Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.



Comparison of upcoming Intel's U-series CPU: Core Ultra 100U, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

Model	Code-Name	Date	TDP	Node	Tiles	Main Tile	CPU	LP E-Core	LLC	GPU	Xe-cores
Core Ultra 100U	Meteor Lake	Q4 2023	15 - 57 W	Intel 4 + N5 + N6	4	tCPU	2P + 8E	2	12 MB	Intel Graphics	4
?	Lunar Lake	Q4 2024	17 - 30 W	N3B + N6	2	CPU + GPU & IMC	4P + 4E	0	8 MB	Arc	8
?	Panther Lake	Q1 2026 ?	?	Intel 18A + N3E	3	CPU + MC	4P + 8E	4	?	Arc	12

Comparison of die size of Each Tile of Meteor Lake, Arrow Lake, Lunar Lake and Panther Lake

	Meteor Lake	Arrow Lake (20A)	Arrow Lake (N3B)	Lunar Lake	Panther Lake
Platform	Mobile H/U Only	Desktop Only	Desktop & Mobile H&HX	Mobile U Only	Mobile H
Process Node	Intel 4	Intel 20A	TSMC N3B	TSMC N3B	Intel 18A
Date	Q4 2023	Q1 2025 ?	Desktop-Q4-2024 H&HX-Q1-2025	Q4 2024	Q1 2026 ?
Full Die	6P + 8P	6P + 8E ?	8P + 16E	4P + 4E	4P + 8E
LLC	24 MB	24 MB ?	36 MB ?	12 MB	?
tCPU	66.48
tGPU	44.45
SoC	96.77
IOE	44.45
Total	252.15

Intel Core Ultra 100 - Meteor Lake



As mentioned by Tomshardware, TSMC will manufacture the I/O, SoC, and GPU tiles. That means Intel will manufacture only the CPU and Foveros tiles. (Notably, Intel calls the I/O tile an 'I/O Expander,' hence the IOE moniker.)

 

[aigomorla]

And what does ML remind you of?

Here's a bunch of acronyms, notice a pattern?
SKL
KBL
CFL
CML
RKL
ADL
RPL

Which is why i am asking who comes with these acronyms.

SKL itself is a joke... they only took out 1 letter in SKY for heavens sake.
*goes off kicking the can*

 

[coercitiv]

Which is why i am asking who comes with these acronyms.

As far as I am aware, the community. We can even have 2-3 versions running around until one wins the popularity contest.

 

[poke01]

atl?

atlantis lake?

fixed. lol

 

[eek2121]

Intel first needs to get their CPUs in order. With Arrow Lake and Panther Lake the outcome will be seen. They need income rolling in and then they can start expanding again to other areas.

Raptor Lake Refresh is sure to contain a few “surprises“. (some unwelcome: higher power consumption, for starters, if a recent rumor is correct)

Meteor Lake is going to be an interesting part to watch. That is where Intel begins to get their ducks in a row, so to speak.

 

[mikk]

They have added Arrow Lake and Lunar Lake into the Programming Reference.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675254347515478017

Direct link:

https://cdrdv2-public.intel.com/782879/architecture-instruction-set-extensions-programming-reference.pdf

 

[Kepler_L2]

They have added Arrow Lake and Lunar Lake into the Programming Reference.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675254347515478017

Oh great, I'll wait until tomorrow when Elon will let me view this tweet.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Oh great, I'll wait until tomorrow when Elon will let me view this tweet.

Why wait?

 

[Ajay]

Isn't this a thread for consumer products? That's what ARL and MTL will be.

Intel can upscale the tech if they can get these products out as expected.

Yes, just a little digression, sort Of a tradition around here. Sorry if I was a bit harsh.

 

[SpudLobby]

What do we know about Lunar Lake?

Apparently it will be on N3 - well, reasonably speaking given it won't be on an Intel process which leaves N3 in that timeframe.

There is a rumor it's a 4+4 chip? This might make sense if part of the goal is for a more affordable SoC with lower power and leakage overhead to compete with Apple or Qualcomm in ultramobile parts.

Will it be monolithic or with fewer tiles? Etc.

 

[eek2121]

What do we know about Lunar Lake?

Apparently it will be on N3 - well, reasonably speaking given it won't be on an Intel process which leaves N3 in that timeframe.

Says who?

 

[Exist50]

There is a rumor it's a 4+4 chip? This might make sense if part of the goal is for a more affordable SoC with lower power and leakage overhead to compete with Apple or Qualcomm in ultramobile parts.

4+4, yes. Affordable, definitely not. I bet we see very few devices with Lunar Lake, though I hope I'm wrong on that.

Will it be monolithic or with fewer tiles? Etc.

Seems to be almost monolithic, and a similar split to ADL. One main tile with CPU, GPU, AI, etc., and another with mostly IO. But on a Foveros base die.

 

[H433x0n]

What do we know about Lunar Lake?

Apparently it will be on N3 - well, reasonably speaking given it won't be on an Intel process which leaves N3 in that timeframe.

There is a rumor it's a 4+4 chip? This might make sense if part of the goal is for a more affordable SoC with lower power and leakage overhead to compete with Apple or Qualcomm in ultramobile parts.

Will it be monolithic or with fewer tiles? Etc.

I don’t think Lunar Lake was ever rumored to be on N3. Unless you’re saying that 18 months from now you still think Intel will be stuck on the Intel 7 node.

 

[Exist50]

I don’t think Lunar Lake was ever rumored to be on N3

It is.

 

[poke01]

I don’t think Lunar Lake was ever rumored to be on N3. Unless you’re saying that 18 months from now you still think Intel will be stuck on the Intel 7 node.

you can't have perf per watt leadership with Intel 7 node.

 

[SpudLobby]

I don’t think Lunar Lake was ever rumored to be on N3. Unless you’re saying that 18 months from now you still think Intel will be stuck on the Intel 7 node.

Lol

Man you have to keep up. Way too much faith in Intel as if they're throwing everything on their own processes.

 

[SpudLobby]

It is.

Yup. For better or worse, I'm not at all saying they'll be stuck on Intel 7, for whatever that says about 4/3 and 18/20A.

 

[SpudLobby]

4+4, yes. Affordable, definitely not. I bet we see very few devices with Lunar Lake, though I hope I'm wrong on that.

Seems to be almost monolithic, and a similar split to ADL. One main tile with CPU, GPU, AI, etc., and another with mostly IO. But on a Foveros base die.

Yeah, affordable was the wrong phrasing in context of the PC market.

But when you look at Phoenix laptops so far it's not like there's a premium on Apple, I suppose my presumption is that with the die size rumored and denser libraries, a smaller GPU it probably won't be as costly as a larger one might be, granted it's on N3, so. Affordable is really in context of Intel's more expensive (likely IMO) Arrow Lake et. al.

 

[SpudLobby]

Says who?

Widely rumored by now

 

[msj10]

ARL and LNL don’t have hyperthreading?

 

[igor_kavinski]

No SMT on LNL makes sense coz it's an ultra low power core.

ARL lacking SMT doesn't seem plausible.

 

[SpudLobby]

View attachment 82610

ARL and LNL don’t have hyperthreading?

Oh hell yeah

 

[Exist50]

View attachment 82610

ARL and LNL don’t have hyperthreading?

@TESKATLIPOKA, remember how I said there was a detail that would throw off your LNL projections. Well feel like recalculating without SMT ?

 

[Exist50]

No SMT on LNL makes sense coz it's an ultra low power core.

ARL lacking SMT doesn't seem plausible.

It's inherent to Lion Cove, for better or worse. ARL will have the same restrictions as Lunar Lake.

 

[igor_kavinski]

It's inherent to Lion Cove, for better or worse. ARL will have the same restrictions as Lunar Lake.

Guess it means fewer side-channel vulnerabilities. Also less heat generation. And less cache contention. Why pretend to have virtual cores when you can have plentiful E-cores. Interesting move. Is AMD gonna do the same?

 

[A///]

I still want to know what the hell atl is. Atlantis Lake?