Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing Raptor Lake-U. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q1 2026.

		Intel Raptor Lake U	Intel Wildcat Lake 15W?	Intel Lunar Lake		Intel Panther Lake 4+0+4
Launch Date		Q1-2024	Q2-2026	Q3-2024		Q1-2026
Model		Intel 150U	Intel Core 7	Core Ultra 7 268V		Core Ultra 7 365
Dies		2	2	2		3
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		Intel 18-A + Intel 3 + TSMC N6
CPU		2 P-core + 8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores
Threads		12	6	8		8
Max Clock		5.4 GHz	?	5 GHz		4.8 GHz
L3 Cache		12 MB		12 MB		12 MB
TDP		15 - 55 W	15 W ?	17 - 37 W		25 - 55 W
Memory		128-bit LPDDR5-5200	64-bit LPDDR5	128-bit LPDDR5x-8533		128-bit LPDDR5x-7467
Size		96 GB		32 GB		128 GB
Bandwidth				136 GB/s
GPU		Intel Graphics	Intel Graphics	Arc 140V		Intel Graphics
RT		No	No	YES		YES
EU / Xe		96 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		4 Xe
Max Clock		1.3 GHz	?	2 GHz		2.5 GHz
NPU		GNA 3.0	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		49 TOPS

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[adroc_thurston]

NOT EVERYTHING IS ABOUT ABSOLUTE PERFORMANCE.

It kinda is, just that PTL has none to speak of.
iGPs nice enough at least.

 

[poke01]

It kinda is, just that PTL has none to speak of.
iGPs nice enough at least.

In the laptop space? It’s not the determining factor for most.

 

[fastandfurious6]

Halo is all you need

from 2025 onwards no distinction between desktop/laptop chips, they're the same

efficient interconnect = even handheld can reap big perf of 9950X desktop chip at 30W / ULW

so what's the point about H chips which are nerfed by default? Just get half cores 9700X still better

and yes AMD should make 3Dcache accessible in more models lollll

 

[poke01]

Halo is all you need

from 2025 onwards no distinction between desktop/laptop chips, they're the same

efficient interconnect = even handheld can reap big perf of 9950X desktop chip at 30W / ULW

so what's the point about H chips which are nerfed by default? Just get half cores 9700X still better

and yes AMD should make 3Dcache accessible in more models lollll

Cost?

 

[fastandfurious6]

halfcores 9700X (laptop edition) better and cheaper than any intel H chip

 

[adroc_thurston]

It’s not the determining factor for most.

Oh no you very much need the perf.
Just not with sacrifices anywhere else.

 

[fastandfurious6]

yeah CPU = perf literally... as long as thermals/W are sane

 

[511]

Intel H chips are too weak

No real market... bet Phoenix still better than panther H

AMDs entire H lineup is weak looses to RPL H which can clock to 5.8Ghz 😛

 

[adroc_thurston]

AMDs entire H lineup is weak looses to RPL H which can clock to 5.8Ghz 😛

a) truthnuke
b) i just love 50W 1t power in a laptop

 

[511]

a) truthnuke
b) i just love 50W 1t power in a laptop

It's not 50W though around 35-40W

 

[Schmide]

That makes no sense. Zen 5 architecture details/slides are not hard to find.

They go into the later architectures. Mostly zen2 -> zen3, and they do touch on avx512. It wasn't bad.

 

[Philste]

Yeah. The top one is a meme of meme volume, mainly for benchmark purposes. Intel's done this before. The lower 7 bin is the one that OEMs will use.

If the clocks stay at least reasonable close, i dont think it's that big of an Issue. For LNL it was -300MHz on CPU and -100MHz on iGPU for 258V and 288V, with the 268V with only -100MHz on the CPU as well. That's a 5% difference in ST at best.

AMD did the same 4 Years ago with Cezanne. The 5980HS/HX were nonexistant. The HS had one Asus Device, the HX was never seen. They had advertised 4.8GHz back then, they ended up with the 5900HX/HS with 4.6GHz as Top End.

 

[Covfefe]

CS433: Computer System Organization

Interesting that from AMD side they chose Zen 2 but for Intel they chose Lunar Lake.

Do they think that Lunar Lake is the first competent Intel architecture since Haswell? Or did Intel give them incentives (like free laptops or goodies etc.) and also to promote their laptop sales?

Which reason could it be I wonder?

Looks like they picked technically interesting and historically significant architectures. Zen2 and Lunar Lake are some of the most interesting CPU designs in recent years.

Zen2 was AMD's first modern chiplet CPU. They hadn't moved to 8-core CCXs yet, which means two CCXs per CCD. It was their first AVX-512 enabled CPU. AMD primarily uses chiplets for cost savings via better yields, design reuse, and older nodes for less critical chiplets. AMD's chiplet strategy has remained more or less the same since Zen2.

Lunar Lake's chiplets are far more advanced than AMD's. The chiplet interconnect is more advanced. It has more bandwidth, lower power consumption, and uses a base tile. The chiplet architecture is probably cheaper than a monolithic N3B CPU (otherwise, why would they bother with chiplets?), but the cost savings aren't nearly as big as AMD's approach. Lunar Lake also has heterogeneous cores (p-cores and e-cores). It's e-cores are used for low power workloads AND multithreaded performance (I believe it's the first Intel CPU to use e-cores that way). And it has on-package ram, an SLC, and an NPU.

 

[MS_AT]

It was their first AVX-512 enabled CPU.

Rather first full AVX2 implementation, meaning native 256b.

 

[Covfefe]

Rather first full AVX2 implementation, meaning native 256b.

Ah, you're right. I misremembered.

 

[regen1]

Three 4+8+4+12? Why?

That's nothing out of the ordinary, has been the norm for a long time.

The top die config used as:
(i) i9/u9 for the highest bin/max clocks.
(ii)i7/u7 vPro SKU(plus higher clocks than the mainstream i7/u7),
(iii)the more mainstream i7, generally has been the most available in designs

i9 12900H	i9 13900H	U9 185H	U9 285H	Top bin/highest clocks
i7 12800H	i7 13800H	U7 165H	U7 265H	vPro SKUs, higher clocks than mainstream i7/u7, mostly available in business and and some premium designs
i7 12700H	i7 13700H	U7 155H	U7 255H	Generally have been most mainstream SKUs of this die config

The only major new thing about PTL(-H?) line up is that there are two versions of these chips: one with 12Xe3 tile IGPU and other with 4Xe3 tile IGPU

 

[dullard]

i9 12900H

i9 13900H

U9 185H

U9 285H

Top bin/highest clocks

One thing that I'd add is that the "top bin/highest clocks" category also usually comes with a much higher TDP. Yes, it can clock high, but you better be prepared to have it suck down the battery (or most likely run it while plugged in). These are simply the chips that are binned to be able to take the heat.

Take the 285H, its base power is 45 W vs 28 W for the other Arrow Lake chips in your post. Same type of power difference goes with most of the other generations you listed.

 

[regen1]

Take the 285H, its base power is 45 W vs 28 W for the other Arrow Lake chips in your post. Same type of power difference goes with most of the other generations you listed.

Yeah, the flagship has higher power budget for sustaining more clocks for multiple cores(also at various power configs/levels as well).

 

[Fjodor2001]

Some more Panther Lake leaks/info from the AMD tech event held on October 2:

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/intel-reveal-tech-details-forthcoming-pc-chip-sources-say-2025-10-07/

”The company conducted hours of technical briefings and factory tours in Arizona for industry analysts last week on the new Panther Lake microarchitecture, including detailed explanations of the graphics and central processor cores and its media engine, according to the sources. Intel revealed a redesigned AI engine and the company's efficiency and performance processor cores, which were redesigned for the 18A manufacturing process.”

”Intel executives have said the Panther Lake chips will be available early in 2026, according to the sources. The new chips use 30% less energy than the prior generation, and its graphics and central processors will receive a 50% boost in their ability to crunch data in some situations, according to a second source briefed on the chips.”

 

[poke01]

Some more Panther Lake leaks/info from the AMD tech event held on October 2:

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/intel-reveal-tech-details-forthcoming-pc-chip-sources-say-2025-10-07/

”The company conducted hours of technical briefings and factory tours in Arizona for industry analysts last week on the new Panther Lake microarchitecture, including detailed explanations of the graphics and central processor cores and its media engine, according to the sources. Intel revealed a redesigned AI engine and the company's efficiency and performance processor cores, which were redesigned for the 18A manufacturing process.”

”Intel executives have said the Panther Lake chips will be available early in 2026, according to the sources. The new chips use 30% less energy than the prior generation, and its graphics and central processors will receive a 50% boost in their ability to crunch data in some situations, according to a second source briefed on the chips.”

There has to be benchmarks in those slides right

 

[RTX2080]

Alleged Panther Lake lineup:

View attachment 131506

Source: https://www.chiphell.com/thread-2747417-1-1.html
Picked up by Wccftech in English: https://wccftech.com/alleged-intel-panther-lake-lineup-and-configurations-leaked/

All naming are speculation and wrong. It's funny that tech site like WCCF screw up like this.


Oh my, even VCZ joins the club.

https://videocardz.com/newz/intel-reportedly-planning-12-panther-lake-skus-featuring-6-12-cpu-cores-and-4-12-xe3-gpu-cores

 

[Fjodor2001]

All naming are speculation and wrong. It's funny that tech site like WCCF screw up like this.

So what is the correct naming and what's your source for that?

 

[RTX2080]

So what is the correct naming and what's your source for that?

Leaker GoldenPigUpgrade denies this naming scheme and core configuration, he's the source of most of the posts I made about PTL.

 

[fastandfurious6]

it's nearly 2026 and Celerons are still here

their name... H-model CPUs

 

[poke01]

PTL graphics will set a new standard for the whole industry according to Tom Petersen