Iraq surrenders start

[UltraQuiet]

Originally posted by: MadRat
Actually, sketcher, I do understand. There is a difference with being in for 19 years as enlisted and with being of the line. Dave's smug attitude, largely garnered from his previous statements in other threads, reminds me of some Air Force chiefs I used to know. They were in so long they forgot what being an individual was all about. Anyone that can think independently seems to be a real threat to him, whereas a carreer officer better understand the reason why their higher ups make the decisions and stays focused on that outcome or they won't have a job for long.

One of these days will realize that his opinions are just that and have no relevance to anyone else outside his locus. Seriously, if he has such a canned attitude here in a forum I can only imagine how terribly he treats a subordinate. Yep, bet the guys around him cannot wait for him to leave. Until that time he can keep collecting his paycheck and continue being the best damn "yes man" in the navy. He's in for a shock once he joins the real world.

You continue to post in ignorance so I will try to enlighten you. I am an enlisted man, to be more exact a Chief Petty Officer. I have held that rank since 1992 and it will be the rank I retire at around this time next year. My experience includes 3 submarines and duty on a submarine squadron staff. On the squadron staff one of my duties was being the SubLant Trident sound silencing officer and assistant sound silencing officer for the entire sub force. Both of those jobs are normally held by LCDR's but due to the shortage of submarine officers in the 90's.... My duties onboard ship included both being the Leading Chief Petty Officer for Tactical Systems Departments ( normally had about thirty guys working for me) and as the Tactical Systems Officer, again a post held by a senior LT or a LCDR and again filled by me for a period of about 14 months due to shortages. The point is that your comment about me "not knowing" how or why officer's do things or what the big picture is strategically, is simply more of your ignorance transferred to a keyboard. The one thing that I am particularly proud of is that during the 90's, when people were getting out in droves, I had one guy who worked for me not re-enlist. One guy out of a total of about a hundred. He was a Torpedoman who got out of the Navy to be a corrections officer at a jail in Ohio. He came back in less than a year later and specifically requested to come back onboard the LOUISIANA where I was still the Tac. Sys. Dept. LCPO. So yeah it's obvious I treat my guys horribly and I don't encourage any independent thought. I mean, after all, everyone who has had thirty guys working for them at a time knows that the last thing you want is independent thought.

As far as your comments in the second paragraph. I have a BS in MIS and an MS in Operations Mgm't so I think I'm ready for the outside world. More importantly the companies around here (Memphis) also think so as several of them have already shown interest in hiring me. As to being a yes man you can rest assured that when my CO said "No!" I said "No!" . You can also be assured that being a yes man is not my strong suit nor does it benefit any Chief to be as such. SlowSS can attest to that. It is incumbent upon you to be the expert in your field and when you run across an officer who thinks he knows more about it than you, you had better tell him no. It's our job.

BTW you can accurately characterize the above as being narcissistic. It wasn't done to blow my own horn but to try to lift you out of your mental rut and pass on some knowledge. Accusing me (or any good Chief) of not taking care of my people or being a yes man would normally result in a very harsh reaction. I would very much like for you to be able to accuse me of such things in person. Not that you would, of course.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Rogue
Moonbeam,

You are an asinine, hypocritcal, nefarious, tool. Lives are spared in the looming war brought on by an evil dictator ruling a country by fear, aggression and weapons of mass destruction and all you can do is criticize an event of this nature by taking more shots at our nation and it's leaders and soldiers. I bet it smells bad and is very dark where you are, or at least where your head is all the time. Your entire statement was a testament to the shaky, piecemeal foundation of all your principals that are composed entirely of baseless claims, uneducated thoughts and ignorance of the real world. To quote a line from a movie that fits you completely, follows below:

"At no point in your rambling, did you even come close to an intelligent thought. I award you no points, may God have mercy on your soul."

BTW, while I don't like you much personally, you can appreciate that myself, my brother, my father, my grandfather and my great grandfather all fought, suffered and/or died on the battlefield for ass hats like you so you can spew your bull$hit freely like you do. A thank you to my family would be nice at least, if you can't support us in any other way. Better yet, save it. I don't want you to steal any more oxygen from the rest of the humans that walk this earth.

Hehehe, methinks you misunderstod him. Read his sig, his post is rather vague, but funny nonetheless.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: MadRat
Actually, sketcher, I do understand. There is a difference with being in for 19 years as enlisted and with being of the line. Dave's smug attitude, largely garnered from his previous statements in other threads, reminds me of some Air Force chiefs I used to know. They were in so long they forgot what being an individual was all about. Anyone that can think independently seems to be a real threat to him, whereas a carreer officer better understand the reason why their higher ups make the decisions and stays focused on that outcome or they won't have a job for long.

One of these days will realize that his opinions are just that and have no relevance to anyone else outside his locus. Seriously, if he has such a canned attitude here in a forum I can only imagine how terribly he treats a subordinate. Yep, bet the guys around him cannot wait for him to leave. Until that time he can keep collecting his paycheck and continue being the best damn "yes man" in the navy. He's in for a shock once he joins the real world.

Rat, your perceived "issues" with Dave do nothing to validate your insolence toward enlisted personnel or the officer's corps. I think Dave states his case quite well in his retort so I'll leave your insecurities with him to you and him.

What I will take you to task for is the simple, plain, ignorance in your disrespect of military personnel. SlowSS is on the mark in referring to you as a little kid. I'll follow up on that topic. Perhaps you're not a kid, but your attitude, choice of words and very obvious lack of a grasp on these topics is telling. You just sound immature and uninformed. There's nothing wrong with being immature and uninformed so don't feel bad about that. It's just that when you open your mouth on topics which you really don't have a clue about, you're not doing yourself any favors. In fact, regarding military personnel - you are rude, inconsiderate and very ignorant which places you quite far out of your league.

You mention having known some Airforce Chiefs? Really? I doubt it, but I'll give you some benefit anyway. Your supposed experience with those Airforce Chiefs does not justify a carte blanche dissertation of poor judgement across the board. If your experience with those Chiefs is in any way valid, I assure you that they are not the norm and you are still irresponsible in basing your current and future arguments on that assumption.

You really are off base with your perception of enlisted and officer ranks, at least that is for U.S. Armed Forces. Sure there is always the individual who gives basis for the stories told at the watercooler. But no one who really understands the life and means of the military would even think of climbing out on the limb which you so carelessly swing from. It's uninformed, innaccurate, inconsiderate, inflammatory and to say the least - irresponsible.

You're out of line son.

 

[MadRat]

Sketcher,

Dave called me out so in return I called Dave out and nailed his prickly attitude dead to rights. Your opinions of who you think I am mean nothing to me personally, and its great you have your own opinions. If you want to debate in PM or start another thread about Dave's or my attitude around here then thats fine. I'd rather stay on topic in this thread which is exactly what Dave didn't have the courtesy to do in his very first post.

As far as belittling all enlisted then thats your opinion of what I said. I targeted my slight at Dave and others in his position that have gone overboard with their job so to speak. I have more respect for any one soldier than Dave probably has for the whole of the human race. My issue with him is for his inability to handle real people and their real opinions.

To say I've known "chiefs" is not the point I was making; these individuals weren't just chiefs they were real jackasses. I've known and worked with alot of Air Force personell over the years, enlisted and officer, big and small alike. Dave represents the dark side of spending ones entire life "enlisted" in the military field. I've met a majority in the ranks that earned their right to be there, and "earn" in this case means something more than the simple word. Some don't necessarily survive year after year by being the best; some guys survive by attrition. I'm willing to bet Dave wore out the competition.

 

[UltraQuiet]

Dave called me out so in return I called Dave out and nailed his prickly attitude dead to rights. Your opinions of who you think I am mean nothing to me personally, and its great you have your own opinions. If you want to debate in PM or start another thread about Dave's or my attitude around here then thats fine. I'd rather stay on topic in this thread which is exactly what Dave didn't have the courtesy to do in his very first post.

Damn right I called you out and I asked you a question that you have yet to really answer. My post was a direct question to you and a highlighting of your already widely recognized ignorance.

As far as belittling all enlisted then thats your opinion of what I said. I targeted my slight at Dave and others in his position that have gone overboard with their job so to speak. I have more respect for any one soldier than Dave probably has for the whole of the human race. My issue with him is for his inability to handle real people and their real opinions.

Oh you definetely belittled all enlisted people and you do so again in the next paragraph. You have absolutely no idea how I do my job except for what I have told you which you conveniently ignore. Real people have real opinions based on knowledge. Since I consider it impossible for someone to be as stupid as you appear to be and not already be dead, I don't consider you a real person and you certainly don't have a real opinion.

To say I've known "chiefs" is not the point I was making; these individuals weren't just chiefs they were real jackasses. I've known and worked with alot of Air Force personell over the years, enlisted and officer, big and small alike. Dave represents the dark side of spending ones entire life "enlisted" in the military field. I've met a majority in the ranks that earned their right to be there, and "earn" in this case means something more than the simple word. Some don't necessarily survive year after year by being the best; some guys survive by attrition. I'm willing to bet Dave wore out the competition.

Again the belittlement. That's OK, I'll consider the source. The fact that you want to compare the Air Force with the other branches of service only confirms the rest of the ignorance you've posted. Somehow being enlisted for twenty years is the "dark side" and is unworthy in your eyes. This last statement is the best yet "Some don't necessarily survive year after year by being the best; some guys survive by attrition. I'm willing to bet Dave wore out the competition." What exactly does that mean? Do you even know? Please explain if you can. I'd be very careful about making assumptions again if I were you. I'd hate to have to tell you what/who got "wore out". Actually I'd love to tell you but you won't like it at all.

BTW the PM's you sent me will stay as PM's. Embarassing you any more would be cruel of me and would probably have you running off to tell the mods.

 

[MadRat]

I already told you that the PMs could be put out and none of them bother me one bit. Then again your PMs never have bothered me. Seems that the only one sensitive to someone else publishing PMs was you when I put your hot-headed response out there for the general public a long time ago. Like I told Sketcher, better to stay on topic in this thread. If you want to debate about your attitude or mine then PMs or another thread would be better.

As far as the "dark side" comment, it doesn't include all of the chiefs I've met, only the bad few. Most chiefs have earned their way.

 

[Zebo]

Mad and rat I never seen a more appropriate user name. Your totally nuts if you don't think people in the military work way more hours perday at lower pay than most civilian employees...Nevermind the fact they are away from thier families and increase thier liklyhood of dying for this job. It's called sacrifice and that's why you shoudl respect those who wear the uniform. And you're a rat for taking out your obvious personel resentment for dave by diperaging large swaths of personel in post after post of unsupported opinion. I think you owe dave a appology but I doubt you have the balls.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: MadRat
I already told you that the PMs could be put out and none of them bother me one bit. Then again your PMs never have bothered me. Seems that the only one sensitive to someone else publishing PMs was you when I put your hot-headed response out there for the general public a long time ago. Like I told Sketcher, better to stay on topic in this thread. If you want to debate about your attitude or mine then PMs or another thread would be better.

As far as the "dark side" comment, it doesn't include all of the chiefs I've met, only the bad few. Most chiefs have earned their way.

Apparently the game doesn't play quite fair MadRat, a new post taking you to task was locked nearly as fast as I posted it.

To keep this particular post "ON TOPIC"... Who woulda thought there'd be so many Iraqi's so quick to surrender!? On the other hand... they've likely got more sense than some rats that run around the place.

 

[Phuz]

Originally posted by: Carbonyl
Mad and rat I never seen a more appropriate user name. Your totally nuts if you don't think people in the military work way more hours perday at lower pay than most civilian employees...Nevermind the fact they are away from thier families and increase thier liklyhood of dying for this job. It's called sacrifice and that's why you shoudl respect those who wear the uniform. And you're a rat for taking out your obvious personel resentment for dave by diperaging large swaths of personel in post after post of unsupported opinion. I think you owe dave a appology but I doubt you have the balls.

Actually, the average salary for a civ is lower than the average salary for someone in the military. And yes, it is a sacrafice... his sacrafice, as it is was his choice to join. I'm sure even Dave didn't join the army to be considered a hero, and have more respect...

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Sketcher

Originally posted by: MadRat
I already told you that the PMs could be put out and none of them bother me one bit. Then again your PMs never have bothered me. Seems that the only one sensitive to someone else publishing PMs was you when I put your hot-headed response out there for the general public a long time ago. Like I told Sketcher, better to stay on topic in this thread. If you want to debate about your attitude or mine then PMs or another thread would be better.

As far as the "dark side" comment, it doesn't include all of the chiefs I've met, only the bad few. Most chiefs have earned their way.

Apparently the game doesn't play quite fair MadRat, a new post taking you to task was locked nearly as fast as I posted it.

To keep this particular post "ON TOPIC"... Who woulda thought there'd be so many Iraqi's so quick to surrender!? On the other hand... they've likely got more sense than some rats that run around the place.

A word of caution Sketcher, don't say anything harsh to MR via PM or he'll ge running to the Mods like a wounded little bitch.

 

[SlowSS]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Sketcher

Originally posted by: MadRat
I already told you that the PMs could be put out and none of them bother me one bit. Then again your PMs never have bothered me. Seems that the only one sensitive to someone else publishing PMs was you when I put your hot-headed response out there for the general public a long time ago. Like I told Sketcher, better to stay on topic in this thread. If you want to debate about your attitude or mine then PMs or another thread would be better.

As far as the "dark side" comment, it doesn't include all of the chiefs I've met, only the bad few. Most chiefs have earned their way.

Apparently the game doesn't play quite fair MadRat, a new post taking you to task was locked nearly as fast as I posted it.

To keep this particular post "ON TOPIC"... Who woulda thought there'd be so many Iraqi's so quick to surrender!? On the other hand... they've likely got more sense than some rats that run around the place.

A word of caution Sketcher, don't say anything harsh to MR via PM or he'll ge running to the Mods like a wounded little bitch.

Hmmm, that is the second time that some one mentioned that Rat likes to run to the mods and whine instead of taking care of the situation himself.

You know, my six year daughter does that when she gets picked on by her sister.

 

[xirtam]

Way to go, Moonbeam. I have to hand it to you for your knowledge of psychology. 3-line flame bait thread-jacker. My question is: do you plan to actually post meaningful commentaries, or are you just being manipulative for the hell of it? To prove a point more subtly made on a different level and have it go altogether unnoticed... does that provide satisfaction to your deranged soul?

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: Phuz

Originally posted by: Carbonyl
Mad and rat I never seen a more appropriate user name. Your totally nuts if you don't think people in the military work way more hours perday at lower pay than most civilian employees...Nevermind the fact they are away from thier families and increase thier liklyhood of dying for this job. It's called sacrifice and that's why you shoudl respect those who wear the uniform. And you're a rat for taking out your obvious personel resentment for dave by diperaging large swaths of personel in post after post of unsupported opinion. I think you owe dave a appology but I doubt you have the balls.

Actually, the average salary for a civ is lower than the average salary for someone in the military. And yes, it is a sacrafice... his sacrafice, as it is was his choice to join. I'm sure even Dave didn't join the army to be considered a hero, and have more respect...

Actually, you're referring to the average salary being a standard 40 hour work week. There's no such thing as a 40 hour work week in the Military - you have on and off duty status but you're on call 24/7 and if you're deployed, 8 hour work days are the stuff of dreams. Sure there are some who have desk jobs and set working hours for a time, but it's not the whole, and it's not the deployed Navy.

Heh, Thanks Guys for the heads up on the rodent... It's too bad that now we not only have to search for reposts before posting, but also for whiney, can't back their own posts w/out tattling @$$hats before we dare put forth a bit of reason.

 

[SlowSS]

Originally posted by: Sketcher

Originally posted by: Phuz

Originally posted by: Carbonyl
Mad and rat I never seen a more appropriate user name. Your totally nuts if you don't think people in the military work way more hours perday at lower pay than most civilian employees...Nevermind the fact they are away from thier families and increase thier liklyhood of dying for this job. It's called sacrifice and that's why you shoudl respect those who wear the uniform. And you're a rat for taking out your obvious personel resentment for dave by diperaging large swaths of personel in post after post of unsupported opinion. I think you owe dave a appology but I doubt you have the balls.

Actually, the average salary for a civ is lower than the average salary for someone in the military. And yes, it is a sacrafice... his sacrafice, as it is was his choice to join. I'm sure even Dave didn't join the army to be considered a hero, and have more respect...

Actually, you're referring to the average salary being a standard 40 hour work week. There's no such thing as a 40 hour work week in the Military - you have on and off duty status but you're on call 24/7 and if you're deployed, 8 hour work days are the stuff of dreams. Sure there are some who have desk jobs and set working hours for a time, but it's not the whole, and it's not the deployed Navy.

Very good point Sketcher.

As you and DaveSohmer are fully aware that even on shore normal work hours are around 9 hr/day and at times you have to work weekends, add 4 to 8 hour duties three to 4 times per/month.

On deployments, normal work hours are 12 on and 12 off, but you usually end up working 14 to 15 hour/day as long as you are floating. Oh, there is no such thing as overtime pay in the military.

Lot of civilians don't understand these long hours that military personnel has to put in, and yet, they won't hesistate to compare civilian work hours/pay against military work hours/pay.

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: SlowSS

Hmmm, that is the second time that some one mentioned that Rat likes to run to the mods and whine instead of taking care of the situation himself.
You know, my six year daughter does that when she gets picked on by her sister.

Actually both who said it were Red Dawn and Dave for their behavior in another thread. They were bashing someone else and so I corrected them. Dave and Red thought their comments in PM should have been left private. The only ones crying about it are these very same two.

And, sketcher, the salary for military personell are immaterial to their sacrifice. Thats like saying a cop needs to be paid huge pensions because they put their life on the line just because they were a cop. Excuse me, but everyone puts their lives on the line when they roll out of bed. Big deal. If we all expected to get paid for every sacrifice in life then nothing would get done. America has always worked because people sacrifice. Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: MadRat

Originally posted by: SlowSS

Hmmm, that is the second time that some one mentioned that Rat likes to run to the mods and whine instead of taking care of the situation himself.
You know, my six year daughter does that when she gets picked on by her sister.

Actually both who said it were Red Dawn and Dave for their behavior in another thread. They were bashing someone else and so I corrected them. Dave and Red thought their comments in PM should have been left private. The only ones crying about it are these very same two.

And, sketcher, the salary for military personell are immaterial to their sacrifice. Thats like saying a cop needs to be paid huge pensions because they put their life on the line just because they were a cop. Excuse me, but everyone puts their lives on the line when they roll out of bed. Big deal. If we all expected to get paid for every sacrifice in life then nothing would get done. America has always worked because people sacrifice. Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

MadRat, you simplistic Dumbass, I'm not the one incorrectly quoting salaries. I merely clarified the issue for the uninitiate. Your head's so far up your own ass that you can't even keep your own issues straight. :disgust:

--- Did you really Take a PM and post it!? PM = Private Message. Am I missing something here?

 

[SlowSS]

Originally posted by: MadRat

And, sketcher, the salary for military personell are immaterial to their sacrifice. Thats like saying a cop needs to be paid huge pensions because they put their life on the line just because they were a cop. Excuse me, but everyone puts their lives on the line when they roll out of bed. Big deal. If we all expected to get paid for every sacrifice in life then nothing would get done. America has always worked because people sacrifice. Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

You know, I'm done with this argument because we are hijacking this thead.

It takes two to tango....Do you know what I mean?

Your disparaging of all enlisted people is a sad reminder of just what type of person you really are.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: SlowSS

Originally posted by: MadRat

And, sketcher, the salary for military personell are immaterial to their sacrifice. Thats like saying a cop needs to be paid huge pensions because they put their life on the line just because they were a cop. Excuse me, but everyone puts their lives on the line when they roll out of bed. Big deal. If we all expected to get paid for every sacrifice in life then nothing would get done. America has always worked because people sacrifice. Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

You know, I'm done with this argument because we are hijacking this thead.

It takes two to tango....Do you know what I mean?

Your disparaging of all enlisted people is a sad reminder of just what type of person you really are.

Roger that, (Sorry for the Hi-Jack) Tango over,

-Sketcher out.

 

[UltraQuiet]

Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

What the fsck is your malfunction. You have never served, you certainly have never served with me and yet you continue to make these comments like you know me or something. I've never proclaimed I was valuable to society. My "bad attitude" and "America stretching at the seams". What is that, a joke? Where exactly does your base of knowledge come from? Are you goverment service, contractor, camp follower or what? Hopefully you'll start answering some of the questions you've been asked in this thread. Not that it has anything to do with your lame little challenge but the jump has already started. I have a retirement date and a lot of interest from civilian companies. It seems that civilian companies are wholly unimpressed with the workforce and can't wait to get their hands on ex-military. Probably lots of bad experiences with people like you.

 

[UltraQuiet]

Originally posted by: Sketcher

Originally posted by: MadRat

Originally posted by: SlowSS

Hmmm, that is the second time that some one mentioned that Rat likes to run to the mods and whine instead of taking care of the situation himself.
You know, my six year daughter does that when she gets picked on by her sister.

Actually both who said it were Red Dawn and Dave for their behavior in another thread. They were bashing someone else and so I corrected them. Dave and Red thought their comments in PM should have been left private. The only ones crying about it are these very same two.

And, sketcher, the salary for military personell are immaterial to their sacrifice. Thats like saying a cop needs to be paid huge pensions because they put their life on the line just because they were a cop. Excuse me, but everyone puts their lives on the line when they roll out of bed. Big deal. If we all expected to get paid for every sacrifice in life then nothing would get done. America has always worked because people sacrifice. Its the incredibly bad attitudes like Dave that make the American way stretch at the seams trying to hold together under their crassness. If he's really so incredibly valuable to society then I challenge him to put the money where his mouth is and to make the jump. He'll be in for a surprise.

MadRat, you simplistic Dumbass, I'm not the one incorrectly quoting salaries. I merely clarified the issue for the uninitiate. Your head's so far up your own ass that you can't even keep your own issues straight. :disgust:

--- Did you really Take a PM and post it!? PM = Private Message. Am I missing something here?

Oh yeah he did. He also went and told the mods that Red and I were cussing at him. He's sent me a couple tonight and I told him I was thinking about posting them, just jerking his chain. He really does appear to be a very sad, pusillanimous little boy.

I will take a cue from my brother, SlowSS, and refrain from making anymore OT posts in this thread.

 

[bjc112]

Originally posted by: Rogue
Moonbeam,

You are an asinine, hypocritcal, nefarious, tool. Lives are spared in the looming war brought on by an evil dictator ruling a country by fear, aggression and weapons of mass destruction and all you can do is criticize an event of this nature by taking more shots at our nation and it's leaders and soldiers. I bet it smells bad and is very dark where you are, or at least where your head is all the time. Your entire statement was a testament to the shaky, piecemeal foundation of all your principals that are composed entirely of baseless claims, uneducated thoughts and ignorance of the real world. To quote a line from a movie that fits you completely, follows below:

"At no point in your rambling, did you even come close to an intelligent thought. I award you no points, may God have mercy on your soul."

BTW, while I don't like you much personally, you can appreciate that myself, my brother, my father, my grandfather and my great grandfather all fought, suffered and/or died on the battlefield for ass hats like you so you can spew your bull$hit freely like you do. A thank you to my family would be nice at least, if you can't support us in any other way. Better yet, save it. I don't want you to steal any more oxygen from the rest of the humans that walk this earth.

OOOOOOOuch..

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: DaveSohmer
Oh yeah he did. He also went and told the mods that Red and I were cussing at him. He's sent me a couple tonight and I told him I was thinking about posting them, just jerking his chain. He really does appear to be a very sad, pusillanimous little boy.

Awww, Dave's PM that went to the mod was pretty much all about how many ways Dave could ride my bare backside. And, Dave, I've sent two responses to you, one to answer your response in the thread. The other to respond that its a good thing for you to publish my telling you in the first PM I'd have no problem telling you to kiss my ass in person. Respect is earned.

 

[Jmman]

fight, fight, fight........j/k......

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Phuz

Originally posted by: Rogue
Moonbeam,

BTW, while I don't like you much personally, you can appreciate that myself, my brother, my father, my grandfather and my great grandfather all fought, suffered and/or died on the battlefield for ass hats like you so you can spew your bull$hit freely like you do. A thank you to my family would be nice at least, if you can't support us in any other way. Better yet, save it. I don't want you to steal any more oxygen from the rest of the humans that walk this earth.

You're assuming your brethren have been a part of only just wars, ones that were demmed a necessity, crucial to the well being of your country.
They deserve thanks JUST because they went to war? Why thank someone if you do not support the cause, the need to go to war. The ends don't always justify the means. If it was for WW2, or a war of similar gravity, I thank them. But Vietnam and similar mistakes... sorry.

I guess what I want to say to this is best left unsaid... but I can say that when I was 17 and joined the service I didn't think I'd come home to what I came home to.... unjust or not... I didn't make the political decisions... gulf of tonkin etc... I just did my bit the same as if it were a real war.... no need to thank anyone cuz as I see it, I like being an American and the six years service I owed... I suppose we each owe six years to the service of our country and I did mine... if you didn't do yours.... well .... thats ok too.... I suppose... but please don't think that I have or had a choice of which war I'll fight in.... we do elect the folks who choose for us and it is where the venom should be directed.... I sure hope the folks who come back from the next event come home to a greatful nation... just or unjust as the fighting may be.... for the most part these are young men and women.... the grandkids of my buddies... those buddies who died just as those who died before them.... or live on today... wondering why... and with a faint nod ... salute and perhaps from time to time even cry...

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: HJD1
I sure hope the folks who come back from the next event come home to a greatful nation... just or unjust as the fighting may be.... for the most part these are young men and women.... the grandkids of my buddies... those buddies who died just as those who died before them.... or live on today... wondering why... and with a faint nod ... salute and perhaps from time to time even cry...

And contrary to what some of the people think around here about just/unjust wars, every life counts, regardless how they die. To be a pawn is just a fact of life. Whether a guy dies because he took a bullet or from some freak accident, it doesn't lessen their duty. Unlike the assertions of a few around here, we can do our service then move on without blowing our horn about it. I've got alot of respect for the fellas who served and don't talk about it. I have varying respect for the guy who served and wears his deeds on the chest and sleeve out in public for appearances sake. If you earned your way there is no need to present your service record. Thank God for our pawns, without them the American way is a myth.