam survey results. It's been said to death, but apparently needs to be said at least once more, that the steam hardware survey is not an accurate poll and shouldn't be used as support for the kind of argument you're trying to make.

Similarly, MindFactory sales figures aren't useful for anything other than comparisons with other MindFactory sales figures. If we had some figures from them regarding the first month of various CPU/GPU sales for both Zen 3 / Navi and older generations we might be able to make some claims about availability vs. demand. If for example it turns out that they sold twice as many Zen 3 CPUs as Zen 2 CPUs in the first week (I doubt this is the case for what it's worth, but I'm using it to illustrate the point) I think it would be hard to claim that Zen 3 was a paper launch.

General availability is a garbage metric for determining if something is/was a paper launch. Suppose I produce 20 million widgets and they sell out almost immediately because the real demand was 25 million. Would you really call that a paper launch? If you would, the term has become synonymous with "supply shortage" which we already have a term for, i.e., "supply shortage".

 

[gdansk]

And while we're going over useless sales stats
The 5800X is still the #1 best selling processor on Amazon (US).

 

[Kenmitch]

1 man's tears make pages of useless ranting!

 

[ElFenix]

some of y'all could ruin birthday cake

 

[zinfamous]

bah! just saw esquared's post. 😀

 

[Kenmitch]

The 5600x is fun to play around with.

All core boosting behavior using CBr20 as the load.

Stock



PBO I was surprised how well it worked.



It's possible to exceed PBO's performance with a fixed clock. (1hr+ aida64 stress tested)



I think this is doable. I still have to stress test some more. I could add a tad more vcore if needed. I figure somewhere
similar to PBO's if need be.

 

[podspi]

I know this can't be the case (since most people don't care about OCing) but I can't help but wonder if AMD is sandbagging the PBO clocks so that us enthusiasts can still feel like we're doing something... It seems too good to be true, especially after Zen 2. Those things were binned tight.

Now Zen 3 AND RDNA2 both are capable of healthy OCs? I def upgraded too early!

 

[moinmoin]

It seems to me we are transitioning from core count war to cache war.

Well, AMD technically started it with Zen 1 which already had a big L3 cache as well (before it was doubled as... erm... GameCache on Zen 2). It also infected their GPU products, RDNA1 already had big caches, and RDNA2 adds 128MB LLC on top of that. I guess it's only transitioning to a cache war if the competitors actually pick up on these changes?

I know this can't be the case (since most people don't care about OCing) but I can't help but wonder if AMD is sandbagging the PBO clocks so that us enthusiasts can still feel like we're doing something... It seems too good to be true, especially after Zen 2. Those things were binned tight.

Now Zen 3 AND RDNA2 both are capable of healthy OCs? I def upgraded too early!

Looks like AMD took the right lessons from the Zen 2 boost ("but it never reaches that?"), OC (the complete lack of headroom for it) and PBO ("useless and even counter-productive") debacle. Now the boost clock advertised for both Zen 2 and RDNA2 is actually consequently the guaranteed lower end of the boost range. Perfectly fine by me!

 

[DrMrLordX]

AMD financial estimates for Q4 are "only" 50% higher than last year Q4. One would achieve this through a paper launch of their largest revenue source (desktop processors)... 🙄

Paper launches make for paper profits? Sounds logical to me!

54 owners! you've proven how amazing Ampere stock is!

Apparently NV has sold 15M of them. Or something? I mean, all OEM PC shipments have a top-end Ampere card in them, right?

Mindfactory in Germany has sold 2.600 Ryzen 5600x already and they don't take preorders.

Ah, now you're bringing hard data to the argument.

Mindfactory is just one store.

Imagine that going on, all over the world, and every etailer selling Vermeer products. That's a lot of chips. AMD is going to sell a metric ton of these things, and they're going to be around for awhile.

 

[CakeMonster]

TBH, my attitude at the moment is that I don't count on OC at all with Zen3 since everything I read about it seems to be really confusing with regards to gaming performance.

Luckily its a solid CPU regardless so its still a viable upgrade offer for a lot of people including people on even OC'ed 6 and 8 core Intel, because of more cores and improved IPC. It would be very nice bonus if OC options become realistic with future BIOS'es though.

 

[inf64]

OCing Zen3 makes no sense if you are going to game. For multithreaded productivity tasks, sure it will make a difference , but for everything else there is no point. The best route is to get a good set (4x) of memory sticks and push them to 3600-3800 with tight timings. Zen3 is a monster core and demands a great memory to tap into the potential.

 

[Kenmitch]

OCing Zen3 makes no sense if you are going to game. For multithreaded productivity tasks, sure it will make a difference , but for everything else there is no point. The best route is to get a good set (4x) of memory sticks and push them to 3600-3800 with tight timings. Zen3 is a monster core and demands a great memory to tap into the potential.

I'd suggest at least enabling PBO. PBO is fully functional and exhibits no quirks on my rig. Setting it in the uEFI or by using Ryzen Master is fully functional. It actually works better in the uEFI as you can bump it up a little bit more in the end.

I enabled PBO (Advance Mode) in my uEFI. Chose the MB limits, and did the +50MHz option. Viewing the effective clocks is what I'd consider the true boost.



I'll probably just run mine at the above and enable my 4000MHz CL15 memory profile in the end.

 

[amrnuke]

What I'm showing is plaintively obvious to people who aren't brainwashed with brand loyalty, and for the 3rd time I think Ampere was largely a paper launch too. Zen 3 was simply worse.

And I'm really not stating it for the brainwashed AMD brand loyalists, though I knew they would have something meaningless to say about it.

I could have walked into MicroCenter 3 separate days this week and gotten my pick of 10-20 Zen3 CPUs (stock trickled down over 4 hours after opening on all 3 days). They haven't had Ampere in stock for a long time, even though I've refreshed a lot.

Could it be that Nvidia are supplying OEMs rather than DIY to *gasp* influence OEMs? Would be a smart play since, as you mention, 98% of the market is OEM.

 

[zinfamous]

Huh, so ASRock has already released Beta BIOS for their B450 boards to make them Zen3 compatible (AT front page--but they also seem to have removed several of the firmware updates from their website).

This is...far ahead of schedule. Disappointing, however, is the note that the upgrade will then make Ryzen 2000 and Ryzen 1000 series incompatible. Zen2 is still OK, however.

The board requires an active CPU to perform the update, and so now I am confused. I have a 470 Taichi (470s are not yet listed), with a 2700X. ...does that mean I need minimum Zen2 installed to perform the update, or that I can still do it with the 2700X, but I then won't be able to operate it until I replace it with Ryzen 5000 chip?

 

[Kenmitch]

The board requires an active CPU to perform the update, and so now I am confused. I have a 470 Taichi (470s are not yet listed), with a 2700X. ...does that mean I need minimum Zen2 installed to perform the update, or that I can still do it with the 2700X, but I then won't be able to operate it until I replace it with Ryzen 5000 chip?

You'll probably have to wait it out and see once your uEFI is available, but I though it was the size of the bios rom that made dropping support a must. Doesn't the Taichi have the larger sized rom chip?

 

[inf64]

Anyone wanna guess when Principled Technologies (aka intel's paid for "benchmarking" company) will release a "report" on Ryzen 5000? Interestingly enough they didn't release Ryzen 3000 competitive overview, maybe intel is readying a report for Rocket Lake launch 😉

 

[xblax]

Huh, so ASRock has already released Beta BIOS for their B450 boards to make them Zen3 compatible (AT front page--but they also seem to have removed several of the firmware updates from their website).

This is...far ahead of schedule. Disappointing, however, is the note that the upgrade will then make Ryzen 2000 and Ryzen 1000 series incompatible. Zen2 is still OK, however.

The board requires an active CPU to perform the update, and so now I am confused. I have a 470 Taichi (470s are not yet listed), with a 2700X. ...does that mean I need minimum Zen2 installed to perform the update, or that I can still do it with the 2700X, but I then won't be able to operate it until I replace it with Ryzen 5000 chip?

Looks like the stable versions are also out now: https://www.asrock.com/support/index.asp?cat=BIOS
I believe support for old Ryzen is still present. That will be a nice upgrade from my 2600 when prices come down a bit next year!

 

[Shivansps]

OK this MB has a 16MB bios, how it this possible? if i say what im thinking right now half of the forum is going to insult me, so i want to know how this is even possible? O already knew something was off because the Asus A320M-K never dropped Bristol Ridge support and it supports from a A6-9500 to a R9-3950X on a 16MB bios.

 

[Hitman928]

OK this MB has a 16MB bios, how it this possible? if i say what im thinking right now half of the forum is going to insult me, so i want to know how this is even possible? O already knew something was off because the Asus A320M-K never dropped Bristol Ridge support and it supports from a A6-9500 to a R9-3950X on a 16MB bios.

The less features a board has the more room there is to fit in CPU compatibility. The A*20 boards don't have to support the board chipsets that a B*50 or X*70 has because it relies only on the SOC's functionality in that regard. A series boards also typically don't support many features that the other lines do including just basic CPU overclocking. The bare bones approach actually allows for a greater compatibility range, if the motherboard maker is willing to put in the resources to make sure everything works.

Edit: After re-reading your post I see you are talking about the B450 board and just mentioning the A320 board as an aside. For the B450 board you mentioned, they basically split the BIOS so if you are using a pre-Zen 2 CPU you are supposed to use the older BIOS revisions. If you are using Zen 2 or Zen 3, you can use the newer ones. That's the compromise that's being made to support everything.