Obama Invokes Executive Privilege on Fast and Furious Documents

[IBMer]

As stupid of a plan Fast and Furious was, it is completely disingenuous to blame the death of the border agent on the fact that the gun was from us. Are people saying they wouldn't have been armed anyways? Or maybe have not fired at border agent if they didn't have guns from Holder?

 

[fskimospy]

Pathetic. If Bu-bu-bu-but Buuuuuuush had done this, you'd be calling for his head on a pike. Partisan indeed.

No, I'd be saying that executive privilege is way too expansive and should be limited... which is exactly the same thing I'm saying now. The presence or absence of excessive executive privilege protections of course has nothing to do with whether or not this happens to be a partisan political attack by a caucus which is totally desperate to find something on Obama.

I always find it funny how you guys so desperately try to delegitimize criticism of Bush. When he was in office, pointing out all the ways in which he was possibly the worst president in US history was 'Bush Derangement Syndrome'. After he was out of office and people wanted to point out all the horrible things that he did which still have effects today you switch to 'stop trying to say bad things about Bush he's not the president anymore', and when the right's fundamental hypocrisy is pointed out for complaining about the same things they previously defended.. then it's 'BUT BUUUUSH!' The various contortions you go through would be impressive if they weren't so sad.

Pathetic indeed.

 

[Paul98]

I have no problem with Holder being asked to provide these documents. I do have a problem with him failing to produce them. If it was true that someone screwed the pooch and funneled weapons into criminal hands then we ought to know. It could have been a matter of unintended consequences, but that does provide sufficient grounds for refusal. I don't know what happened, and now it appears we never will. Holder is off the hook and the mystery remains. Invoking this has been seen in the past as an admittance of guilt by many, but we'll see.

BTW, I didn't approve of how GWB used this neat deux ex machina to cover his butt either.

What remains to be seen is how things progress. Exec. privilege is not unlimited but it is not easily circumvented. If there is sufficient evidence of a conspiratorial nature it can be voided. That's not likely.

I agree and this shit is just ugly, I really would like to know what happened and who knew what. It made me sick and I was not happy to hear his continual refusal to give what was wanted. But they did give some info and other people who should have been brought up in an order to try to figure out what happened. But Issa didn't seem like they really cared about what really happened and who was responsable. Instead only cared about what Holder might have done or known. Instead of getting people who were really there, or really know a lot about what was going on.

This turned what should have been a good investigation where everyone would have liked to see what happened. Into a political hack story where it's done purely for political reasons.

 

[spidey07]

personally, I'd like to know who thought it was a great idea to arm Mexican drug cartels and why the attempt at tracking gun trafficking failed to completely (ending with, I believe, at least one boarder agent shot using guns the the Fed gave to drug runners)

If you remember very early in Obama's presidency he was constantly talking about the "flood of guns" from the US to mexico. He was trying to use that to set the tone for stricter gun control legislation.

Don't you remember congress applauding the mexican president IN OUR HOUSE OF CONGRESS when he (mexican president) demanded stricter gun control?

 

[fskimospy]

If you remember very early in Obama's presidency he was constantly talking about the "flood of guns" from the US to mexico. He was trying to use that to set the tone for stricter gun control legislation.

Don't you remember congress applauding the mexican president IN OUR HOUSE OF CONGRESS when he (mexican president) demanded stricter gun control?

Who cares about Congress applauding a foreign leader? Why shouldn't they?

 

[Paul98]

I don't quite follow you. Are you saying that Fast and Furious should have been ignored?

Holder has been giving Congress the runaround for 18 months which was initially only on the brink of the election cycle. Is there a possibility that Holder has brought this upon himself? What if he had complied when asked? Was he right or wrong to sandbag on producing the documentation that has been asked for?

Who does Holder answer to? That individual is responsible for holding up the investigation. We know who that is.

How about reading more what I said?

 

[a777pilot]

LOL! It's coming apart. Good.

Now, let's finish it on 6 NOV 2012.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Boy throw pigeons some crumbs and they all flock like rats.

 

[nageov3t]

Pathetic. If Bu-bu-bu-but Buuuuuuush had done this, you'd be calling for his head on a pike. Partisan indeed.

google.

it's easy enough to find such an event if it exists.

 

[boomerang]

How about reading more what I said?

Thanks for the reply.

 

[IGBT]

your obama can't service his lies fast enough so now it's "executive privilege". So who didn't see this coming?? Sooner or later liars have to run and hide.

 

[michal1980]

No, I'd be saying that executive privilege is way too expansive and should be limited... which is exactly the same thing I'm saying now. The presence or absence of excessive executive privilege protections of course has nothing to do with whether or not this happens to be a partisan political attack by a caucus which is totally desperate to find something on Obama.

I always find it funny how you guys so desperately try to delegitimize criticism of Bush. When he was in office, pointing out all the ways in which he was possibly the worst president in US history was 'Bush Derangement Syndrome'. After he was out of office and people wanted to point out all the horrible things that he did which still have effects today you switch to 'stop trying to say bad things about Bush he's not the president anymore', and when the right's fundamental hypocrisy is pointed out for complaining about the same things they previously defended.. then it's 'BUT BUUUUSH!' The various contortions you go through would be impressive if they weren't so sad.

Pathetic indeed.

Your so lost its sad.

Whats Pathetic is simple.

And thats the left.

The left that for 8+ years blames Bush for everything, from day one set out to destroy him for any & everything.

Then elects a guy that operates the same way as the guy they hated, but all of a sudden they have no problems with those actions because he's their guy.

How can you be surprised by republican reaction, when for years the left has had the same response?

 

[werepossum]

personally, I'd like to know who thought it was a great idea to arm Mexican drug cartels and why the attempt at tracking gun trafficking failed to completely (ending with, I believe, at least one boarder agent shot using guns the the Fed gave to drug runners)

+1 LOL at forum quote, too.

I've been defending Holder and Obama on this, but it's clear that I was completely wrong. Obviously they were both on board from day one. Personally I'm ready to move to legal action followed by impeachment if necessary. This shit HAS to stop, and if Obama is going to provide cover then he's part of the problem.

 

[xj0hnx]

The presence or absence of excessive executive privilege protections of course has nothing to do with whether or not this happens to be a partisan political attack by a caucus which is totally desperate to find something on Obama.

"Desperate"? Nothing "desperate" about it, they don't to find anything Obama hands it to them.

Your so lost its sad.

Whats Pathetic is simple.

And thats the left.

The left that for 8+ years blames Bush for everything, from day one set out to destroy him for any & everything.

Then elects a guy that operates the same way as the guy they hated, but all of a sudden they have no problems with those actions because he's their guy.

How can you be surprised by republican reaction, when for years the left has had the same response?

...and Bingo was his name-o

 

[blackangst1]

If you think this is going to be 'Nixon' interesting (implying possible impeachment?), you're sorely mistaken.

That being said, I believe executive privilege, like state secrets, is hugely abused in its current form, something I wish Congress would have the courage to address through the courts. Not that I expect them to.

I agree.

 

[IGBT]

so how could your obama exert executive privilege if there was no white house involvement?? What's your obama hiding?? He or his circle..which means he has full knowledge are hiding. What next..National Security to continue hiding lies?? Will he break clintons record of using "executive privilege 16 times?? The Heat Is On..

 

[Linflas]

That's a silly comparison.

Obama attempted to close gitmo and was prevented from doing so by Congress. It is not analogous to this case where Obama appears to be abusing executive privilege in many of the same ways that Bush did. (although since it's all hidden it's not really possible to know for sure).

Similarly, I am willing to bet that many of the defenders of executive privilege in the past will be outraged.... OUTRAGED by Obama's move here.

Really????
The Obama/Gitmo timeline, A look at how Obama went from promising to close Guantanamo Bay to doing the very opposite

 

[RedChief]

This is worse then Watergate. Watergate was about a break-in and a cover up, but NOBODY WAS MURDERED. F&F has left us with a dead federal agent along with a uncounted number of bodies in Mexico. And it was done to serve a left-wing political purpose (more gun control).

 

[a777pilot]

Just another distraction to the real failure of this Administration. Focus. Focus. Focus.

It's the economy. It's jobs. It's spending. It's debt.

That is the focus. Nothing else matters.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Too bad I wasn't talking about impeachment. I am simply stating that this is going to be as big of a scandal as Watergate if not bigger. I said nothing of impeachment. But go ahead and think what you want.

This is absurd hyperbole. Watergate was the biggest scandal in Presidential history. As far as I know (and feel free to correct me), there is not even any allegation that President Obama himself has engaged in any wrongdoing whatsoever.

 

[fskimospy]

Really????
The Obama/Gitmo timeline, A look at how Obama went from promising to close Guantanamo Bay to doing the very opposite

Yeah, really. If you fail to close Gitmo it doesn't mean that you just get to pretend it doesn't exist.

 

[Texashiker]

The office of the president is corrupt, and has been corrupt for a long time.

The people wanted change, they got just what they wanted.

 

[IGBT]

you don't claim "executive privilege" over a low level event or operation. You use it to attempt protection of the president and his cabinet. So does the obama have the skill to manage a "cover up" operation that he is now involved in?? Who will be his operatives in the obvious on going "cover up"??

 

[spidey07]

This is absurd hyperbole. Watergate was the biggest scandal in Presidential history. As far as I know (and feel free to correct me), there is not even any supposition that President Obama himself was engaged in any wrongdoing whatsoever.

That he is doing this pretty much shows the white house knew what was going on. That's why it's such big news and such a big deal. It proves the white house was involved, not just holder.

 

[a777pilot]

This is absurd hyperbole. Watergate was the biggest scandal in Presidential history. As far as I know (and feel free to correct me), there is not even any supposition that President Obama himself was engaged in any wrongdoing whatsoever.

Correct me if I am wrong but the very same could be said of Nixon and the Watergate break in. It was the cover up that doomed Nixon, not the initial crime. The same could be happening here.

There will not be any further investigations into this matter. We are about to enter the silly season and all Congress Critters will be scrambling home to lie to their districts.