I Am Proud To Call Myself A Liberal

[Incorruptible]

One of the more disgusting "victories" achieved by the retrograde, right wing propaganda machine over the years has been the hate-smearing of liberals.

F*ck them and the clown car they drove in on.

I stand with President Franklin Delano Roosevelt and President Harry S. Truman and countless others in the proud and unbowed tradition of American liberals.

Nothing is more American than a generosity of spirit and a commitment to the inclusion of everyone in the American dream. :thumbsup:

So what about all the hate smearing from the liberals? There is much more hate smearing from them. Just look at Ed Schultz and Bill Maher.

Also you said you support FDR yet FDR supported the Japanese internment. This was a huge violation of their civil rights and the Constitution and it was stereotyping/bigotry towards a group of people.

FDR Also stole gold in 1933 by forcing gold owners to exchange it at the bank for a predetermined price.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

http://www.forbes.com/sites/greatsp...handed-80-years-after-fdrs-gold-confiscation/

FDR Also served four terms which is something that no president did before him and breaking the tradition started by George Washington.

There are also accusations of racism towards FDR by Jesse Owens.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Franklin_D._Roosevelt

Liberals at one time believed in liberty, they believed in strong economic and civil freedom and were called Classical Liberals. Most of the liberals today don't believe in those values and support big government. Many of their policies are completely hypocritical.

 

[Thebobo]

So what about all the hate smearing from the liberals? There is much more hate smearing from them. Just look at Ed Schultz and Bill Maher.

Also you said you support FDR yet FDR supported the Japanese internment. This was a huge violation of their civil rights and the Constitution and it was stereotyping/bigotry towards a group of people.

FDR Also stole gold in 1933 by forcing gold owners to exchange it at the bank for a predetermined price.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

http://www.forbes.com/sites/greatsp...handed-80-years-after-fdrs-gold-confiscation/

FDR Also served four terms which is something that no president did before him and breaking the tradition started by George Washington.

There are also accusations of racism towards FDR by Jesse Owens.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Franklin_D._Roosevelt

Liberals at one time believed in liberty, they believed in strong economic and civil freedom and were called Classical Liberals. Most of the liberals today don't believe in those values and support big government. Many of their policies are completely hypocritical.

 

[theeedude]

Proud liberal here too. I'd be ashamed to call myself a "conservative" though.

 

[Zaap]

Many leftists today are littterally the opposite of virtually every word in that definition.

Its telling that someone would have to hide behind and get hyper defensive over a definition because no one recognizes a single word of it in their actual actions.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

I dare say that many conservatives here are actually more liberal than many so-called "liberals" here.

 

[Murloc]

I dare say that many conservatives here are actually more liberal than many so-called "liberals" here.

The problem is that americans use liberal and conservative as labels that equate to democrat and republican, which completely ignores the fact that political positions move along multiple axes. I guess it's a consequence of the two-party system that polarizes political discourse.

 

[Moonbeam]

There is nothing you can say to the brain defective they will not deflect and rationalize away, but if you think back just a month or so in the past, I was being accused of being an attention whore as the most recent part of that deflection. So now I don't post so much so as to generate a new rationalization that I fear the attention I was getting. Now I just post on my alt accounts smug in the fact that I crawled so far up some of your asses you will see me everywhere.

And besides, as an attention whore, I needed to detox before I go to Europe for a few months so I don't go into attention deficit withdrawal over there and spoil my trip. AT&T wants a fucking arm and leg for data.

PS: Me and LunarRay are rather busy acquiring 70 epic gear in the new Diablo Expansion. The world needs saving from the Republican Plague of Brain Defectives, but hey, I also need good gear. I also have a new alt Crusader. I figure you brain defective conservatives will love me better if I can handle a flail. I want to help with the self flagellation.

I'll be back, if I can. Caio and ta ta for now.

 

[Perknose]

Proud liberal here too. I'd be ashamed to call myself a "conservative" though.

I wouldn't be ashamed to call myself a conservative if, politically, I were one.

Of course, I'd take great pains to distinguish myself from the extreme fundies, the cynical ultra-rich, and the "radical individualist libertarians" <--------for want of a better term.

There is no shame whatsoever in believing in the foundational tenets of 'traditional' conservatism.

 

[werepossum]

Nothing is more American than assuming that those not sharing your viewpoint don't

Good to see the "left wing propaganda machine" isn't above polluting the dictionary with the "noun" description of the word. I'm sure the definition Mr. Webster et al gave for "conservative" is similarly glorifying though, right?

Just to avoid confusion, as well: I'm not "liberal" or "conservative." I just think it's greatly amusing watching people identify with and bind themselves to one sect then argue and point fingers at "the other side" using ridiculous claims to try to overwhelm whatever "side" happens to be obviously right at the time through any kind of rational perspective. Everyone does it, it's just hilarious to watch masses of people adopt beliefs and views based on groupthink.

I agree with all of your post and I'm a proud conservative libertarian, but it needs to occasionally be pointed out that the things we wish to conserve are the things given to us by liberals. Virtually everything we value about Western society outside of religion is due to the liberal movement over the last few centuries, and while I may disagree voraciously with the direction the progressives wish to take next it's imperative that we always remember how we got to the place we wish to preserve. There is no better world view than the classic liberal, as demonstrated by all sides wanting to claim that title.

Well said, Perknose.

:beer:

LOL +1

Wow, you're right - haven't seen Moonie around for a while. Steamer probably isn't a Moonie alt though - Moonie occasionally did say something interesting, and he/she wasn't nearly as angry.

Moonie is downright poetic, but has been very angry lately. I suspect that anger is either directly or indirectly why we haven't seen much of him/her lately. Steamer does (albeit very occasionally) say something interesting, which is why I wade through the foamy rage rather than simply adding him to my ignore list. (On a semi-related note, I miss Steeplerot.)

Never understood the interest in Moonie alt accounts, he/she seems to me to be utterly unafraid to say anything felt as well as utterly unique. Well, as utterly unique as anyone can be in a sea of six billion. Ain't much truly new in this world, including us.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

There is nothing you can say to the brain defective they will not deflect and rationalize away, but if you think back just a month or so in the past, I was being accused of being an attention whore as the most recent part of that deflection. So now I don't post so much so as to generate a new rationalization that I fear the attention I was getting. Now I just post on my alt accounts smug in the fact that I crawled so far up some of your asses you will see me everywhere.

And besides, as an attention whore, I needed to detox before I go to Europe for a few months so I don't go into attention deficit withdrawal over there and spoil my trip. AT&T wants a fucking arm and leg for data.

PS: Me and LunarRay are rather busy acquiring 70 epic gear in the new Diablo Expansion. The world needs saving from the Republican Plague of Brain Defectives, but hey, I also need good gear. I also have a new alt Crusader. I figure you brain defective conservatives will love me better if I can handle a flail. I want to help with the self flagellation.

I'll be back, if I can. Caio and ta ta for now.

Good to hear you're alive. Your alt accounts aren't nearly as entertaining or insightful though...you need to work on that!

 

[werepossum]

Telegraph, eww. I refuse to open any Daily Telegraph links.
---
On-topic:
I'm a liberal too. :wub: But I'm an European liberal and I've noticed our liberal has a slightly different meaning to the American one. European liberals are very much pro-capitalism, free markets and individual liberty. Let the markets decide and all that. I remember the liberal party being the only party in the last parliamentary elections to oppose universal healthcare. Well they didn't exatcly want to get rid of it but they wanted to move towards privatising the whole healthcare system. Currently it's a mixture of publicly and privately provided services. They wanted it all privatised. Also the liberals we're more in favour of private schools which are practically non-existent because the public system is working well enough. The rich and poor all go to the same schools.

The American liberal seems to be a very wide term. I'm not even sure what it even means to be honest. On these and on other forums I've seen people be called liberals while they'd be considered social democrats or greens over this side of the pond. I guess it comes with the two-party system. People are crammed under a very wide label. The stupidest thing to do in that situation is to start justifying your political positions by thinking "conservatives/liberals just support this". That's just silly when the label you've used to label yourself consists of all kinds of nutjobs. You don't have to agree with every idiot just because they're conservative or liberal. Don't fall into that trap, people do it all the time and it's fucking ridiculous.

Can not a Republican be a liberal or a Democrat be a conservative? Of course they can be. Open up your eyes to see all the shades of grey.

Anyway. Merry Easter. I'll be drunk the whole weekend celebrating the beginning of spring time. Who's with me? :thumbsup:

Damned well said, sir - although I'll be remaining sober.

The problem is that americans use liberal and conservative as labels that equate to democrat and republican, which completely ignores the fact that political positions move along multiple axes. I guess it's a consequence of the two-party system that polarizes political discourse.

Yep. Far too often we let ourselves be shaped with that dichotomy as well, to the extent that we oppose gay marriage in spite of our small government beliefs or oppose environmental protection in spite of its origin being conservation. (I won't add the opposite side's since Lord knows I pound on that enough already.)

 

[hal2kilo]

Telegraph, eww. I refuse to open any Daily Telegraph links.
---
On-topic:
I'm a liberal too. :wub: But I'm an European liberal and I've noticed our liberal has a slightly different meaning to the American one. European liberals are very much pro-capitalism, free markets and individual liberty. Let the markets decide and all that. I remember the liberal party being the only party in the last parliamentary elections to oppose universal healthcare. Well they didn't exatcly want to get rid of it but they wanted to move towards privatising the whole healthcare system. Currently it's a mixture of publicly and privately provided services. They wanted it all privatised. Also the liberals we're more in favour of private schools which are practically non-existent because the public system is working well enough. The rich and poor all go to the same schools.

The American liberal seems to be a very wide term. I'm not even sure what it even means to be honest. On these and on other forums I've seen people be called liberals while they'd be considered social democrats or greens over this side of the pond. I guess it comes with the two-party system. People are crammed under a very wide label. The stupidest thing to do in that situation is to start justifying your political positions by thinking "conservatives/liberals just support this". That's just silly when the label you've used to label yourself consists of all kinds of nutjobs. You don't have to agree with every idiot just because they're conservative or liberal. Don't fall into that trap, people do it all the time and it's fucking ridiculous.

Can not a Republican be a liberal or a Democrat be a conservative? Of course they can be. Open up your eyes to see all the shades of grey.

Anyway. Merry Easter. I'll be drunk the whole weekend celebrating the beginning of spring time. Who's with me? :thumbsup:

Things changed. The John Birchers were the extreme fringe right wing of the Republicans and on the other end you had the Rockerfeller liberals. In the Democratic Party you had the Dixiecrat right wing sadly not so much of a fringe and then the FDR traditional democrates which covered the rest of the Democrat spectrum

Not sure if over time between the 64 Civil Rights Act, the Chicago Riots both parties have become more "pure" in their partisanship although I don't think the Democrats have near the purity test that the new Rebublican party has morfed into.

 

[Incorruptible]

OP said he supports liberals like FDR and I pointed out some things FDR did that violated the Constitution.

 

[Thebobo]

OP said he supports liberals like FDR and I pointed out some things FDR did that violated the Constitution.

Aye I am sorry was just a little taken back by your thoughtfull post.

 

[theeedude]

I wouldn't be ashamed to call myself a conservative if, politically, I were one.

Of course, I'd take great pains to distinguish myself from the extreme fundies, the cynical ultra-rich, and the "radical individualist libertarians" <--------for want of a better term.

There is no shame whatsoever in believing in the foundational tenets of 'traditional' conservatism.

What tenets would those be? I would be ashamed to identify myself as part of the current American conservative movement which is nothing but a bunch of shills and useful idiots for concentrating the power in the hands of the wealthy. As far as 'traditional' conservative, it depends on how that's defined.

 

[BoberFett]

Liberal used to be a good word, until "liberals" hijacked it.

 

[Attic]

Liberal used to be a good word, until "politicians" hijacked it.

fixed


A lot of scum has been voted into office under the veil of an R or D next to their name.

 

[Incorruptible]

Aye I am sorry was just a little taken back by your thoughtfull post.

It's alright, Thanks. When I saw the nonsense about FDR I had to call it out.

 

[boomerang]

Liberal used to be a good word, until "liberals" hijacked it.

I think you meant "progressives", which is a euphemism for Communists. Liberals are good people that you can hold a conversation with, agree to disagree and you'll still remain friends. Progressives want you arrested and detained because you require reprogramming.

When it suits their needs, progressives will label themselves as liberals. No lie is too big for them because their cause is so just. The end justifies the means.

 

[BoberFett]

I think you meant "progressives", which is a euphemism for Communists. Liberals are good people that you can hold a conversation with, agree to disagree and you'll still remain friends. Progressives want you arrested and detained because you require reprogramming.

When it suits their needs, progressives will label themselves as liberals. No lie is too big for them because their cause is so just. The end justifies the means.

A bit hyperbolic, but yes. Liberals fought the man. Now "liberals" worship the man, they just worship a different man than their enemies the "conservatives".

 

[TROLLERCAUST]

Damned well said, sir - although I'll be remaining sober.

Don't be silly. You know you want to. ^_^ It's been another dark winter, you have to celebrate the sun coming back with a few beers and maybe some shots of vodka. :thumbsup:

Things changed. The John Birchers were the extreme fringe right wing of the Republicans and on the other end you had the Rockerfeller liberals. In the Democratic Party you had the Dixiecrat right wing sadly not so much of a fringe and then the FDR traditional democrates which covered the rest of the Democrat spectrum

Not sure if over time between the 64 Civil Rights Act, the Chicago Riots both parties have become more "pure" in their partisanship although I don't think the Democrats have near the purity test that the new Rebublican party has morfed into.

All this is stuff I'm not too familiar with. You're probably way more informed than I am.

 

[Moonbeam]

Good to hear you're alive. Your alt accounts aren't nearly as entertaining or insightful though...you need to work on that!

I suffered deeply, or so it seems to me, as a child with the result that I have always wanted nobody else to suffer like me. It is a quandary, because I feel that my suffering made me a more empathetic person and I wouldn't want to deprive others of that. The point, here, is that while I want to thank you for your complement, it makes me sad also, because your words imply that others might come up short compared to me. Comparisons are an evil that a dog avoids by its capacity to love anybody. That tells me that without a perverted intelligence, a false sense of duality caused by language, we would see everybody as we think God does, with equal love for everybody.

Many of the folk whom the silly charge as being my alts are in fact real people who are vastly, intellectually superior to me. LunarRay and Perknose for sure. I have a simple gift. I died from being honest. I lost all my cherished beliefs quite young when I was forced to see that I didn't actually know anything. My only capacity, I think, is that I can see that what people believe are illusions they aren't willing to drop. I see one simple thing, that others who think they know, like me, don't actually know anything. I don't need to be smart or intellectually gifted. I can see it and be quite stupid, actually.

I believe we were all destroyed as children by being put down. We need, in my opinion, to not add to the world's supply of that.

I make fun of conservatives by saying they have a brain defect because they lack humility and I am not ashamed to be as ignorant as they are. The only difference between me and them is that they don't know they don't know anything and I do. I accuse them of what I already am, an ignorant nobody. Pride goes before a fall so I try to be a trip. Love you.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Not very liberal of Franklin Delano Roosevelt to order the military to send Japanese-Americans to internment camps.

It's all relative to the times. Back during the FDR days the right wing conservatives were probably still dreaming of burning witches.

 

[Incorruptible]

It's all relative to the times. Back during the FDR days the right wing conservatives were probably still dreaming of burning witches.

There is no excuse for what FDR did. It was immoral and a clear violation of the Constitution. Not surprised leftists will defend him.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

I suffered deeply, or so it seems to me, as a child with the result that I have always wanted nobody else to suffer like me. It is a quandary, because I feel that my suffering made me a more empathetic person and I wouldn't want to deprive others of that. The point, here, is that while I want to thank you for your complement, it makes me sad also, because your words imply that others might come up short compared to me. Comparisons are an evil that a dog avoids by its capacity to love anybody. That tells me that without a perverted intelligence, a false sense of duality caused by language, we would see everybody as we think God does, with equal love for everybody.

Many of the folk whom the silly charge as being my alts are in fact real people who are vastly, intellectually superior to me. LunarRay and Perknose for sure. I have a simple gift. I died from being honest. I lost all my cherished beliefs quite young when I was forced to see that I didn't actually know anything. My only capacity, I think, is that I can see that what people believe are illusions they aren't willing to drop. I see one simple thing, that others who think they know, like me, don't actually know anything. I don't need to be smart or intellectually gifted. I can see it and be quite stupid, actually.

I believe we were all destroyed as children by being put down. We need, in my opinion, to not add to the world's supply of that.

I make fun of conservatives by saying they have a brain defect because they lack humility and I am not ashamed to be as ignorant as they are. The only difference between me and them is that they don't know they don't know anything and I do. I accuse them of what I already am, an ignorant nobody. Pride goes before a fall so I try to be a trip. Love you.

Many liberals here lack humility as well....so don't fool yourself as to the reason you only pick on conservatives. People are people. The sad thing to me is that we have so many here who define their self-identity with a political label that commonly polarizes their thought processes into an us vs. them mentality. They vigorously defend their ideology well beyond the point of rationality as if their very soul was in jeopardy...not realizing how much they've sacrificed for an illusion. No one needs to be especially smart or intellectually gifted to see this. All one can do is point and hope for the best. Hope you have a great trip to Europe...I'll try my best to keep all your alts in line while you're gone.