Obama Preparing Immigration "Reform" - Citizenship for 12 Million Illegals

[Carmen813]

Reward people for breaking the law.
Only a Liberal....

Hey look, Bush could have spent $1 trillion securing our borders. Instead he invaded Iraq. Now what exactly do you propose? Holocaust II: The Second Burning?

 

[Fear No Evil]

Hey look, Bush could have spent $1 trillion securing our borders. Instead he invaded Iraq. Now what exactly do you propose? Holocaust II: The Second Burning?

Bu Bu Buuuuuuush.

 

[UberNeuman]

Bu Bu Buuuuuuush.

So, then what do you feel Bush could have done better in regards to this issue?

or -

 

[Craig234]

No its not a good thing. These people cheated, they cut in front of all the law abiding immigrants who applied for legal green cards and now you want them to enter the club first?

They didn't cut in line like a rude person at Disneyland. They came here for important economic benefit in a compelling situation you appear to have no sympathy for, seeing that the system did not let them in.

It's an old issue. You can attack them all day if you like, they didn't respect the law, on and on, or you can look at the larger issues of the economies' disfferences, needs, etc.

Either way, a simplistic comment like 'cut in line' has nothing really to do with the issue. The issues involved in 'line cutting' to save 5 minutes by depriving someone and to get the opportunity here are not the same.

When you cut a loine at Disneyland, there's a context the system is 'fair' for dividing limited resourcs. The issues in the US allocating space is more complicated.

When someone cuts in line at Disneyland, they're disrespecting someone to save 5 minutes of their time. When they cut in line to come here, they are able to provide for their baby back home for years.

 

[Hacp]

They didn't cut in line like a rude person at Disneyland. They came here for important economic benefit in a compelling situation you appear to have no sympathy for, seeing that the system did not let them in.

It's an old issue. You can attack them all day if you like, they didn't respect the law, on and on, or you can look at the larger issues of the economies' disfferences, needs, etc.

Either way, a simplistic comment like 'cut in line' has nothing really to do with the issue. The issues involved in 'line cutting' to save 5 minutes by depriving someone and to get the opportunity here are not the same.

When you cut a loine at Disneyland, there's a context the system is 'fair' for dividing limited resourcs. The issues in the US allocating space is more complicated.

When someone cuts in line at Disneyland, they're disrespecting someone to save 5 minutes of their time. When they cut in line to come here, they are able to provide for their baby back home for years.

You know there are billions of people in the world who would love to live in America. We can't accommodate them all.To the illegals, if you want to come to America, that's wonderful. We have a legal way for you to come. But first, get behind everyone else on the line.

And yes, I do feel sorry that they were dealt the short end of the string. But thats how life is. America can only support so many jobs and have so much growth. If everyone who wanted to live in the US got to live here, it would be a total shit-hole.

 

[UberNeuman]

"Give us your tired, your poor, your cheap labour that we may exploit it...."

\da, da, daa - and there is nothing new under the sun, cept we got us some cheaper products out of it....

 

[rudder]

Joe Wilson was wrong after all. Obama will not give healthcare to illegals... he will make them legal... then give them healthcare.

 

[UberNeuman]

Joe Wilson was wrong after all. Obama will not give healthcare to illegals... he will make them legal... then give them healthcare.

So, what...

 

[Zebo]

Jail is welfare. Every inmate gets 3 meals and a bed.

Have you considered the cost and scope of govt that it would require to achieve your 4 points there? It'd be much bigger than welfare.
'Political inconvenience' must be today's talking point for the usual spoonfed hacks to ignore that their own party did nothing to curtail illegal immigration during its own tenure in power (and arguably encouraged it).
And the reason the Republican leadership acted that way is because they're not as stupid as their base. Beyond the political implications, they know (like most sane people do) that stopping immigration in the way you would have it is entirely against everything America stands for and was founded on. Worse yet, it's big govt protectionist policy -- 'welfare' for cultural natives who don't want to compete with the outside world.

Do we want to compete with outside world? Do we want nation of a couple billionaires like Mexico is or China is and everyone else is fighting for scraps? Or are those hard fought labor rights, union wages, and worker protections worth protecting?

The world economy right now is huge multi nationals who have us in a race to the bottom. Gets too expensive in USA move to China. Gets too expensive in China move to Vietnam and so on till few are making living wages. Domestic services is one area they couldn't shop around for so they simply increase supply of labor driving wages and subsequent lifestyle down.

I'm not sure we want to go this route.

 

[UberNeuman]

I'm not sure we want to go this route.

This is why I'm glad you're in no position of power...

\fear is the mind killer...

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Fuck me... I'm movng to New Zealand

 

[Robor]

Oh no, more pigs have come to our table and they didn't wait in line. They are going to ruin everything.

That comment shows me you know jack shit about the ins and outs of US immigration.

 

[Zebo]

My question is WTF you want to immigrate to USA? Have a hard on to carry an AR15 or something?

That's the only freedom we have over other western democracies. Meanwhile, we pay a lot and don't get much in the way of services. Have a seriously corrupt cleptocracy , on par with third world nations, just bigger.

PS the Right to bare, hunt and fish is what I live for so I understand but if those weren't my hobbies I'd be looking at OZ or NZ or CAN.

 

[StageLeft]

Not surprising. It probably makes sense to allow some of these people to be citizens but ONLY after ensuring the border stops flooding in new ones. Doing this first is like getting a gash on your leg and taking antibiotics before stopping the bleeding and allowing the wound to continue to be exposed and untreated, merely taking those meds in a vain hope it's going to help. You seal the borders up better than they are, then deal with what's already come in.

 

[Robor]

Like I said, sorry. There's no alternative to dealing with some 12(ish)million Illegals than Amnesty.

Yes there is. You put them through the same system that LEGAL immigrants go through and you make THEM pay for the increase in staff necessary to handle it.

 

[rudder]

So what you're saying then is that - in your opinion - the law is never wrong?

There are some laws that are universal. Every nation on this earth has borders. Can I go to Japan and simply find a job without getting any papers? Australia? England? Russia? South Korea? Mexico? etc., etc.... No, in most cases I would be deported. This is illegal in the United States as well.

Stealing is another universal law for instance.

Sure there are crap laws on the books... In Nebraska it is illegal for a mother to give her daughter a perm without a state license. Typically these are inherent to the United States.

I suppose Patranus could have spent four paragraphs explaining this... but I guess he assumed most people would have the savy to understand his statement.

 

[Genx87]

That's one of the things i really like about you, withheld judgement until the facts are in.

Personally, i really don't care much except for one thing, i want to see canofworms victory dance now that the US has finally almost... well if you do this 20 times over you will have... caugth up with the EU nations.

In what way?

 

[fskimospy]

My question is WTF you want to immigrate to USA? Have a hard on to carry an AR15 or something?

That's the only freedom we have over other western democracies. Meanwhile, we pay a lot and don't get much in the way of services. Have a seriously corrupt cleptocracy , on par with third world nations, just bigger.

PS the Right to bare, hunt and fish is what I live for so I understand but if those weren't my hobbies I'd be looking at OZ or NZ or CAN.

Actually the civil liberties protections in the US are superior to pretty much every other nation on earth. While the US is generally rated to have a bit worse corruption than the average first world country, it most certainly is not on par with third world nations. (http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0781359.html) Our tax rates are also some of the lowest in the first world.

 

[MotF Bane]

Thinking there's any other fix. Only an idiot.

Let's ship them all to Canada. Have fun.

 

[StageLeft]

Sure there are crap laws on the books... In Nebraska it is illegal for a mother to give her daughter a perm without a state license.

That is not a crap law. Nobody should have perms, least of all kids who can be traumatized by having one.

 

[nobodyknows]

Let me guess, the path to citizenship starts at the voter registration office.

Actually it started when Regan gave a blanket amnesty to some 4 million illegal aliens without doing a damn thing about securing our southern boarder. As I recall the politicians were all to busy lining their pockests with Savings & Loan/Credit Union money and playing the stock market which just LOVES cheap labor.

Talk is cheap, it takes money to buy whiskey.

 

[K1052]

I'd prefer something along the following:

1) Seal the Mexican border using the military. Construct and maintain a viable barrier.

2) Register all current illegals and issue them permanent resident cards with the ability to naturalize in 6 years.

3) Impose criminal penalties on businesses/persons who employ illegal labor.

 

[Svnla]

Wow, so just sneak over here as an ILLEGAL...opps, "undocument", my bad, I don't want to be call racist..and you will get in line ahead of MILLION of people that want to do the right way, the LEGAL way.

Screw the laws and rules and you will get reward!!!!! Me no comprende, senor. Time for everyone to learn Spanish pronto. USA will become El Grande Mexico.

<<----is a first generation of LEGAL immigrant and not happy about ILLEGALS, all of them, not just from South America.

 

[Hacp]

I'd prefer something along the following:

1) Seal the Mexican border using the military. Construct and maintain a viable barrier.

2) Register all current illegals and issue them permanent resident cards with the ability to naturalize in 6 years.

3) Impose criminal penalties on businesses/persons who employ illegal labor.

Why should we give them a permanent resident card with a path to citizenship? So they can start leeching SS and medicare? Do we really want 15 million more people added to our overburdened social programs?

 

[brandonbull]

I'd prefer something along the following:

1) Seal the Mexican border using the military. Construct and maintain a viable barrier.

2) Register all current illegals and issue them permanent resident cards with the ability to naturalize in 6 years.

3) Impose criminal penalties on businesses/persons who employ illegal labor.

Register them for deportation. Mexico has zero problems with mass deportations of illegals. The US has an army and it's time to use it in our state of emergency instead of blowing up some stinky suicide bomber. I'm more than happy to welcome any proper immigrant to the US and the cost of deporting is a drop in the bucket to the uncontrolled invasion.