New desktop version of Carrizo for FM2+

[amd6502]

According to my Nosta chart, BR still has a place on AM4 unless the native 2c/4t is real.

$28 cost of the BR die versus $70 cost for RR/Picasso.

A new 512SPs A10 sku with more modest freqs than the A12 would hit the spot and make it a more premium choice over the 200 Athlons. That price range between the 2200g and the athlon 200ge is perfect for Bristol. $80-50 for quad APUs and Athlon 950, and $35+ for 2c/2t APUs.

The new fm2 A8 hits the spot, but i think the A6-7480 shouldn't even exist (at least in PiB form) and should remain on AM4 to extend the bottom range of APU prices on the newer more relevant platform. These dual cores are good for home and office, and have a good upgrade path.

 

[Shivansps]

Im not sure FM2 still has its place because of 3 things:
DDR3 is cheaper, A6-7400K is cheaper than 200GE, A68H boards are chaper than A320... Actually A320 is expensive for what it is. All of that may not be true on the US trought.

All this is enoght to make a A6-7400K/MSI A68HM-E33/2x4GB DDR3-1600 chaper than an 200GE/A320/4GB-2400. This is not something to ignore.

From what im seeing the A8-7680 is selling for the same price than the 200GE, this means you can have the A8-7680 w/8GB for the same price than the 200GE /w 4GB, again this is not a small thing.

BR on AM4 only makes sence to sell it below 200GE, to make AM4 systems avalible for LESS MONEY.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

BR on AM4 only makes sence to sell it below 200GE, to make AM4 systems avalible for LESS MONEY.

BR should really be relegated to a celeron competitor. In the 9700(E) configuration it'd do fine in that role. Less CPU power then the Athlon, but more GPU grunt makes it a viable choice for low cost gaming, with the bonus you can add a 2200/2400G (or their replacements) later.

 

[amd6502]

The full BR die has 8CU or 512SPs and has bandwidth bottlenecked by the 2400MHz limit for memory frequency. If 2400 memory is to be run at this then 7CU would be sufficient. So they should come out with a better A10 with 7CU, and come up with an elite binning A12 that supports DDR4 2667 and has a somewhat higher gpu frequency.

I don't know why the yields would be so bad that you have most of the parts with disabled GPUs.

The main reason why a die would fail to become an A12 is not because of a defective GPU compute unit (or one that can't keep up with the very modest factory frequency) but because of the elite limits set for the CPU frequency. I.e., my suspicion is that most of the A10's actually have 8 fully working CUs, and maybe something like 95% of them at least have 7 fully working CUs (448 SPs).

The current A10 should be priced where the A8 is now, and an improved A10 with 7CU be priced where the current A10 was priced. Unfortunately the aim seemed never to be to sell BR in large numbers on AM4, probably because production was limited. Why production was limited after mobile demand weakened due to Raven Ridge I don't really understand. In March 2018 production should've been shifted to desktop. Maybe marketing was not a big fan of this, as they were obsessed with the Ryzen brand. But RR and Picasso have 11CUs so they really needn't have worried at all.

 

[whm1974]

The full BR die has 8CU or 512SPs and has bandwidth bottlenecked by the 2400MHz limit for memory frequency. If 2400 memory is to be run at this then 7CU would be sufficient. So they should come out with a better A10 with 7CU, and come up with an elite binning A12 that supports DDR4 2667 and has a somewhat higher gpu frequency.

I don't know why the yields would be so bad that you have most of the parts with disabled GPUs.

The main reason why a die would fail to become an A12 is not because of a defective GPU compute unit (or one that can't keep up with the very modest factory frequency) but because of the elite limits set for the CPU frequency. I.e., my suspicion is that most of the A10's actually have 8 fully working CUs, and maybe something like 95% of them at least have 7 fully working CUs (448 SPs).

The current A10 should be priced where the A8 is now, and an improved A10 with 7CU be priced where the current A10 was priced. Unfortunately the aim seemed never to be to sell BR in large numbers on AM4, probably because production was limited. Why production was limited after mobile demand weakened due to Raven Ridge I don't really understand. In March 2018 production should've been shifted to desktop. Maybe marketing was not a big fan of this, as they were obsessed with the Ryzen brand. But RR and Picasso have 11CUs so they really needn't have worried at all.

The AM4 BR was intended to be stopgap and to keep OEMs happy until they could come out with a Ryzen based APU.

Personally I would made to be very competitive with both the Celeron and Pentium in performance and cost.

 

[Abwx]

Bristol Ridge is on AM4, this SKU serve another purpose wich is to provide a valuable updgrade path to some specific users.

AMD kept producing the A68H till these days, thoses are used in cheap MBs wich are often, if not always, granted the lowish 2C APUs A6-7400/7470K, for whom has such a set up the A8-7480 is litteraly a gift from AMD given that they stopped production of Kaveri long ago, and that such 4C are no more available at reasonable prices.

 

[Abwx]

BGA Carrizo FX8800P :

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13897/biostar-a10n-8800e-mini-itx

 

[VirtualLarry]

@Abwx , thanks, that's really neat. I just sold a 2200G and a mobo and some DDR4 to a member here that needed a board combo, but this board, new, makes a certain amount of sense too. Though, he wanted it for gaming, I don't know how much gaming you'll be able to do, within a 15W TDP envelope, even on Carrizzo.

I think that this board will be a primary competitor to the ASRock A300 DeskMini units as well, both are very small form-factors, with DDR4 AM4-ish APUs.

Now if only AMD had a 15W TDP 4-core variant of the 2200G? Maybe a newer spin?

Edit: LOL. AT front-page site has the images from that article listed as "ASRock", not "Biostar". Clearly, from the color scheme, it's a Biostar board.

 

[hojnikb]

WHHY Carrizo ?
They should have gone with ryzen mobile

 

[NostaSeronx]

WHHY Carrizo ?

Cost.
The board and chip will probably be around $59-$69.

 

[Shivansps]

From what i been told, AMD and some OEMs are giving away for next to nothing the old mobile chips...

Gigabyte brought the trash(Kabini&Temash) to sell in the 3rd world, Biostar Carrizos, etc...

If i were AMD i would burn those chips.

 

[hojnikb]

Inventory cleaning, figured as much. This really must be dime a dozen to make sense.

 

[Abwx]

@Abwx , thanks, that's really neat. I just sold a 2200G and a mobo and some DDR4 to a member here that needed a board combo, but this board, new, makes a certain amount of sense too. Though, he wanted it for gaming, I don't know how much gaming you'll be able to do, within a 15W TDP envelope, even on Carrizzo.

I think that this board will be a primary competitor to the ASRock A300 DeskMini units as well, both are very small form-factors, with DDR4 AM4-ish APUs.

Now if only AMD had a 15W TDP 4-core variant of the 2200G? Maybe a newer spin?

.

At 15W there wont be much grunt for gaming usage, eventually if the bios has a 25-35W setting, wich is possible with a FX8800P, but generaly Biostar MBs are minimalist for their bios and not sure that this option is available.

That being said it s a good replacement to follow on the AM1 wich couldnt be adequatly replaced by AM4 in this segment despite AMD planning to do so.

From what i been told, AMD and some OEMs are giving away for next to nothing the old mobile chips...

Gigabyte brought the trash(Kabini&Temash) to sell in the 3rd world, Biostar Carrizos, etc...

If i were AMD i would burn those chips.

Fortunately you are not AMD...

Western Europe is third world as well..?.

https://geizhals.de/?cmp=1958228&cmp=1954910
https://geizhals.de/?cat=cpuamdam4&xf=12099_Desktop~820_AM1

Or is a day good for you only if you found something to trash AMD..?

This hatefull atitude really bring nothing to the debate, it s even counterproductive but i guess that it s some kind of therapy..

 

[ao_ika_red]

BGA Carrizo FX8800P :

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13897/biostar-a10n-8800e-mini-itx

I will trade my board and cpu for this board, but sadly it comes with DDR4, instead of DDR3 which was used on the original Carrizo design. I wonder why AT didn't call it Bristol Ridge instead.

 

[amd6502]

I will trade my board and cpu for this board, but sadly it comes with DDR4, instead of DDR3 which was used on the original Carrizo design. I wonder why AT didn't call it Bristol Ridge instead.

Echo that, yup. or at least have both versions to see which sells better (i would guess it would be ddr3 of course)!

BGA (vs pga) on an fm2-equiv (fp4?) platform makes sense though as there is no upgrade path. On an AM4 line (namely BR and RR) however I'd prefer an upgradable drop in socket (AM4) since upgrade potential is very relevant with a modern ddr4 build.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

That being said it s a good replacement to follow on the AM1 wich couldnt be adequatly replaced by AM4 in this segment despite AMD planning to do so.

Personally, I view the new Athlon 2xxGE as the spiritual successor to the AM1 platform. The Zen core is upwards of 100% faster then the Cat cores, while not really drawing much more power when used with an ITX board.

I will trade my board and cpu for this board, but sadly it comes with DDR4, instead of DDR3 which was used on the original Carrizo design. I wonder why AT didn't call it Bristol Ridge instead.

If you're buying DDR4* anyway, I'd strongly urge you to consider a Zen-based Athlon instead. There is no reason to choose Excavator in 2019, except for a few niche applications (Carrizo's Win7 support being primary).

Much better CPU performance, and doesn't draw more power with an ITX board.

*RR's memory controller is hellishly better then Carrizo/BRs DDR4 one. It can outperform BR with a single channel used. So you don't really need more then a single 2666MHz DIMM with reasonable timings.

 

[NTMBK]

BGA Carrizo FX8800P :

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13897/biostar-a10n-8800e-mini-itx

You'd have to add an M.2 wifi card for most use cases, but I guess it could be nice for small desktop systems? But there's no DC power in, so you need to use a big ATX/SFX power supply. Kind of a weird product.

 

[Shivansps]

Fortunately you are not AMD...

Western Europe is third world as well..?.

https://geizhals.de/?cmp=1958228&cmp=1954910
https://geizhals.de/?cat=cpuamdam4&xf=12099_Desktop~820_AM1

Or is a day good for you only if you found something to trash AMD..?

This hatefull atitude really bring nothing to the debate, it s even counterproductive but i guess that it s some kind of therapy..

Gigabyte is bringing the A1450N and E2500N mostly to Latin America market... in replacement of the E3000N that was a replacement of the E3800N.

Thats called trash that will only bring bad rep to Gigabyte and AMD, if you dont like it thats fine.

What Biostar did it is acceptable, if the price is right.

 

[Shivansps]

You'd have to add an M.2 wifi card for most use cases, but I guess it could be nice for small desktop systems? But there's no DC power in, so you need to use a big ATX/SFX power supply. Kind of a weird product.

As with the Gigabyte mITX boards, it is used as cheap pcs with regular matx case. It will mostly depend on price.. if the Biostar board is cheaper than a 200GE + A320 it will be interesting.

 

[amd6502]

As with the Gigabyte mITX boards, it is used as cheap pcs with regular matx case. It will mostly depend on price.. if the Biostar board is cheaper than a 200GE + A320 it will be interesting.

maybe sub-itx is good for DC power. There are plenty of SFF cases with pretty compact ATX power; but typically ~200-250W which is overkill without a Dgpu. Well, there you go Biostar, bring on the DDR3 variant with possibly DC power.

 

[ao_ika_red]

If you're buying DDR4* anyway, I'd strongly urge you to consider a Zen-based Athlon instead. There is no reason to choose Excavator in 2019, except for a few niche applications (Carrizo's Win7 support being primary).

That's why I said it's sad because I can't repurpose my DDR3.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

That's why I said it's sad because I can't repurpose my DDR3.

It'd make an excellent upgrade to my file server, and a good way to re purpose some 2400MHz DDR3 (yes, that's not a typo. DDR3) I have laying about.

 

[amd6502]

If you consider the sad fraction of laptops that make it past the five year mark (or even 4yrs) it's apparent that a good many people have DDR3 laying around.

Would it be worth it to have a low cost model without PCIe 16x slot? It might shave a few $$s off. For fileserver users they would be better adding another 4 sata ports instead of the large PCIe (or at least another two).

""Storage options are limited to just two SATA ports and a single M.2 slot with support for both PCIe and SATA SSDs"

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Would it be worth it to have a low cost model without PCIe 16x slot? It might shave a few $$s off.

Not in my opinion. A PCIe x16 slot is good for a variety of expansion cards. Not just graphics.

 

[Abwx]

Personally, I view the new Athlon 2xxGE as the spiritual successor to the AM1 platform. The Zen core is upwards of 100% faster then the Cat cores, while not really drawing much more power when used with an ITX board.
.

AM1 was adequate for a PC that is on 24/7 given its sub 10W idle power (at the main..), so far AM4 platforms are at 20W or so, granted it s with ATX PSUs, Carrizo on the other hand is as economical as an AM1 APU.

.

""Storage options are limited to just two SATA ports and a single M.2 slot with support for both PCIe and SATA SSDs"

With AMD PCHs you can plug several devices in a same SATA port, only thing is that they ll have to share the bandwith if used simultaneously.