Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Preliminary Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing ADL-N. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q2/Computex 2026. In case people don't remember AlderLake-N, I have created a table below to compare the detail specs of ADL-N and WCL. Just for fun, I am throwing LNL and upcoming Mediatek D9500 SoC.

		Intel Alder Lake - N	Intel Wildcat Lake	Intel Lunar Lake		Mediatek D9500
Launch Date		Q1-2023	Q2-2026 ?	Q3-2024		Q3-2025
Model		Intel N300	?	Core Ultra 7 268V		Dimensity 9500 5G
Dies		2	2	2		1
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		TSMC N3P
CPU		8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		C1 1+3+4
Threads		8	6	8		8
Max Clock		3.8 GHz	?	5 GHz
L3 Cache		6 MB	?	12 MB
TDP		7 W	Fanless ?	17 W		Fanless
Memory		64-bit LPDDR5-4800	64-bit LPDDR5-6800 ?	128-bit LPDDR5X-8533		64-bit LPDDR5X-10667
Size		16 GB	?	32 GB		24 GB ?
Bandwidth			~ 55 GB/s	136 GB/s		85.6 GB/s
GPU		UHD Graphics		Arc 140V		G1 Ultra
EU / Xe		32 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		12
Max Clock		1.25 GHz		2 GHz
NPU		NA	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		100 TOPS ?

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

the 6500XT had 18Gbps ram at 64 bits giving 144GB/sec bandwidth.
If Panther Lake is configured with LPDDR 8666 ram at 128 bits, it'll have 138 GB/sec bandwidth. any faster and it'll match or surpass the 6500XT.

Despite having to share that RAM with the CPU cores, Panther Lake's iGPU might actually surpass the 6500XT in effective bandwidth. It has 16MB L2 which is as big as N24's L3 but probably runs faster, and then it can access the SoC's 18MB of L3 and there's also 8MB of side cache for the memory controllers.

From Q3 earnings call:

Didn't they say the first devices were only coming in Q1 26 after being unveilled at CES?

 

[DavidC1]

Despite having to share that RAM with the CPU cores, Panther Lake's iGPU might actually surpass the 6500XT in effective bandwidth. It has 16MB L2 which is as big as N24's L3 but probably runs faster, and then it can access the SoC's 18MB of L3 and there's also 8MB of side cache for the memory controllers.

When did they bring back the ability of the GPU to share CPU L3 cache? They stopped it with Meteorlake. I don't remember Lunarlake being able to share CPU L2.

Pantherlake also increases L1 cache quite significantly.

 

[regen1]

Didn't they say the first devices were only coming in Q1 26 after being unveilled at CES?

This could be just an extremely minuscule volume launch this year(probably to avoid lawsuits). Full-scale volume launch in 2026.

 

[DavidC1]

This could be just an extremely minuscule volume launch this year(probably to avoid lawsuits). Full-scale volume launch in 2026.

This was typical Intel launch before they got seriously delayed. Core 2 Quad, Penryn, Nehalem, even Netburst chips. The real volume was always next year.

the 6500XT had 18Gbps ram at 64 bits giving 144GB/sec bandwidth.
If Panther Lake is configured with LPDDR 8666 ram at 128 bits, it'll have 138 GB/sec bandwidth. any faster and it'll match or surpass the 6500XT.

I dare say that it'll be quite a disappointment if the iGPU on Panther Lake isn't capable of putting up numbers that are in the immediate vicinity of the 6500 XT on most gaming benchmarks. Depending on the game, and excluding any raytracing, the 6500XT is anywhere from 10+% to 20+% faster than the 890m at 1080P High.

Personally, I expect Panther Lake to slot in a bit above mobile 6500 XT specs and performance, with the ability to enable a few of the les demanding ray tracing features. It should do even better when both have XeSS / FSR enabled.

The NBC comparisons show 6500XT being in average 45% faster in games compared to 140V, when 140V and 890M are comparable.

@MS_AT Sorry, I was addressing in general, including the "Zen 5 40%" man. Also, I remember Lunar never really being behind 890M in average.

 

[Magio]

Also "launch" is a vague term. They could just be announcing in Q4 that the SKU is shipping to OEMs, showcase a couple designs from partners and let reviewers play with those, but only deliver it to consumers Q1 '26.

 

[regen1]

This was typical Intel launch before they got seriously delayed. Core 2 Quad, Penryn, Nehalem, even Netburst chips. The real volume was always next year.

Meteor Lake launch was similar as well(to what PTL launch is seemingly going to be like in terms of launch/timing and actual high volume in the following year).
Probably some media got mixed messages(or misinterpreted) from ITT or Intel's representatives.

 

[jpiniero]

Also "launch" is a vague term. They could just be announcing in Q4 that the SKU is shipping to OEMs, showcase a couple designs from partners and let reviewers play with those, but only deliver it to consumers Q1 '26.

I'm pretty sure they used the term 'on store shelves' at some point.

 

[DavidC1]

Meteor Lake launch was similar as well(to what PTL launch is seemingly going to be like in terms of launch/timing and actual high volume in the following year).
Probably some media got mixed messages(or misinterpreted) from ITT or Intel's representatives.

Yea that's why I never believe claims that mobile will launch in much less than 1 year. For desktops that's possible, you plop in a new chip, and done in 5 mins. Laptops go through optimization and OEMs need to earn their investment back. If I was a vendor, and I knew Intel was going to launch next gen in 6 month, then it would be a big pickle for our company, and will have to split lines between the two, and the older gen sales will suffer.

Also "launch" is a vague term. They could just be announcing in Q4 that the SKU is shipping to OEMs, showcase a couple designs from partners and let reviewers play with those, but only deliver it to consumers Q1 '26.

True. Desktop launches are real, because you can put a new one in immediately after getting from Newegg or something. Laptops you have to wait 3+ months, and they are limited availability. Q4 "launch" is really Q2 next year general availability(meaning Best Buy), and I don't mean April.

 

[511]

Despite having to share that RAM with the CPU cores, Panther Lake's iGPU might actually surpass the 6500XT in effective bandwidth. It has 16MB L2 which is as big as N24's L3 but probably runs faster, and then it can access the SoC's 18MB of L3 and there's also 8MB of side cache for the memory controllers.

iGPU can't use L3 afaik only L2/SLC also PTL Supports LPDDR5X upto 153GB/s

 

[Magio]

This looks like it could be the 4+4+4/10Xe config.

 

[511]

Yea that's why I never believe claims that mobile will launch in much less than 1 year. For desktops that's possible, you plop in a new chip, and done in 5 mins. Laptops go through optimization and OEMs need to earn their investment back. If I was a vendor, and I knew Intel was going to launch next gen in 6 month, then it would be a big pickle for our company, and will have to split lines between the two, and the older gen sales will suffer.

True. Desktop launches are real, because you can put a new one in immediately after getting from Newegg or something. Laptops you have to wait 3+ months, and they are limited availability. Q4 "launch" is really Q2 next year general availability(meaning Best Buy), and I don't mean April.

But this doesn't mean Intel is running late on schedule

 

[511]

This looks like it could be the 4+4+4/10Xe config.

It is it's got 18MB L3 (4*3+2*3)

 

[DavidC1]

iGPU can't use L3 afaik only L2/SLC also PTL Supports LPDDR5X upto 153GB/s

Pantherlake's Xe3 isn't really bandwidth bound. It's more capable for sure, but it gets significant advances for preserving memory bandwidth in all areas. More threads per Xe cores, bigger L1, double the GPU cache, improved occlusion culling capabilities. The TS differences(or lack thereof) is striking. A normal balanced GPU usually has about 25% scaling(meaning 100% more bandwidth, +25% perf). Xe3 is like 10%.

 

[Magio]

It is it's got 18MB L3 (4*3+2*3)

Someone's gotta explain to the people running GB on these that we want the CPU scores not the GPU ones. GB6 GPU bench is probably one of the least interesting benchmarks around.

 

[511]

Someone's gotta explain to the people running GB on these that we want the CPU scores not the GPU ones. GB6 GPU bench is probably one of the least interesting benchmarks around.

just email them /s

 

[DavidC1]

Someone's gotta explain to the people running GB on these that we want the CPU scores not the GPU ones. GB6 GPU bench is probably one of the least interesting benchmarks around.

That's probably why they are doing it. The reveal is for the review day.

Actually there's no real point releasing it earlier. It sets expectations, and people would be speculating until release day like "Pantherlake sucks!" and WCCFTech will pick it up and Intel spokesman will have to apologize.

This is also why the performance projections are vague. People are like "Oh the GPU performance is 1005 pixels" and the other guy is like, "no it's not, it's 1010 pixels, therefore it's 0.49% faster".

 

[regen1]

Yea that's why I never believe claims that mobile will launch in much less than 1 year. For desktops that's possible, you plop in a new chip, and done in 5 mins. Laptops go through optimization and OEMs need to earn their investment back. If I was a vendor, and I knew Intel was going to launch next gen in 6 month, then it would be a big pickle for our company, and will have to split lines between the two, and the older gen sales will suffer.

To be fair though this time around there were seemingly some mixed messages regarding launch from Intel in the past 6 months or so.
The Click-bait part of tech-media doesn't help either.

 

[DavidC1]

To be fair though this time around there were seemingly some mixed messages regarding launch from Intel in the past 6 months or so.
The Click-bait part of tech-media doesn't help either.

That's why I rely on common sense and rule of thumb and ignore what the biological AI tells us.

 

[dullard]

To be fair though this time around there were seemingly some mixed messages regarding launch from Intel in the past 6 months or so.

I saw very consistent messages from Intel. Launch 2025 but real volume ramp and most products in 2026. People online, however, tried their best to try to twist it to their personal wishes.

Mar 7, 2025: "Speaking on the PTL launch timeline, Pitzer claimed that the lineup is on track for launch by H2; however, peak volume production is expected to occur in 2026, which is similar to what happened with Lunar Lake and Meteor Lake." https://wccftech.com/intel-refutes-rumors-of-panther-lake-production-delay/

Apr 3, 2025: "As such, we should expect Panther Lake to launch later this year with relatively few products, but become more broadly available in early 2026."
https://overclock3d.net/news/cpu_ma...ther-lake-cpu-launch-plans-on-track-for-2025/

Aug 30, 2025: "Things are looking good. Our first SKU will be out by the end of this year, and then we will have more SKUs in the first half of 2026, and you will really start to see the volume ramp as we kind of migrate through 2026."
https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...llenges-and-perforamnce-and-panther-lake-ramp

Oct 14, 2025: "Panther Lake will ship later in 2025 and go on sale in January 2026"
https://newsroom.intel.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/itt-panther-lake-Infographic.png

Oct 23, 2025: "In client, we are on track to launch our first Panther Lake SKU by year-end, followed by additional SKUs in the first half of next year....We are on track to bring Panther Lake to market this year." Do note: this website incorrectly attributes Gelsinger as the CEO. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/INTC/earnings/INTC-Q3-2025-earnings_call-366977.html

I could go on and on with links scattered from throughout the year. Each time there was production starting in 2025, limited launch in 2025, volume production with most models in 2026.

 

[Hitman928]

I saw very consistent messages from Intel. Launch 2025 but real volume ramp and most products in 2026. People online, however, tried their best to try to twist it to their personal wishes.

Mar 7, 2025: "Speaking on the PTL launch timeline, Pitzer claimed that the lineup is on track for launch by H2; however, peak volume production is expected to occur in 2026, which is similar to what happened with Lunar Lake and Meteor Lake." https://wccftech.com/intel-refutes-rumors-of-panther-lake-production-delay/

Apr 3, 2025: "As such, we should expect Panther Lake to launch later this year with relatively few products, but become more broadly available in early 2026."
https://overclock3d.net/news/cpu_ma...ther-lake-cpu-launch-plans-on-track-for-2025/

Aug 30, 2025: "[Panther Lake] is still on track [to launch this year]," said David Zinsner at Deutsche Bank's 2025 Technology Conference (via SeekingAlpha). "Things are looking good. Our first SKU will be out by the end of this year, and then we will have more SKUs in the first half of 2026, and you will really start to see the volume ramp as we kind of migrate through 2026."
https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...llenges-and-perforamnce-and-panther-lake-ramp

Oct 14, 2025: "Panther Lake will ship later in 2025 and go on sale in January 2026"
https://newsroom.intel.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/itt-panther-lake-Infographic.png

Oct 23, 2025: "In client, we are on track to launch our first Panther Lake SKU by year-end, followed by additional SKUs in the first half of next year....We are on track to bring Panther Lake to market this year." Do note: this website incorrectly attributes Gelsinger as the CEO. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/INTC/earnings/INTC-Q3-2025-earnings_call-366977.html

I could go on and on with links scattered from throughout the year. Each time there was production starting in 2025, limited launch in 2025, volume production with most models in 2026.

We’ll see what we actually get. In 2024 Intel was saying it was already in production and promising a mid 2025 release so expecting some slippage from Intel’s promised release date or some word play in what a release means is not unreasonable.

“Intel's CEO, Pat Gelsinger, has confirmed that the upcoming 18A process of the Panther Lake CPU generation is on schedule for a mid-2025 release, which aligns with the initial projection.”

Intel's Panther Lake CPU Generation on Track for Mid-2025 Release, AI Capabilities to See Significant Boost

Intel's CEO, Pat Gelsinger, has confirmed that the upcoming 18A process of the Panther Lake CPU generation is on schedule for a mid-2025 release, which aligns with the initial projection. This development marks a significant milestone in the company's ongoing efforts to integrate AI capabilities...

www.techpowerup.com

 

[dullard]

We’ll see what we actually get. In 2024 Intel was saying it was already in production and promising a mid 2025 release so expecting some slippage from Intel’s promised release date or some word play in what a release means is not unreasonable.

“Intel's CEO, Pat Gelsinger, has confirmed that the upcoming 18A process of the Panther Lake CPU generation is on schedule for a mid-2025 release, which aligns with the initial projection.”

Are you denying the part in bold, that the 18A process is on schedule? Or did you interpret that incorrectly as Panther Lake is a mid-2025 release?

 

[regen1]

I saw very consistent messages from Intel. Launch 2025 but real volume ramp and most products in 2026. People online, however, tried their best to try to twist it to their personal wishes.

Mar 7, 2025: "Speaking on the PTL launch timeline, Pitzer claimed that the lineup is on track for launch by H2; however, peak volume production is expected to occur in 2026, which is similar to what happened with Lunar Lake and Meteor Lake." https://wccftech.com/intel-refutes-rumors-of-panther-lake-production-delay/

Apr 3, 2025: "As such, we should expect Panther Lake to launch later this year with relatively few products, but become more broadly available in early 2026."
https://overclock3d.net/news/cpu_ma...ther-lake-cpu-launch-plans-on-track-for-2025/

Aug 30, 2025: "[Panther Lake] is still on track [to launch this year]," said David Zinsner at Deutsche Bank's 2025 Technology Conference (via SeekingAlpha). "Things are looking good. Our first SKU will be out by the end of this year, and then we will have more SKUs in the first half of 2026, and you will really start to see the volume ramp as we kind of migrate through 2026."
https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...llenges-and-perforamnce-and-panther-lake-ramp

Oct 14, 2025: "Panther Lake will ship later in 2025 and go on sale in January 2026"
https://newsroom.intel.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/itt-panther-lake-Infographic.png

Oct 23, 2025: "In client, we are on track to launch our first Panther Lake SKU by year-end, followed by additional SKUs in the first half of next year....We are on track to bring Panther Lake to market this year." Do note: this website incorrectly attributes Gelsinger as the CEO. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/INTC/earnings/INTC-Q3-2025-earnings_call-366977.html

I could go on and on with links scattered from throughout the year. Each time there was production starting in 2025, limited launch in 2025, volume production with most models in 2026.

By mixed messages I mean whether they will have at least a few laptops with PTL available to purchase this year.
For which there was some slides and talks by some Intel Representatives which some could be taken as somewhat different/contradictory.
For eg. from your Oct 14 reference, "Shipping in 2025 and going on sale in Jan 2026" could very well be interpreted as zero volume/availability this year(2025).
And for many Panther being 2025 product/launch means at least some volume(however minuscule) available this year.

But it probably doesn't matter much since full-scale volume was going to start next year.

 

[dullard]

By mixed messages I mean whether they will have at least a few laptops with PTL available to purchase this year.

Intel makes the CPUs, not the laptops. When Intel launches, sells, and ships a laptop CPU that has almost nothing to do with when a laptop manufacturer launches their laptops. As DavidC1 said above, desktops generally just plop the CPU on in and you ship it. Laptops take months to optimize after you have the CPUs.

 

[regen1]

We’ll see what we actually get. In 2024 Intel was saying it was already in production and promising a mid 2025 release so expecting some slippage from Intel’s promised release date or some word play in what a release means is not unreasonable.

“Intel's CEO, Pat Gelsinger, has confirmed that the upcoming 18A process of the Panther Lake CPU generation is on schedule for a mid-2025 release, which aligns with the initial projection.”

Intel's Panther Lake CPU Generation on Track for Mid-2025 Release, AI Capabilities to See Significant Boost

Intel's CEO, Pat Gelsinger, has confirmed that the upcoming 18A process of the Panther Lake CPU generation is on schedule for a mid-2025 release, which aligns with the initial projection. This development marks a significant milestone in the company's ongoing efforts to integrate AI capabilities...

www.techpowerup.com

Well, new CEO can't be held for old CEO's promises(that were made well in past) that much. Also old CEO can't be held accountable since all the changes and lay-offs his successor might have done that could have affected schedule.
Thing is new CEO did say Panther Lake would launch this year and (it might mainly be just a launch event/announcement) but they will likely get something out this year(not too dissimilar from Meteor Lake launch).

 

[DZero]

Any info about Wild Cat Lake?
I am still thinking that giving HT on those processors could help them.