Never mind that Mueller guy - It's time to bomb Syria!

[Genx87]

If America escalates this and collapses the Syrian government.


Well whatever happens, I am relatively certain that this little gas attack in Syria is going to help some American military contractors make their nut. What do you think, $50 million of smart bombs in response? $100 million? Or how about the ultimate wet dream of a serious interaction with the Russians and BILLIONS in ordinance? We have powerful financial interests that profit from fomenting war and who have far too much influence on American foreign policy.

The only coherent part of American foreign policy that I can detect is the tendency to bomb first (with hideously expensive hardware) and ask questions later. Lately we have just gone to bombing and not asking questions at all. I don't think we will ever disengage from the Middle East. There is just too much money to be made murdering people over there. Paint a bad guy sign, bomb, rinse, repeat, profit.

I think you have hit the nail on the head with this post. We bomb first and dont even ask questions later. I was impressed with people when they pushed back on Obama taking military action in Syria. Then disappointed when he did it anyways and people went about their merry way.

 

[bshole]

I think you have hit the nail on the head with this post. We bomb first and dont even ask questions later. I was impressed with people when they pushed back on Obama taking military action in Syria. Then disappointed when he did it anyways and people went about their merry way.

I sometimes wonder what America would be like now if we had plowed those trillions of dollars into our own infrastructure instead of bombing poor people.

 

[dainthomas]

It's like Spaceballs have taken over the govt.

Keep firing assholes!

Maybe he hired Lone Starr to jam their radar. A million space bucks is a drop in the bucket for the DoD.

 

[SMOGZINN]

He's killing his own people! We're gonna kill some of 'em, too! Yippee!

Trump has barely even gotten to play with his toys since the American People gave them to him for Christmas over a year ago!

It is a ridiculous distinction. The only reasonable basis I can see is that a big chemical strike could kill a lot of people fast and you need to strongly deter even limited use.

To understand why we make a distinction you need to understand the history of World War 1 when chemical weapons were really used. Chemicals weapons must be treated like nuclear weapons in that if one is used we have to come down on whoever used it with both feet to keep others from deciding to use them because of how effective they are and how easy they are to make and deploy. Pretty much anyone with a BS in chemistry can make an effective chemical weapon that could kill tens of thousands of people. We are super lucky that no terrorist organization has decided to use one in a major population center.

 

[zinfamous]

It is a ridiculous distinction. The only reasonable basis I can see is that a big chemical strike could kill a lot of people fast and you need to strongly deter even limited use.

The world tends to maintain a strongly negative view regarding chemical weapons in comparison to conventional weapons because of that whole WWI thing. Even if you remove the differences between the two means of death: One typically sploody and bloody; the other agonizing, insidious, nearly unmendable--there is a distinctive difference in the deployment of chemical weapons. Chlorine gas sinks and it penetrates. You can't really hide from it. It is wholly indiscriminate and is deployed with the express purpose of maximizing deaths (not casualties) in a determined area that offers no means of escape for any potential victim.

I believe the Geneva convention distinguishes them appropriately, as separate from conventional weapons, for a list of reasons that we were supposed to learn from after WWI. I think the typical response to the use of chemical weapons is predicated on the assumption that the person authorizing their deployment is especially insidious and does so by means of terror--beyond a "reasonable strategic purpose." Ergo, the person that understands their history in warfare, knows why they are banned, knows the effects, but does so anyway.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Now Syria is saying it has discovered a rebel facility in Ghouta used to make chemical weapons. This should be fun.

 

[Fern]

Both 2016 campaigns vowed a war in Syria.

In this regard the primary difference was the uncertainty around Trump. It could have gone either way. It's gone bad. Real bad.

Both "vowed a war"? I don't think so. And in that election Trump spoke of getting out of the Middle East etc. Network news have been replaying some of his campaign speeches.

--------------------------------------------

When I heard of the gas attacked it seemed odd to me that Assad would do that. Trump had just recently spoken of getting out of Syria, a gas attack would only make it more difficult for Trump to withdrawal our forces. I don't see why Assad would want that.

Read an article earlier today that mentioned a top Russian General and some of the 'games' he plays. Apparently a few days before the gas attack he claimed that the US was going to instigate a gas attack and try to blame it on them or Assad. Hmmm, makes me suspect the Russians. (OTOH I heard that the containers were Iranian.)

If my understanding of the area is even close I don't see how we could have done it. I don't see how we get in with gas etc while there are Assad forces, rebel forces, ISIS, Iranians and Russians about.

Fern

 

[Genx87]

I sometimes wonder what America would be like now if we had plowed those trillions of dollars into our own infrastructure instead of bombing poor people.

We would have pretty nice, yet expensive infrastructure. But it is a lot easier to sell killing brown people than it is a new bridge.

 

[Puffnstuff]

If Assad is truly responsible for this his compound should be leveled on behalf of the affected people. Nobody else should be affected by a military strike on him and his suffering people certainly shouldn't be made to suffer any more than they already have.

Trump on the other hand, our 5 time bone spur draft deferment that didn't seem to slow him down chasing women and golf balls president, hasn't a clue about anything except his own self aggrandizement.

 

[compuwiz1]

I don't trust Syria and Russia to investigate. We don't know what kind of intelligence our government possesses that would prove that Assad was using chemical weapons on the people. That information is top secret to us plebs. So, who do we trust, the Russians, Syrians, or our own?

I really don't want to see us involved there, militarily. If there is something that needs to be done, let someone else handle it. Too risky.

 

[FIVR]

Tulsi Gabbard isn't buying Mattis' BS about Syria. I hope she runs in 2020, it would be so amazing to have a candidate who wasn't constantly supportive of any military action for any reason whatsoever.

 

[compuwiz1]

Tulsi Gabbard isn't buying Mattis' BS about Syria. I hope she runs in 2020, it would be so amazing to have a candidate who wasn't constantly supportive of any military action for any reason whatsoever.

Mattis is one of the finest Marines to ever walk the planet. I've known him personally, since 1978, when I was stationed at 1st Marine division, Camp Pendleton. He also resided across the river from me, in Richland, Wa. Do not discount this man's intelligence, knowledge, experience, or judgement. He is far superior to the likes of you and I trust him in the position he's in. General Mattis doesn't BS about anything.

Feel free to piss all over Trump, his cabinet, his family, or whatever. That you are free to do. I'll not stand for anyone maligning one of my fellow Marines, who has such a record of honor, integrity, service and competence. The appointment of General Mattis is one of the few things Trump got right.

 

[FIVR]

Mattis is one of the finest Marines to ever walk the planet. I've known him personally, since 1978, when I was stationed at 1st Marine division, Camp Pendleton. He also resided across the river from me, in Richland, Wa. Do not discount this man's intelligence, knowledge, experience, or judgement. He is far superior to the likes of you and I trust him in the position he's in. General Mattis doesn't BS about anything.

Feel free to piss all over Trump, his cabinet, his family, or whatever. That you are free to do. I'll not stand for anyone maligning one of my fellow Marines, who has such a record of honor, integrity, service and competence.

Mattis is:
1. A War criminal - slaughtered thousands of civilians in Fallujah.
2. A Drug addict - all you have to do is look at him to see this...
3. A Trump-sucking sycophant


So I totally get why you love him you pathetic piece of human garbage.

 

[compuwiz1]

Mattis is:
1. A War criminal - slaughtered thousands of civilians in Fallujah.
2. A Drug addict - all you have to do is look at him to see this...
3. A Trump-sucking sycophant


So I totally get why you love him you pathetic piece of human garbage.

Don't you have to go screw your cousin, you backward piece of shit. But to your points:
War criminal- only convicted in your mind. People die in wars.
Drug addict- another of your made up fantasies. I know the man, remember? I've drank beers with him, attended ball games, been to his house, etc.
Trump sucking sycophant- no, the man has a job to do, as appointed.

Now, go f*ck yourself.

 

[bshole]

Mattis is one of the finest Marines to ever walk the planet. I've known him personally, since 1978, when I was stationed at 1st Marine division, Camp Pendleton. He also resided across the river from me, in Richland, Wa. Do not discount this man's intelligence, knowledge, experience, or judgement. He is far superior to the likes of you and I trust him in the position he's in. General Mattis doesn't BS about anything.

According to this, Mattis is a war-mongering prick who likes bombing people who can't fight back for no definable American interest. How many people are DEAD because of him? Assholes like him could easily meander America into a war that turns existential. I view people with his worldview as a threat to humanity.

I fully discount this man's intelligence, knowledge and experience. There is a reason that nobody can even define what America's long term strategic policy in the Middle East is. Mattis appears to be the exemplar of that reason.

Now I fully understand that I could be the ignorant idiot whose policy ideas regarding the Middle East would be catastrophic for humanity. The idea of humanitarian missions and diplomacy may indeed have no place in Middle East. We will never know empirically if my idea would be effective because American policy has been and will remain the same..... paint a bad guy sign, bomb, rinse, repeat. American policy will likely remain like this until our activities gin up a regional/world war AND/OR the crumbling American empire collapses under insurmountable debt. In the meantime, military contractors will make billions if not trillions of dollars.

For all his half-baked tweets, insults and boasts, as well as his refusal to read anything of substance on issues of war and peace, some of candidate Trump’s foreign policy ideas seemed far saner than those of just about any other politician around or the previous two presidents.

I mean, the Iraq War was dumb, and maybe it wasn’t the craziest idea for America’s allies to start thinking about defending themselves, and maybe Washington ought to put some time and diplomatic effort into avoiding a possibly catastrophic clash or set of clashes with Vladimir Putin’s Russia.

Unfortunately, the White House version of all this proved oh-so-familiar. Trump’s decision, for instance, to double down on a losing bet in Afghanistan in spite of his “instincts” — and on similar bets in Somalia, Syria and elsewhere — and his recently published National Defense Strategy leave little doubt that he’s surrendered to Secretary of Defense James Mattis and National Security Advisor H.R. McMaster, the mainstream interventionists in his administration.

In truth, no one should be surprised. A hyper-interventionist, highly militarized foreign policy has defined Washington since at least the days of Pres. Harry Truman — the first in a long line of hawks to take the White House. In this context, an ever-expanding national security state has always put special effort into meeting the imagined needs of its various component parts. The result — bloated budgets for which exaggerated threats, if not actual war, remain a necessity.

https://warisboring.com/something-for-everyone-in-the-military-industrial-complex/

 

[compuwiz1]

According to this, Mattis is a war-mongering prick who likes bombing people who can't fight back for no definable American interest. How many people are DEAD because of him? Assholes like him could easily meander America into a war that turns existential. I view people with his worldview as a threat to humanity.

I fully discount this man's intelligence, knowledge and experience. There is a reason that nobody can even define what America's long term strategic policy in the Middle East is. Mattis appears to be the exemplar of that reason.

Now I fully understand that I could be the ignorant idiot whose policy ideas regarding the Middle East would be catastrophic for humanity. The idea of humanitarian missions and diplomacy may indeed have no place in Middle East. We will never know empirically if my idea would be effective because American policy has been and will remain the same..... paint a bad guy sign, bomb, rinse, repeat. American policy will likely remain like this until our activities gin up a regional/world war AND/OR the crumbling American empire collapses under insurmountable debt. In the meantime, military contractors will make billions if not trillions of dollars.



https://warisboring.com/something-for-everyone-in-the-military-industrial-complex/

You are another idiot. We sign up to defend our country against all enemies, foreign and domestic. The man has followed his orders, so you must hate everyone in the military, including this veteran. Following what he was ordered to do does not make him a war monger. Please join my FOAD club, you POS.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

You are another idiot. We sign up to defend our country against all enemies, foreign and domestic. The man has followed his orders, so you must hate everyone in the military, including this veteran. Following what he was ordered to do does not make him a war monger. Please join my FOAD club, you POS.

There is such a thing as an illegal order, you know that. Don't fall back on the 'following what he was ordered to do' shtick.

 

[bshole]

You are another idiot. We sign up to defend our country against all enemies, foreign and domestic. The man has followed his orders, so you must hate everyone in the military, including this veteran. Following what he was ordered to do does not make him a war monger. Please join my FOAD club, you POS.

I didn't hear an actual argument in there supporting your position. TBH I rarely if ever have from the interventionists. If you have an argument for intervention, here is your chance to make it. My mind is open to evidence and data. That is the reason why I went from an interventionist stance in the Middle East to an isolationist stance in the first place..... evidence and data changed my mind.

 

[compuwiz1]

There is such a thing as an illegal order, you know that. Don't fall back on the 'following what he was ordered to do' shtick.

So grow your hair long, wear a peace sign, paint flowers on your V.W. bus, and smoke lots and lots of weed. Just be sure to cry a river, man. Meanwhile, I've fought for our country, even your right to be a stinky hippie. Yes, even you, you milquetoast.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

So grow your hair long, wear a peace sign, paint flowers on your V.W. bus, and smoke lots and lots of weed. Just be sure to cry a river, man. Meanwhile, I've fought for our country, even your right to be a stinky hippie. Yes, even you, you milquetoast.

Hey, fuckass, I'm prior mil. If you're unfamiliar with rules of engagement, you should have paid closer attention during briefings.

Hint: bombing wedding parties isn't standard rules of engagement.

 

[bshole]

Hey, fuckass, I'm prior mil. If you're unfamiliar with rules of engagement, you should have paid closer attention during briefings.

Hint: bombing wedding parties isn't standard rules of engagement.

ROFLMAO! 😀

 

[compuwiz1]

Hey, fuckass, I'm prior mil. If you're unfamiliar with rules of engagement, you should have paid closer attention during briefings.

Hint: bombing wedding parties isn't standard rules of engagement.

Hey, nutsack, when you were given an order, did you go, oh wait..."I have to go look it up and determine if it was an illegal order?" No you didn't. Stop bullshitting here. Back in my time, if I tried that, my commander would have knocked me on my ass. You know this.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Hey, nutsack, when you were given an order, did you go, oh wait..."I have to go look it up and determine if it was an illegal order?" No you didn't. Stop bullshitting here. Back in my time, if I tried that, my commander would have knocked me on my ass. You know this.

The fuck you don't, you process every order you receive to determine legality of it prior to committing. If your commander knocks you on your ass, good on you, at least you didn't bomb a bunch of goddamned civilians, and you can take it up with USCG, or whoever has authority to investigate the issuance of illegal orders. Have some fucking integrity.
http://www.omjp.org/ArtLarryDisobey.html

 

[bshole]

The fuck you don't, you process every order you receive to determine legality of it prior to committing. If your commander knocks you on your ass, good on you, at least you didn't bomb a bunch of goddamned civilians, and you can take it up with USCG, or whoever has authority to investigate the issuance of illegal orders. Have some fucking integrity.
http://www.omjp.org/ArtLarryDisobey.html

I think it is pretty damn clear that you are better soldier than Comp ever was. His just following orders schtick is frankly frightening.

I cannot recognize the verdict of guilty. . . . It was my misfortune to become entangled in these atrocities. But these misdeeds did not happen according to my wishes. It was not my wish to slay people. . . . Once again I would stress that I am guilty of having been obedient, having subordinated myself to my official duties and the obligations of war service and my oath of allegiance and my oath of office, and in addition, once the war started, there was also martial law. . . . I did not persecute Jews with avidity and passion. That is what the government did. . . . At that time obedience was demanded, just as in the future it will also be demanded of the subordinate.

 

[compuwiz1]

The fuck you don't, you process every order you receive to determine legality of it prior to committing. If your commander knocks you on your ass, good on you, at least you didn't bomb a bunch of goddamned civilians, and you can take it up with USCG, or whoever has authority to investigate the issuance of illegal orders. Have some fucking integrity.
http://www.omjp.org/ArtLarryDisobey.html

I don't know what you served in, or when, but you sound like a safe space seeking pussy, not like anyone I ever served with. If you were in my platoon, you'd have been blanket partied like private Pyle. Bada bing!