Mad Indian: maybe you're right. i'm just so paranoid about the govt. really. anyways, lets get the thing back on topic bro.
So after 3 pages of chest beating by every Indian on the forum we have:
4 F-15's against 12 IAF fighters. At some point all the F-15's were "killed". None of the articles mention how many of the IAF jets were killed, being my suspicious self I would presume that indicates that substantial numbers of the 12 were "killed". So when outnumbered 3:1 and using probably the worst dog fighting jet in the US inventory they managed to kill them. Looks like propaganda to me, but keep beating those chests!
4 F-15's against 12 IAF fighters. At some point all the F-15's were "killed". None of the articles mention how many of the IAF jets were killed, being my suspicious self I would presume that indicates that substantial numbers of the 12 were "killed". So when outnumbered 3:1 and using probably the worst dog fighting jet in the US inventory they managed to kill them. Looks like propaganda to me, but keep beating those chests!
Not to mention the F-15s, an air superiority fighter that is by nature inherently offensive, was put into a defensive role. Furthermore, it is a platform designed to kill >10 miles away with AMRAAMs and AIM9Ms (I don't think the F15-E is fitted with the AIM9X) and it was put into a dogfighting situation.
yeah... beer found a buddy. yeah!
Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
yeah... beer found a buddy. yeah!
who the fvck is chest beating Rahvin? Are you saying I am? I know you're not that stupid.
Perhaps the OP (with the title 'Indian kicked USAF a$$) and the first 10 replies to go along with it?
Originally posted by: beer
Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
yeah... beer found a buddy. yeah!
who the fvck is chest beating Rahvin? Are you saying I am? I know you're not that stupid.
Perhaps the OP (with the title 'Indian kicked USAF a$$) and the first 10 replies to go along with it?
well then say that. don't say every Indian. I'm Indian, I didn't chest beat sh*t. the fact that they are on the same side is what is important.
and beer that aint to you, thats to Rahvin.
I never accused anyone of chest beating. I am merely saying that saying that the USAF got it's ass kicked is misinformed at best,
And for the record, here's a link to India's homegrown fighter project:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/1100081.stm
It took the $536m and 17 years to develop a plane that is comparable to a French design created in the 1970s (the Rafale)! Of course it is their first attempt, and they are doing something only six countries have ever really tried before (USA, USSR/Russia, France, Sweden, UK, Germany)
Building a fighter plane isn't easy, obviously.
And for the record, here's a link to India's homegrown fighter project:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/1100081.stm
It took the $536m and 17 years to develop a plane that is comparable to a French design created in the 1970s (the Rafale)! Of course it is their first attempt, and they are doing something only six countries have ever really tried before (USA, USSR/Russia, France, Sweden, UK, Germany)
Building a fighter plane isn't easy, obviously.
beer, keep in mind indias strategy as a developing, highly populated nation. more = better.
You may have 10 fighter jets to every F-16. So, in that sense, they will be able to wage a formidable battle. i still think the u.s. would win, again i don't know it keeps going to comparisons as they are on the same side apparently, but the IAF would put up a decent fight no doubt.
You may have 10 fighter jets to every F-16. So, in that sense, they will be able to wage a formidable battle. i still think the u.s. would win, again i don't know it keeps going to comparisons as they are on the same side apparently, but the IAF would put up a decent fight no doubt.
Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Originally posted by: beer
Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
yeah... beer found a buddy. yeah!
who the fvck is chest beating Rahvin? Are you saying I am? I know you're not that stupid.
Perhaps the OP (with the title 'Indian kicked USAF a$$) and the first 10 replies to go along with it?
well then say that. don't say every Indian. I'm Indian, I didn't chest beat sh*t. the fact that they are on the same side is what is important.
and beer that aint to you, thats to Rahvin.
People exaggerate all the time to prove their points. Take it personal though why don't you.
quite frankly, i really truly don't care. i didn't appreciate Rahvins blanket statement though. i'm not really pro war, unless a country is a real bastard country, but in any case i think the u.s. has a much better air force. i think the indians probably did very well, but also question the 'kicked a$$' comment. oh well, we have uber-proud Americans, and we have uber-proud Indians. no one knocks on the uber-proud Americans, so no need to knock on this guy either. he probably just got a little carried away.
anyways, bigger picture is common enemies in the middle east and south asia. somethin's cookin.
If what you're implying is an eventual coalition invasion of Pakistan, I really wouldn't worry about that anytime soon, not with Mussaref (sp?) in power. He's done more good things to help us than just about anyone else int he region. What I would worry about is China, but I don't really see an indian motive, is there? (I'm not too caught up in indian politics).
AFAIK India doesn't have the ability to project firepower outside a small regional area. I really think their only objective would be Pakistan, but I can't find a reason as to why they would want the Muslim lands back, seeing as how you'd end up in the same situation as the Israeli occupation is facing.
WQasn't Iran India's buddy back in the day? My great-uncle was telling me stories how he was stationed there (Iran) and had to help train the pilots..and they kinda acted as spies. They would lure them with liquor (since liquor was illegal there) and get them to spill the beans. Or something to that effect.
Oh and there's nothign wrong with chest-beating Indians. Wat's wrong with showing our national pride? American's do it all the time..and its a good thing.
India and China have been at war in the past due to Tibetans coming into India for safety or something like that. I'm not to sure on that, but I do know there used to be tension between India and China. don't know how or if it has bee nresolved now.
Thing is india doesn't need hte firepower to extend past Pakistan. It has no interest in fighting in general. They have a policy where they will never fire first.
hell even during the Kargil War, when the Pakistani militants entered Indian territory, India never went into theirs. They just drove them out of India, but never set foot into Pakistan.
It's cause our Government is pu$$ies.
I didn't imply India attacking Iran. I just said that they used to train Iranian pilots back in the day...and I think get info on Pakistan from them. That's about it. I just remembered the stories my great-uncle and others used to tell me.
Like once when they thought he was captured, but 1 month later he was found to be ok..and was in hiding or something (never did hear the correct story), but I do know when he came back, my grandma made sweets for the entire town to give out.
I have nothing wrong with anyone Indian expressing pride for their country. The problem is most of the Indians posting on this board are from the US or Canada(well at least they reside here or have citizenship here). That means I can't understand why you care more about India's progress than US progress. Maybe you aren't, but that is just how it seems at times. The only way for this country to remain strong is to have our immigrants love it as much as we did when we immigrated. My family came here a long time ago, but even if we were short timers I'd think we care about the country we moved to for opportunity. Nothing wrong with wanting India to remain prosperous and peaceful. I'm sure you all have family there that you care very much about. However, don't forget that you have the opportunity you do today because of how the United States mixes cultures. We don't cordon people off into their own areas and not let them adopt local customs.
Oh definately. We want our host countries to prosper (Canada in my case) but our blood is still Indian. In my personal case, I consider three countries to be "my countries": India, Nigeria, and Canada. I spent my formative years in Nigeria, so it will always have a place in my heart.
But that's neither here nor there.
But it does insult us (well me anyway) when people make ignorant statements about my motherland. Its only natural really.
offoptic:
Is anyone's MSN working?
'New' immigrants like Indians are in a strange position. When they're in the US, they sometimes have to defend India. When they're in India, they have to defend the US. There's nothing wrong with 'loving' both countries. I'm sure that lots of European immigrants felt the same way.
Even if the US airforce get it butt whipped its a good thing now the high ranks will see they need to do something about it.Upgrade f15s with new engines, rader etc or get the f22 programe moving faster.By the way what do you expect of a 35 year old plane go up agiesnt russia lastest aircraft its like comparing bi planes of ww1 to spitefires/p51s in ww2. Overall if they got there butt whipped its a good thing better training and better aircraft.
In a dog fight, there are a lot of air forces out there that would do well against the US, such as the Israeli air force or Indian air force. The North Vietnamese air force did fairly well against the US in the late 60s and early 70s when the Johnson administration didn't allow USAF or Navy fighters to engage until they could visually id enemy fighters, negating the US technology advantage in radar and radar guided missiles. What the US can do is, don't fight fair. Use cruise missiles or stealth bombers to knock out communication and control center, air fields, command centers etc before going into a fight for example. Use powerful jammers is another favorite tactic the USAF likes to use. Wars are a lot more complex than these exercises, which don't prove much, unless you urgently want Congress to give you more F-22s.
Originally posted by: SONYFX
Allow me to summarize the latest technological advances for each country:
India: LCA, comparable to Mirage 2000s in design (mid-1970s) and took 18 years to develop a rather pathetic weapons platform that is barely airworthy by today's standards.
US: F-22 and B2.
One plane can barely take off and land reliably. The other can obliterate targets after flying 5000 miles from 60,000 feet up. India has a weak indiginous aircraft industry and seeing as how the development of Russian planes are stunted, they have no hope of making a viable aircraft within 30 years. The SU-30s the Indians essentially stole from the USSR are the most advanced aircraft they will fly until I have grey hair. Their homegrown attempts are pathetic at best and even Sweden has more capable aircraft.
And if any of you are going to flame me, I had better see some evidence that the LCA is a viable aircraft or India is developing a more advanced plane. If you're going to accuse me of chest-beating, read the message I am replying to and understand that his argument is as inflammatory and nationalist as mine is, if not more.
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