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Intel Skylake / Kaby Lake

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Sweepr

Diamond Member
May 12, 2006
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That will be almost two years from now (Q3-Q4 2018).
Everything points to late 2017 / early 2018 for desktops, so one year from now.

Intel reportedly is planning to add USB 3.1 and Wi-Fi functions into its motherboard chipsets and the new design may be implemented in its upcoming 300-series scheduled to be released at the end of 2017, according to sources from motherboard makers. Intel declined to comment on market speculation.
http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20161110PD210.html

According to Intel's roadmap, the chipmaker is expected to roll out its 10nm notebook-use Cannon Lake and 14nm desktop-use Coffee Lake CPUs in the second half of 2017 and to bring out Ice Lake CPUs in 2018.
www.digitimes.com/news/a20160904PD201.html
 
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witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
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Will we see Zen+ until then? This might have some influence on pricing and timing.
Zen isn't even out yet, so early to expect Zen+. AMD's lineup has little influence on Intel's business.

But sure AMD will need Zen+ because, as all the AMD fan say, Zen is full of "bugs" that still need to fixed.
 

Sweepr

Diamond Member
May 12, 2006
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You do realize roadmaps change all the time AtenRa? That one in particular could be very old. We have two DigiTimes articles from September and November stating Coffee Lake-S + 300-series motherboard should arrive roughly a year after Kaby Lake-S - first one even mentions H2-2017. This is not the first time Intel releases certain chips for desktop before their mobile counterparts either, same happened back in 2015 in the Skylake generation.
 

jpiniero

Diamond Member
Oct 1, 2010
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If it really did slip to Q3 2018, that would be quite a long time for Kaby Lake-S to be out without a replacement. Not saying it won't happen though.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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If it really did slip to Q3 2018, that would be quite a long time for Kaby Lake-S to be out without a replacement. Not saying it won't happen though.
Skylake-S released date was Q3 2015 (5th August), Kabylake-S release date is Q1 2017 and that is 17-18 months. Same interval will be for Coffeelake-S.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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You do realize roadmaps change all the time AtenRa? That one in particular could be very old. We have two DigiTimes articles from September and November stating Coffee Lake-S + 300-series motherboard should arrive roughly a year after Kaby Lake-S - first one even mentions H2-2017. This is not the first time Intel releases certain chips for desktop before their mobile counterparts either, same happened back in 2015 in the Skylake generation.
With desktop volumes shrinking each year i dont expect new releases bellow the 16-18 months interval from now on.
 
Mar 10, 2006
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With desktop volumes shrinking each year i dont expect new releases bellow the 16-18 months interval from now on.
Um, that's exactly the opposite of what you'd want to do in a shrinking market...give people even less reason to upgrade.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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Um, that's exactly the opposite of what you'd want to do in a shrinking market...give people even less reason to upgrade.
We are in a worst case situation now, fab/design cost is rising, volume sales is shrinking, only thing left to do is increase the time of your chips available in the market.

You need to sell X amount of chips to amortize the R&D cost for the fabs, tools, chip design etc. When you sell less X amount of Chips per month, you need to increase the time thus 16-18 months instead of 12 months for new releases.
 

DerpEinstein

Junior Member
Dec 24, 2016
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0% ipc gain.... What a joke, and intel is making another generation on 14nm too! I doubt coffee lake will even have a small clock boost.

The door is wide open for amd, and we desperately need them.
 
Mar 10, 2006
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At the same time it would cut costs.
Intel tried that little stunt by not doing Broadwell-S and it led to an acceleration in desktop declines. The guy in charge of that decision said that this was a mistake and that they wouldn't do that again.

If you save a little bit in R&D but then you lose $1B+ in revenue, you aren't really saving money are you?
 

Head1985

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2014
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witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
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The door is wide open for amd, and we desperately need them.
Don't expect those 40% gains every year. AMD might come close to Intel, like they're doing now, but they won't surpass them. (By more than say 10% higher perf/clock.)
 

jpiniero

Diamond Member
Oct 1, 2010
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Intel tried that little stunt by not doing Broadwell-S and it led to an acceleration in desktop declines. The guy in charge of that decision said that this was a mistake and that they wouldn't do that again.
I don't think they care. They could always do a Kaby Lake refresh/rebrand if thought they needed to spruce things up.

Let me put it this way, I wouldn't be surprised if Intel got in bed with RTG if it meant they could layoff their IGP department. It's probably a bad idea strategically to help AMD out like that.
 

witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
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Intel tried that little stunt by not doing Broadwell-S and it led to an acceleration in desktop declines. The guy in charge of that decision said that this was a mistake and that they wouldn't do that again.
It wasn't really a mistake since releasing desktop BDW chips in mid-2014 would have been a complete margin suicide, which investors also wouldn't have liked. Instead Intel churned out another year of excellent yielding 22nm fully depreciated chips, which you clearly saw in '14 bottom line.
 
Mar 10, 2006
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It wasn't really a mistake since releasing desktop BDW chips in mid-2014 would have been a complete margin suicide, which investors also wouldn't have liked. Instead Intel churned out another year of excellent yielding 22nm fully depreciated chips, which you clearly saw in '14 bottom line.
They just took Haswell chips and boosted the clocks. No new media capability (which Haswell desperately needed), no better transistors/physical design, etc.

Kaby Lake is a better update than Haswell Refresh was, but I do think if Intel is going to stay on these nodes for 3-4 generations they need to do more to boost performance like porting over and implementing newer CPU/GPU uArchs, integrating additional IP blocks, etc.

"Over the last three months I have conducted numerous project reviews with our execution teams, and there is a clear trend that has emerged in these reviews - a lack of product/customer focus in execution that is creating schedule and competitiveness gaps in our products,"
That's what Murthy had to say about the state of Intel's product development when he took charge.

http://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/index.ssf/2016/04/intels_new_president_launches.html
 

Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
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I think enthusiasts will be able to choose between KBL-X and SKL-X on the Intel side Q3 of 2017 for those who can't wait for Cannon Lake S. KBL-X will just be another stock clock jump and SKL-X will be more cores (and a new platform for both). Zen will be an option with likely lower system costs and very good performance (how good the quads(4C/8T) will be depends on process maturity by Q3). An interesting year, IMHO.

That said, we won't see the 'glory' days of CPUs again unless there is a technological breakthrough leading to an inflection point in perf/$ - or one that leads to the redefinition of a CPU/SOC.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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0% ipc gain.... What a joke, and intel is making another generation on 14nm too! I doubt coffee lake will even have a small clock boost.

The door is wide open for amd, and we desperately need them.
Kaby Lake was not supposed to have any ipc gain, though. All this complaining about it seems odd.
 
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witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
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That's what Murthy had to say about the state of Intel's product development when he took charge.

http://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/index.ssf/2016/04/intels_new_president_launches.html
Uh, by that time BK has been CEO for 2 years almost, and Murthy basically says that he's done an awful job of getting the company's stuff together.

We don't exactly know which products he's talking about, though. But it does show that maybe having a predefined company culture might impede succes, a bit like incest (inbreeding). But that's just me guessing from the outside.
 

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