Michael Moore trashes "American Sniper"

[Subyman]

I thought it was about Iraq, not Vietnam.

It is lol, I've been ignoring him saying that. The guy was only 38 when he died in 2013, so kind of hard for him to have fought in the Vietnam war.

 

[werepossum]

lol +1

The day's still young.

 

[Brovane]

As much as his actual criticism of Snipers as a whole are BS, he's right about the actual American Sniper guy who they based this story on. The guy is a douchebag.



Anybody who's claim to fame is how many human lives they took is up there with ted bundy and suicide bombers in skillset. He should have far more regard for human life. He also generally describes the kills like they were fun. He's all about murdering vietnamese, and he feels that murdering those people makes him somebody special.


He is the same as the suicide bombers that Palestinians glorify, just an American version. They both kill large numbers of "kuffars" or "g**ks" or whatever denigrating name they call their enemies and that is their entire life's work.

 

[Subyman]

I guess on the purpose of historical documentary it is a good movie. I have no issue with the movie at all, and I'll probably pay to see it this weekend. However, this man is not a hero.


I suppose I did miss your point. I am not debating that he was used, and put under massive stress. That doesn't change the fact that as a human being I find him very distasteful. I have not seen the movie but I have seen all the interviews with the real guy. I assume the movie is different, lol.


He may very well have turned out to be a totally normal guy without vietnam and maybe he is a victim too. I just don't like the way he talks about taking human life.

You sure you've read and heard a lot from this guy? It is pretty obvious he didn't fight in Vietnam. He was born 1 year after the Vietnam war was over.

 

[TreVader]

You sure you've read and heard a lot from this guy? It is pretty obvious he didn't fight in Vietnam. He was born 1 year after the Vietnam war was over.

Wasn't this the sniper with the most confirmed kills in US history? That guy was from vietnam. Unless somebody overtook him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Hathcock

this is the guy I thought the movie was about.

 

[Subyman]

Wasn't this the sniper with the most confirmed kills in US history? That guy was from vietnam. Unless somebody overtook him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Kyle

 

[OutHouse]

He may very well have turned out to be a totally normal guy without vietnam and maybe he is a victim too. I just don't like the way he talks about taking human life.

He just has zero regard whatsoever for human life. Especially vietnamese human life

Wasn't this the sniper with the most confirmed kills in US history? That guy was from vietnam. Unless somebody overtook him.

you stupid fuck. THE MOVIE IS NOT ABOUT HATHCOCK OR VIETNAM.

 

[TreVader]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Kyle

Lol I guess he was overtaken. Last time I was really up on military stuff was like 2006-7 so I guess this guy hadn't overtaken Hathcock yet.



I'll have to see the movie to make a judgement. I still wouldn't call him a "hero" on the basis of # of kills. He's a very good sniper, but I personally do not value military contributions that consist of "x # of enemy killed, then we left". That's not a contribution, it's a massacre.

 

[werepossum]

Wasn't this the sniper with the most confirmed kills in US history? That guy was from vietnam. Unless somebody overtook him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Hathcock

this is the guy I thought the movie was about.

Sweet Lord. Carlos Hathcock was one of the nicest, most decent men anyone could hope to meet. He killed people because in war, that's what you do. If you don't kill them, they'll kill your boys, because that's what both sides are there for.

 

[TreVader]

Sweet Lord. Carlos Hathcock was one of the nicest, most decent men anyone could hope to meet. He killed people because in war, that's what you do. If you don't kill them, they'll kill your boys, because that's what both sides are there for.

I'm sure the NVA describe him glowingly, I mean he only wasted 89 of them in order to "stop the spread of communism".




And for what? What did we gain as a nation from him massacring the vietnamese? On their own soil?


We were fucking invaders.

 

[werepossum]

I'm sure the NVA describe him glowingly, I mean he only wasted 89 of them in order to "stop the spread of communism".




And for what? What did we gain as a nation from him massacring the vietnamese? On their own soil?


We were fucking invaders.

If it makes you feel any better, the NVA slaughtered hundreds of thousands when they took the south.

 

[WHAMPOM]

So much RAGE about nothing. lol, not worth a LOL even.

edit: NVC???

 

[TreVader]

If it makes you feel any better, the NVA slaughtered hundreds of thousands when they took the south.

It does not, and I wonder how much of that hatred that caused that slaughter was a product of the decade of foreign invasion perpetrated by our government?


We are just as much to blame as the NVA for their actions after the war. We caused that war.

 

[Genx87]

Holy shit this is approaching self ownage of the year award territory. And we haven't even made it out of Jan yet. I love how TreVader shrugs it off and shifts the goal posts to talk about the poor NVA.

 

[mizzou]

Who knows how many lives snipers have SAVED by taking a good shot. Michael Moore is a professional troll, don't feed him.

 

[TreVader]

Anyway I will defer on judging the man himself until I see the movie and whatever interviews they have of him. For the time being, all I have to say on the topic is that when you see this film, you should consider what it would be like to be on the receiving end of this snipers shots. And consider what it would be like if they made a movie about some Jihadi like the Beruit Barracks bombers.

 

[blankslate]

Chris Kyle was not the best representative of snipers imo.

He revealed the identity of "scruff face" in his book in on air interviews and ultimately his estate lost the defamation suit. All he had to do was grin and say he knows who I'm talking about. Such lawsuits are extremely hard for public figures to win.

http://thompsonhall.com/defamation-of-a-public-figure/

You may rarely see public figures suing for defamation. Even less common is a public figure winning a defamation lawsuit. Public figures have a greater burden to prove in a defamation lawsuit because United States laws protecting freedom of speech and freedom of the press require extra proof in a defamation lawsuit: malice.
~snip~
The Ventura v. Kyle case is noteworthy because public figures rarely sue for defamation and win. This case could encourage other public figures to sue people who publicly defame them.

The decision is being appealed and I hope Governor Ventura wins again.

It is also the height of foolishness to take someone with PTSD to the range.

....

 

[TreVader]

Holy shit this is approaching self ownage of the year award territory. And we haven't even made it out of Jan yet. I love how TreVader shrugs it off and shifts the goal posts to talk about the poor NVA.

Lol call it what you will, I did not research the post properly. Def stupid of me.


It was hubris that got me. I had 100% confidence that Hathcock was still #1. I just figured there wouldn't be an environment that rich in targets in the middle east. I know at the time, in 2007-2010, nobody was even within 20 kills of Hathcock. Maybe they weren't reported yet.

 

[werepossum]

It does not, and I wonder how much of that hatred that caused that slaughter was a product of the decade of foreign invasion perpetrated by our government?

We are just as much to blame as the NVA for their actions after the war. We caused that war.

We caused the war that began almost two decades before we became involved? The mind, she is boggled.

Can't wait for your next opus, how America caused Genghis Khan.

 

[bshole]

Chris Kyle was not the best representative of snipers imo.....

What is the "best" representative? The only qualities they really need are good hand-eye coordination, good nerves, the ability to not move and the ability to kill people without it bothering them.

Kyle was a lying douchebag though. His attack on Jesse Ventura exposed his true character.

 

[Belegost]

We caused the war that began almost two decades before we became involved? The mind, she is boggled.

Can't wait for your next opus, how America caused Genghis Khan.

It is provable fact that American GIs were responsible for the sack of Rome, as much as that poser Alaric I wants to take credit. However, there's still no hard evidence the CIA was behind the famed Operation Trojan Horse.

 

[blankslate]

What is the "best" representative? The only qualities they really need are good hand-eye coordination, good nerves, the ability to not move and the ability to kill people without it bothering them.

IMO, they are silent but deadly and do kill well but seek no acclaim for things they have had to do in the course of protecting their comrades.

 

[waggy]

Chris Kyle was not the best representative of snipers imo.

He revealed the identity of "scruff face" in his book in on air interviews and ultimately his estate lost the defamation suit. All he had to do was grin and say he knows who I'm talking about. Such lawsuits are extremely hard for public figures to win.

http://thompsonhall.com/defamation-of-a-public-figure/



The decision is being appealed and I hope Governor Ventura wins again.

It is also the height of foolishness to take someone with PTSD to the range.

....

add in he claims to have killed 2 people who he say were trying to carjack him. he also claims to went to NO and got on top of the superdome and shot looters.

yeah the guy was a fucking nutcase.

but no doubt he saved US lives

 

[werepossum]

It is provable fact that American GIs were responsible for the sack of Rome, as much as that poser Alaric I wants to take credit. However, there's still no hard evidence the CIA was behind the famed Operation Trojan Horse.

It worked - therefore the CIA probably wasn't behind it.

 

[Brovane]

Lol I guess he was overtaken. Last time I was really up on military stuff was like 2006-7 so I guess this guy hadn't overtaken Hathcock yet.



I'll have to see the movie to make a judgement. I still wouldn't call him a "hero" on the basis of # of kills. He's a very good sniper, but I personally do not value military contributions that consist of "x # of enemy killed, then we left". That's not a contribution, it's a massacre.

How can you even begin to make a judgement about the guy when you haven't even read his book or seen the Movie?