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Discussion ***Official*** 2024 Stock Market Thread 💰

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Red Squirrel said:
50% raise damn. We're lucky to get 2% lol. Some people don't realize how good they have it.
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They know they have the upper hand. Asking for ridiculous things since they know they can put a strangle on the economy.

What needs to happen is a big public outcry to diminish their standing.
 
AdamK47 said:
They know they have the upper hand. Asking for ridiculous things since they know they can put a strangle on the economy.

What needs to happen is a big public outcry to diminish their standing.
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Unless old man Biden relents and breaks the strike this could be Kamala's October surprise handing Trump a victory.

People always vote their wallet and hard market pull back before an election will have a political impact.

Also Middle East turmoil sunk the Democrats in 1979/1980.
 
The only way to beat automation is to figure out a way to reduce our costs of living so we don't need to rely on a full time job in first place. Life needs to not be so expensive. We shouldn't have to work 40+ hours a week just so we can keep our house. If utility companies etc automated more stuff than say, in the 80's, then why are all our bills higher and not lower? And property taxes. City workers have tons of equipment that make life easier compared to before, but yet our taxes keep going up, when they should really be going down. Would be nice if you could work until you're like 40 and then retire and enjoy the fruit of your labour but instead the costs just go up each year so you need that constant cash flow.
 
FelixDeCat said:
Unless old man Biden relents and breaks the strike this could be Kamala's October surprise handing Trump a victory.

People always vote their wallet and hard market pull back before an election will have a political impact.

Also Middle East turmoil sunk the Democrats in 1979/1980.
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This has nothing to do with Biden. The head of this Union is a Trump-humping MAGAT bitch, like you. The demands are patently absurd because this is intentional. He threatened to do this only to influence the election. He's said this publicly.

Stop lying, you simp.
 
FelixDeCat said:
Exactly. How are we to evolve as a society if we cannot benefit from technological advancement?
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Exactly, not a lot of horse carriage shops around these days.

But if you want to avoid strikes then you should have a good unemployment program that will help people economical and reschool them for another job.
 
zinfamous said:
This has nothing to do with Biden. The head of this Union is a Trump-humping MAGAT bitch, like you. The demands are patently absurd because this is intentional. He threatened to do this only to influence the election. He's said this publicly.

Stop lying, you simp.
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Step away from the computer homegirl. If what you say is true than old man Biden must be trying to sabotage Kamala by supporting yet another greedy union group when all he has to do is order those morans back to work for a cooling off period ... after the election.

But no, we must refuse all automation.
 
FelixDeCat said:
Step away from the computer homegirl. If what you say is true than old man Biden must be trying to sabotage Kamala by supporting yet another greedy union group when all he has to do is order those morans back to work for a cooling off period ... after the election.

But no, we must refuse all automation.
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^ A parasite who calls the workers greedy. Find productive employment, Felix.
 
biostud said:
Exactly, not a lot of horse carriage shops around these days.

But if you want to avoid strikes then you should have a good unemployment program that will help people economical and reschool them for another job.
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I was going to cite that earlier. Humans have been automating processes for centuries. Its only within the last hundred years we had to tolerate unions. At first, their cause was noble as employers were mad with power and had to be reigned in. Over the next few decades progress was made in the workplace for all.

However now the power shifted to the other side and unions literally destroyed GM and Chrysler with excessive wages and other requirements like pay during for no work that made their products non competitive. Both companies went completely bankrupt while non union companies survived the Great Recession of 2008-2012. The exception was Ford in that they borrowed every last dime to survive and forced the unions to accept deep wage concessions.

Fast forward to the last 4 years and here we are again, astronomical wage demands (which so far have been met) but more importantly resistance to change which would help lower the costs to consumers and that is .... automation and AI. While I am not big fan of either, we must accept that it is here to stay.

Blame UPS Teamsters, the Actors Guild, blame Shawn Fein, and now here come the lazy asses at the ports. They are going too far damnit! 😉

And if you have read my posts in the past you know I have been arguing against excessive prices, high Bidenflation, lack of taxes on the richest, CEOs taking all the profit and not sharing with employees, etc., so you know I think things need to change.

But gigantic pay raises and stopping automation is not the solution to high prices. At all.
 
FelixDeCat said:
I was going to cite that earlier. Humans have been automating processes for centuries. Its only within the last hundred years we had to tolerate unions. At first, their cause was noble as employers were mad with power and had to be reigned in. Over the next few decades progress was made in the workplace for all.

However now the power shifted to the other side and unions literally destroyed GM and Chrysler with excessive wages and other requirements like pay during for no work that made their products non competitive. Both companies went completely bankrupt while non union companies survived the Great Recession of 2008-2012. The exception was Ford in that they borrowed every last dime to survive and forced the unions to accept deep wage concessions.

Fast forward to the last 4 years and here we are again, astronomical wage demands (which so far have been met) but more importantly resistance to change which would help lower the costs to consumers and that is .... automation and AI. While I am not big fan of either, we must accept that it is here to stay.

Blame UPS Teamsters, the Actors Guild, blame Shawn Fein, and now here come the lazy asses at the ports. They are going too far damnit! 😉

And if you have read my posts in the past you know I have been arguing against excessive prices, high Bidenflation, lack of taxes on the richest, CEOs taking all the profit and not sharing with employees, etc., so you know I think things need to change.

But gigantic pay raises and stopping automation is not the solution to high prices. At all.
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Well, Denmark is build on unions and we seem to do alright. 🙂

The point being with new technology the efficiency of each worker should increase, and the workforce should then move to were it is needed. Over decades we have built our flexicurity model, where unions, politicians and employer organizations has sat down and develop a model where it is relatively easy to fire people and implement new technologies, because we also have good unemployment benefits and there are good possibilities of being retrained and acquiring new skills.

But the model requires a relatively highly skilled and efficient workforce, and there are few unskilled jobs to find which makes it hard for immigrants and people with few skills to get a job.
 
FelixDeCat said:
I was going to cite that earlier. Humans have been automating processes for centuries. Its only within the last hundred years we had to tolerate unions. At first, their cause was noble as employers were mad with power and had to be reigned in. Over the next few decades progress was made in the workplace for all.

However now the power shifted to the other side and unions literally destroyed GM and Chrysler with excessive wages and other requirements like pay during for no work that made their products non competitive. Both companies went completely bankrupt while non union companies survived the Great Recession of 2008-2012. The exception was Ford in that they borrowed every last dime to survive and forced the unions to accept deep wage concessions.

Fast forward to the last 4 years and here we are again, astronomical wage demands (which so far have been met) but more importantly resistance to change which would help lower the costs to consumers and that is .... automation and AI. While I am not big fan of either, we must accept that it is here to stay.

Blame UPS Teamsters, the Actors Guild, blame Shawn Fein, and now here come the lazy asses at the ports. They are going too far damnit! 😉

And if you have read my posts in the past you know I have been arguing against excessive prices, high Bidenflation, lack of taxes on the richest, CEOs taking all the profit and not sharing with employees, etc., so you know I think things need to change.

But gigantic pay raises and stopping automation is not the solution to high prices. At all.
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So you are back to spewing bullshit in defense of wealthy class parasitism. Get a productive job, Felix, and stop sponging off the workers. Who knows, you might earn some self respect.
 
biostud said:
Well, Denmark is build on unions and we seem to do alright. 🙂

The point being with new technology the efficiency of each worker should increase, and the workforce should then move to were it is needed. Over decades we have built our flexicurity model, where unions, politicians and employer organizations has sat down and develop a model where it is relatively easy to fire people and implement new technologies, because we also have good unemployment benefits and there are good possibilities of being retrained and acquiring new skills.

But the model requires a relatively highly skilled and efficient workforce, and there are few unskilled jobs to find which makes it hard for immigrants and people with few skills to get a job.
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We must maintain the balance of power and provide good jobs but fair prices to consumers as not everyone can simply demand 50% more pay.

All these wage hikes come and bite us all in the ass in the form of higher prices.

By taxing the rich and providing jobs and affordable housing by kicking hedge funds out of middle class single family housing.. we can all realize our wildest fantasies.
 
FelixDeCat said:
We must maintain the balance of power and provide good jobs but fair prices to consumers as not everyone can simply demand 50% more pay.

All these wage hikes come and bite us all in the ass in the form of higher prices.

By taxing the rich and providing jobs and affordable housing by kicking hedge funds out of middle class single family housing.. we can all realize our wildest fantasies.
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Definitely, usually pay raises should come with increased efficiency.

A sudden 50% increase seems absurd in every aspect, it seems like aiming for a conflict rather than actually getting into serious negotiations.

But my knowledge of US labor market is very limited, so I have no real knowledge of what works in regard of negotiations.

Most skilled workers got ~8.8% raise over 2 years in national negotiations here in Denmark, and can negotiate higher locally. Which is slightly above the inflation level here, so the salaries will have caught up and some in the beginning of '25.

It has been relatively peaceful and no strikes whatsoever. 🙂
 
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I've never been a part of a union. It does seem nice from the outside getting large pay raises without the need for increased employee productivity or performance.

Here I am slogging away hoping my job performance gets noticed for a 5% pay increase. Usually have to settle for pizza parties.
 
I'm in a union but you're still mostly at the mercy of the company, you can only get so much. I can't even imagine ASKING for a 50% raise let alone getting anything near that. They would laugh at us and walk away from the bargaining table until we ask for something that is not a joke. We are lucky to get 2%. I suspect next agreement we don't get anything, since we got 2% last time. Over the years the workload of anyone that survives yearly mass layoffs tends to go up, so that's really the only way to justify the increases. They won't just give them for fun and when negotiating we really need to come up with justification or give up something in exchange for it.

I don't remember when, I'd say 2010ish, there was this thing where companies everywhere just all decided to go into cutback mode. Yearly mass layoffs, hiring freezes, not buying new supplies or equipment etc. This never really stopped, we just kind of got used to it.

Striking is also not even an option for us. They would just shut down our centre and move everything down south. It's happened to other centres in the past.
 
AdamK47 said:
I've never been a part of a union. It does seem nice from the outside getting large pay raises without the need for increased employee productivity or performance.

Here I am slogging away hoping my job performance gets noticed for a 5% pay increase. Usually have to settle for pizza parties.
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Who says there was no increase in productivity?
 
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