Indian kicked USAF a$$

[Babbles]

Did I read that aritcle correctly where the India guy essentially said that when it came to beyond-visual combat, the Americans were on top? Therefore it is not suprsing in that for a while the US military has been working on attack targets from a greater distance. Perhaps when it comes to getting up close and personal the USAF has lost their edge. That being said, though, if the enemy target is taken out before visual combat then all of their (i.e. Indian) expertise is wasted.

 

[KokomoGST]

Well, strategically, doesn't the US usually send in their dogfight unworthy stealth aircraft and bomb the snot out of enemy airfields and depots?

Kinda seems like a moot point to me. Sounds like a solid strategy to me... make sure the enemy can't establish air defense or superiority by taking their tools away from them.

 

[tnitsuj]

Originally posted by: Gyrene

Originally posted by: AndrewR

Originally posted by: Gyrene
Meh. Air Force people are pansies. Should have sent a MAW Aggressor Squadron against the Indians.

Whatever -- tell that to the Marines who get pasted regularly by the local F-15C squadrons here.

So, a particular squadron isn't doing so hot. Air Force is for people who want to learn a technical skill or stay away from the real fighting. They're pansies. Marines are the people who go in head first. Just remember, the rivalry is all in good fun, I still respect my coward brethren. And remember, at least your not Navy.

OH NO YOU DIDN'T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mr. Muscles Are Required Intelligence Non Essential

 

[SherEPunjab]

i'm not surprised. contrary to how most of American shows India, its a very progressing country, and the greatest resource is the people there. Intelligent, hard working, and they have a natural ability. Don't worry Beer, by me saying this i'm not taking anything away from our country... no reason to get so strung out.

Anyways, at the end of the day, Who cares who kicked who's ass. We're on the same team. Why do you think they're doing joint excercises so frequently? They've done a number of war games in the past 2 years, in Alaska, in India. The U.S. military states they do this with India so much in order to "understand each other and cooperate [on future missions]".

Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

 

[Gyrene]

Originally posted by: tnitsuj
OH NO YOU DIDN'T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mr. Muscles Are Required Intelligence Non Essential

Oh great, now there's a sailor here? Ask your wife who's better in bed, you or me. I promise the answer's me. Marines just do it better. And who is running the show during joint-ops...oh yea, Marines. You Navy boys are just jealous of our prowess, on and off the field.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

 

[Siddhartha]

I saw a show on the War, I mean History, Channel about the USAF and dog fighting. This show said that before the Korean and Viet Nam wars the Pentagon thought it did not need dog fighting to maintain control of the sky. And they invested in heavy, complex, expensive fighters like the F-86 Sabre and the F-4 Phantom II. This stategy was changed when the US jets were experiencing unacceptable kill ratios against the lighter, more maneuverable MiGs. The Navy created the Top Gun program to teach its best pilots how to dog fight.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

 

[Gyrene]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

Wow. Paranoia. There are no plans for a join attack between India and the US. Not yet, anyway. War games are very normal.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: Gyrene

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

Wow. Paranoia. There are no plans for a join attack between India and the US. Not yet, anyway. War games are very normal.

how many is normal? i honestly don't know, but its like every other month i'm hearing about a new one. i'm pretty sure they don't do this with every other major country [the frequency that is].

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

 

[kalster]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

 

[yllus]

The fact that the Royal Canadian Air Force wins regularly in NATO exercises leads me to believe dogfights are not indicative of real-world situations.

The way this layman figures it, you put an American squadron in the air, add the AWACS (with escort) that is sure to be in the area with them and they'll mop any nation up; probably little to no casualties as well. Maybe if the opposing force had access to the Russian version of the AWACS they might have a chance.

 

[kalster]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: Spoooon

Originally posted by: miniMUNCH
Not to take away from the Indian pilots but the F-15 is a pretty old aircraft design and not too well suited for dog fighting. I believe all three of those IAF aircraft are more maneuverable than the F-15.

Consider an F-16 or a F-18 and you have an entirely different ball game...I wouldn't be fair. But I think that was the point of excercise...match F-15 pilots against more manneuverable opponents and the IAF wanted to gauge their long range ATA capability vs. F-15's.

I think miniMUNCH is the only person that has made a reasonable comment. Everyone else seems bent on goading Beer or taking the results of one exercise and saying USAF sucks.

edit: link
More balanced article.

"At the first ever exercise, IAF frontline aircraft crossed swords in mock exercise with the USAF fighters near the Gwalior base and the honours were evenly shared."

Actually, miniMUNCH's comment is the one I take most issue with in this thread.

Now this is AFAIK, but the role of air superiority fighter in the USA is held by the F-15 and no other fighter. The F-16 is more of a air-to-ground assault platform though it can play multiple roles very well on its own. The F/A-18 is another multirole fighter that is rugged as hell and gets lots of use by the Navy...in fact I don't think the AF even uses them. The F-15 is the dogfighter for America, Israel, etc.

 

[Pacfanweb]

You guys might want to read up a bit more on this engagement. It was only 4 F-15's defending against, according to one of the Indian news articles,
"a fleet of SU-30Ks and Mirage-2000s.".

Here's the quote:
"On Wednesday morning, as four USAF 15C took to the skies to ``defend'' the Gwalior air base against ``invading'' IAF strike aircraft, both had a ``mission'' in hand. Forty minutes later, Gwalior was ``bombed'' by an IAF MiG-27 escorted by a fleet of SU-30Ks and Mirage-2000s."
Article

So 4 F-15's weren't enough to hold off a numerically superior force. Big deal, now we know to match their numbers.

You also have to remember it's a learning curve, since we really don't study the IAF tactics like we did the USSR.
Plus, as someone else said, all these articles are coming from Indian news sources.

BTW, here's the actual numbers from another article:
"The F-15C Eagles took off from the Gwalior air base, followed minutes later by 12 SU-30s, Mirage 2000s, MIG-27s and MIG-21 Bisons. "

So it was 12 vs 4. Guess we know not to do that again, huh?

 

[kalster]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

relax man

the fact is as weird or corrupt the system is its fine and a great fvcking place, what i find annoying about NRI's is they sit here and keep complaining and whining about all the flaws

thatz my main gripe with IITians as well, the country spends 4-5 lakhs on them for their education and most of them end up in doing phd's and settling here


anway its easy to sit and complain as all NRI's and 2nd generation American indians do but sadly that is all they do. no one has any ideas or input on how to make the system better.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

Yeah its amazing India is where its at given the people running it. Altho I know Vajpayee isn't corrupt, nor is Abdul kalam.

As for the rest, well they should jsut be jailed. Or sent to Pakistan. I kid I kid..

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

Yeah its amazing India is where its at given the people running it. Altho I know Vajpayee isn't corrupt, nor is Abdul kalam.

As for the rest, well they should jsut be jailed. Or sent to Pakistan. I kid I kid..

LOL

That's funny but ironically true...as bad as India is with Old World corruption, Pakistan is even worse because of the religion dogma on top. One day, one day.

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

Yeah its amazing India is where its at given the people running it. Altho I know Vajpayee isn't corrupt, nor is Abdul kalam.

As for the rest, well they should jsut be jailed. Or sent to Pakistan. I kid I kid..

how do you think Vajpayee got to that position? I bet you he is or was just as corrupt if not worse. an honest man can't make it there. he'll get killed, transferred, or just downright give up.
edit: for the record kalster, i'm not just griping. i luv the country its one of the best in the world in many ways. but i have to point out its flaws..

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: kalster

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
Somethings up, don't know what it is though.

What do you mean?

I think India and the U.S. are going to attack some country. I dont know when, but I feel pretty strongly about it. Do a search on the war games they have been doing. They've done like 5 in 2 years, that we've heard about. is this normal?

India has a "don't attack first" policy. And they won't break it for the US. I'm sure these training exercsies are normal. India's Air Force is heavily underfunded and they are having problems maintaining their fleet. Those old Russian aircrafts need replacing. These exercises are normal to make sure their fleet is in order.

Hey do you have any info on the GNATs that India used?

india has those stupid Migs for training. every few months one crashes killing the pilot. These are the problems of a developing nation forced to compete militarily the best it can. sad world we live in.

well defense isn't our biggest priority. altho I do like the steps Vajpayee is taking with respect to India's future.

Altho I'm more impressed with Pres. Abdul Kalam. He is my hero and idol.

noooo
BJP noooooooooooooooooooooo


go COngressssssssssssssssss


lol

So what... that whore can make some pizza for us? She's been living in the country for like 30 years, she should be fluent in Hindi by now, if she cares at all for the culture.

:Q

she's corrupt like all the other scoundrels running the country. God knows, if people can even make it that far, whatever India has attained in 50 years, under THOSE conditions, its FCKING AMAZING human ability.

Yeah its amazing India is where its at given the people running it. Altho I know Vajpayee isn't corrupt, nor is Abdul kalam.

As for the rest, well they should jsut be jailed. Or sent to Pakistan. I kid I kid..

how do you think Vajpayee got to that position? I bet you he is or was just as corrupt if not worse. an honest man can't make it there. he'll get killed, transferred, or just downright give up.
edit: for the record kalster, i'm not just griping. i luv the country its one of the best in the world in many ways. but i have to point out its flaws..

I don't think he was corrupt. He is a kind hearted man...shrewd, but did wats best for his country.