Longer School Days

[UberNeuman]

Originally posted by: Ihey8neocons

Originally posted by: UberNeuman

Originally posted by: Ihey8neocons

Originally posted by: Genx87
Our school calendar is based on an outdated economy. We really should have kids in school 12 months a year imo.

Yes, just think of how many fruits and vegetables kids put condoms on with all of that extra time.

So, may I ask you a question?

Sure.

Well, who were you, before you where banned?

 

[Ihey8neocons]

Originally posted by: UberNeuman

Originally posted by: Ihey8neocons

Originally posted by: UberNeuman

Originally posted by: Ihey8neocons

Originally posted by: Genx87
Our school calendar is based on an outdated economy. We really should have kids in school 12 months a year imo.

Yes, just think of how many fruits and vegetables kids put condoms on with all of that extra time.

So, may I ask you a question?

Sure.

Well, who were you, before you where banned?

I'm the same person I've always been. More or less, that is. The 30 ft fall on my head was a real doozy. My cognitie funection is slowly coming back though. Thanks for asking.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
We need cram school!

We need less choices on multiple choice questions.

:laugh:

 

[Xellos2099]

The idea is a sound one but does it really help the student learn more? I remember back in my high school days when I go to school at 8:00 a.m. and get out of school at around 3:00 pm and I am dead tire already. They can add more time if they want but would it really push more info into the child's brain? Adn by the time summer come it was so hot in classroom is is nearly impossible to concentrate. Yes, my HS doesn't have AC in classroom.

The study also show that while US high school student spend the last amount of days in school but we spend comparable amount of hours in comparison to Asia's high school. This mean while we spend less days in school, we spend more hours per days in a school year. That mean something... time is not the issue.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
We need cram school!

We need less choices on multiple choice questions.

:laugh:

True or False is the way of the future!

 

[miketheidiot]

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

 

[yllus]

Getting rid of the summer break and having longer school days have proven superior results.

WORK & LUCK: THOUGHTS ON OUTLIERS

In Chapter 8 Gladwell tackles the puzzle of Asian excellence in math. Are Asians genetically superior to Americans and Europeans in the area of mathematics? Rather than pointing to genetics to explain the standardized test score gap between Asians and Whites Gladwell tells a story of work. It is largely a cultural story, a tale of the work ethic of the rice patties. To understand this story one needs to understand the agriculture of rice patties.

Basically, rice is very difficult to grow, requiring hour-by-hour year round vigilance and sweat. Which is very different from Western agriculture (plant the corn, pray for rain, and take the winters off). The cultural rice-farming legacy is captured by an Asian proverb, "No one who can rise before dawn three hundred sixty days a year fails to make his family rich." Rice farming is about year round, hour-by-hour work.

Gladwell's argument is that success at math is largely a matter of work. Math is hard. And it takes persistence and sweat. Asians, shaped by the cultural ethic of the rice patty, simply work harder than American school kids on mathematical subjects. When American school children encounter difficult math problems they quickly give up. Asian children tend to work the problem and work the problem. Just like you work a rice patty. In short, Asians are "better" at math than American school children because Asians work harder. It's not genetic. It's work.

This lesson finds an American application in Chapter 9 when Gladwell takes up the successes of the KIPP Academy in New York City. KIPP is a middle school that produces outstanding students from inner city populations. The key to KIPP's success is simple: Work harder.

The KIPP kids start school earlier, end later, and have shorter summer vacations. KIPP kids are swamped with homework. They work late into the night and get up early for the earlier start time to the school day. And the outcome? Success. The lesson for American education couldn't be clearer. Want better standardized test scores? Want to compete educationally with other nations? Work harder. Longer school days. More homework. No summer vacations. It's simple. Work harder.

In short, Outliers preaches the value of work. And this seems to support the no tax ideology. Success goes to those who work.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

to a point it owuld help. More pay would get better people (in theory). in reality though we know it won't.

the school system needs scrapped and rebuilt. right now you have the teachers union protecting shitty teachers etc.

 

[Xellos2099]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

to a point it owuld help. More pay would get better people (in theory). in reality though we know it won't.

the school system needs scrapped and rebuilt. right now you have the teachers union protecting shitty teachers etc.

Exactly, union is the problem. There are many case where a new teacher is well like by students and a old teacher disliked by student. When the time come to firing teacher, it is the newer teacher who got the boot.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

you're a scrub, go away. Shit teachers should be fired. the rest work more and get paid more to do it.

 

[UberNeuman]

oh, jesus fuck.... All the bad spelling and syntax of those arguing against kids spending more time in school...

/priceless....

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

you're a scrub, go away. Shit teachers should be fired. the rest work more and get paid more to do it.

MONEY ISN'T THE PROBLEM. We keep giving the teachers more and more money and the results keep getting worse and worse. Private school teachers get paid less and perform better.. SALARIES are not the problem.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

Yep. Teachers just need more money. That will fix everything. :roll:

you're a scrub, go away. Shit teachers should be fired. the rest work more and get paid more to do it.

MONEY ISN'T THE PROBLEM. We keep giving the teachers more and more money and the results keep getting worse and worse. Private school teachers get paid less and perform better.. SALARIES are not the problem.

you are an idiot. I never said it was the only problem, or even a problem. You will have to pay people more to work more for less secure positions. Of course the only thing your feeble brain probably saw in my post was raise teacher pay and you had an aneurysm

 

[Fear No Evil]

Can you make a point without spewing insults? No, of course you can't. Let me quote you:

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it

You never said it was a problem? Am I living in some sort of alternative reality where you did not post the above? Not only did you SAY it, it was the FIRST thing you said. If you don't think its an important issue or even an issue I am not sure why you mentioned it at all, and mentioned it FIRST in your list of things that are wrong.

But yes, I guess I am just an 'idiot' and a 'scrub' for actually reading and responding to what you posted.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Can you make a point without spewing insults? No, of course you can't. Let me quote you:

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it

You never said it was a problem? Am I living in some sort of alternative reality where you did not post the above? Not only did you SAY it, it was the FIRST thing you said. If you don't think its an important issue or even an issue I am not sure why you mentioned it at all, and mentioned it FIRST in your list of things that are wrong.

But yes, I guess I am just an 'idiot' and a 'scrub' for actually reading and responding to what you posted.

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

like i said, you are just reading the part you want to read and ignoring the rest. Any legitimate commentary?

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Can you make a point without spewing insults? No, of course you can't. Let me quote you:

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it

You never said it was a problem? Am I living in some sort of alternative reality where you did not post the above? Not only did you SAY it, it was the FIRST thing you said. If you don't think its an important issue or even an issue I am not sure why you mentioned it at all, and mentioned it FIRST in your list of things that are wrong.

But yes, I guess I am just an 'idiot' and a 'scrub' for actually reading and responding to what you posted.

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

like i said, you are just reading the part you want to read and ignoring the rest. Any legitimate commentary?

Yes, I already provided it. Your primary point was inaccurate. If you want to word your posts more carefully in the future feel free. As for the rest of your points, I do agree that more focus has to be placed on core classes. Don't really have an opinion on shorter breaks or scantrons. So thats why I focused on your first statement which I thought was just wrong.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Can you make a point without spewing insults? No, of course you can't. Let me quote you:

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it

You never said it was a problem? Am I living in some sort of alternative reality where you did not post the above? Not only did you SAY it, it was the FIRST thing you said. If you don't think its an important issue or even an issue I am not sure why you mentioned it at all, and mentioned it FIRST in your list of things that are wrong.

But yes, I guess I am just an 'idiot' and a 'scrub' for actually reading and responding to what you posted.

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

like i said, you are just reading the part you want to read and ignoring the rest. Any legitimate commentary?

Yes, I already provided it. Your primary point was inaccurate. If you want to word your posts more carefully in the future feel free. As for the rest of your points, I do agree that more focus has to be placed on core classes. Don't really have an opinion on shorter breaks or scantrons. So thats why I focused on your first statement which I thought was just wrong.

you can think its wrong, but you would be incorrect in doing so

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Can you make a point without spewing insults? No, of course you can't. Let me quote you:

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it

You never said it was a problem? Am I living in some sort of alternative reality where you did not post the above? Not only did you SAY it, it was the FIRST thing you said. If you don't think its an important issue or even an issue I am not sure why you mentioned it at all, and mentioned it FIRST in your list of things that are wrong.

But yes, I guess I am just an 'idiot' and a 'scrub' for actually reading and responding to what you posted.

teachers need higher standards and pay to go along with it, and schools need to get rid of the fluff bullshit. more time devoted to core classes, ie science/math/english/history can only do good things. Finally, summer breaks should be sorter, but not entirely done away with. moar essays, less scantron bullshit.

btw: school vouchers

like i said, you are just reading the part you want to read and ignoring the rest. Any legitimate commentary?

Yes, I already provided it. Your primary point was inaccurate. If you want to word your posts more carefully in the future feel free. As for the rest of your points, I do agree that more focus has to be placed on core classes. Don't really have an opinion on shorter breaks or scantrons. So thats why I focused on your first statement which I thought was just wrong.

you can think its wrong, but you would be incorrect in doing so

As long as you say so.

 

[chucky2]

Originally posted by: rchiu
eh, the school and the gov. can do whatever they want but unless parents start caring, nothing is gonna change.

Kids in Asia don't do well because they stay in school longer (In fact the article point out some Asian country kids stay in school less), they do well because they have parents who care. Even in the US, you see very high achivers in racial group like Asain and Jewish people, those group often with parents and family who cares about and actively involves in their's kids edcuation.

People in this country, especially parents with kids in school need to stop pointing fingers and start to face up to their own responsibilities. Or else nothing is gonna work to improve the crap education result in this country.

X Infinity, /thread.

The kids that do well either have decided - for whatever reason themselves - that they will to do well, and/or, they have parents that aren't going to accept less than good results.

The kids who don't care, whether by their own choice or due to parents who don't care, and/or the parents who let their kids not deliver good results, will never learn.

If these schools want to fix the learning problems in this country, they'll hold a conference where both parents, and the kids, are there, and tell them: You are why we have low results compared to other countries. You will be the ones that reap the rewards of your efforts, whatever those rewards and efforts are. If You want to slack, so be it, your effort will reflect your grades. Have a safe trip home.

Asians and Indians students consistently get good results not because of their diet, but because bad results are not tolerated. The kids know that, and they perform to the task. Contrast that with a kid where the parent and in many cases the community doesn't care. Their results? 4 gen ghetto/trailer park. Is that the teachers fault? You could have the best F'ing teachers in the world at these schools, the best technology, and you'd still get largely poor results.

It's insane we keep asking teachers to fix something they can't: Parents.

Chuck

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: chucky2

Originally posted by: rchiu
It's insane we keep asking teachers to fix something they can't: Parents.

Chuck

While every teacher with involved parents has an easier job, but yes teachers can make a difference. I have a friend that dropped out of doing IT work to become a teacher. He started teaching algebra in underprivileged school. He quickly found his students could not do the basic math. So he dropped algebra and started teaching basic math. The students started learning, the parents were impressed that their kids were starting to like math. Unfortunately he was quickly reprimanded for deviating from the material he was supposed to teach. He also could not fail more than a handful of students and if he failed more than 2 or 3 minority students there was an investigation.

Needless to say he is back doing IT work now. Teacher can make a difference, but the system is quite broken in many places, which can keep a good teacher from doing their job.

 

[chucky2]

I totally believe that.

But why do you think he couldn't fail more than a handful of students, and couldn't fail 2-3 minority students?

It's because said parents, who then b1tch b1tch b1tch to the school admin, threaten lawsuits for oppressing they kid, etc. etc. make the Admin's at the school's put those policies in place. Worse, the Admin's will way too often not back the teachers when it comes to confronting a problem student and/or parent.

Teach in that environment for a year or four...you don't think it'd affect your teaching performance?

Chuck

 

[Xellos2099]

Two word, affirmative action.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: chucky2
I totally believe that.

But why do you think he couldn't fail more than a handful of students, and couldn't fail 2-3 minority students?

It's because said parents, who then b1tch b1tch b1tch to the school admin, threaten lawsuits for oppressing they kid, etc. etc. make the Admin's at the school's put those policies in place. Worse, the Admin's will way too often not back the teachers when it comes to confronting a problem student and/or parent.

Teach in that environment for a year or four...you don't think it'd affect your teaching performance?

Chuck

I am not sure who is at fault here.

If kids are getting passing grades, but learning nothing why should the average parent complain?
Is it our foolish drive to get everyone to graduate high school(water down standards so the slowest and dumbest can pass)?
Is it some warped funding mechanism that caused the admin to care, since they get fnding for attendance and not results?
Is it because there are broken schools and the admin tries to hide the failure, rather than fix the problem.

As much as people hate standardized testing it is required to throw some sunlight on these broken school so they can be fixed. If a school is found to be broken, all parents in that district should be supplied vouchers to send their kids to any other school(public or private).

 

[dahunan]

DO YOU DISAGREE THAT YOUR FELLOW WAL-MART EMPLOYEES ARE STUPID?