Holder's Ballot Given to Young Man

[boomerang]

That's it. I'm not presenting my ID at the bank, the bar and the movie rental anymore. I'm feeling disenfranchised.

 

[Ronstang]

It is impossible to be a functioning contributing member of modern society without a photo ID so it makes all the sense in the world why the Democrats don't want showing one a requirement to vote.

 

[Bowfinger]

[ ... ]
How is requiring a voter ID going to disenfranchise a single voter. Every state that has these laws also provides ID free of charge for the purpose of voting. Again, aside from lazy asses, who is getting left out?

1. There are many people who do not have -- nor otherwise need -- an official state ID. My elderly mother is one such person. She is retired. She stopped driving years ago and let her license expire. She doesn't need it. Her pension and SS "checks" are automatically deposited. She pays bills by mail. She orders many things online. Family and friends help her with getting groceries and other local purchases.

Further, she is far from alone. If you check one of the earlier threads, you'll see one state (South Carolina, maybe) cross-checked its voter and DL files and found a significant percentage of voters do NOT have drivers licenses. That percentage was disproportionately higher among minorities.

2. Even if the state provides "free" IDs, the documentation required to obtain those IDs is not free. For example, there is a charge for a certified copy of one's birth certificate. Transportation may also be a financial burden, especially for someone who is house-bound. Speaking of which ...

3. Thanks to budget cuts, DMV offices are becoming fewer and farther between. Somebody above mentioned there is only one DMV office for every two counties in his state. In Iowa, in the Des Moines metro area, there used to be several DMV offices scattered around. The state closed all of them, consolidating into a single new county-wide office several miles outside the city limits. The only practical way to get there is with a car or a cab. That's not a big deal for drivers looking to renew a license. It is a problem for people without cars.

 

[Bowfinger]

It is impossible to be a functioning contributing member of modern society without a photo ID so it makes all the sense in the world why the Democrats don't want showing one a requirement to vote.

That is simply, factually incorrect. It may be your presumption based on your own narrow life experiences. It is NOT the reality for a significant number of Americans.

 

[Bowfinger]

http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2012/01/02/naacp-worker-sentenced-to-prison-for-voter-fraud/

Sorry, not noteworthy enough to make more noteworthy press.

Or unless you seek out a story appearing at The Daily Caller but otherwise receiving no coverage by the national media. Matthew Vadum reports:

[A]n NAACP executive sits in prison, sentenced for carrying out a massive voter fraud scheme.

In … April a Tunica County, Miss., jury convicted NAACP official Lessadolla Sowers on 10 counts of fraudulently casting absentee ballots. Sowers is identified on an NAACP website as a member of the Tunica County NAACP Executive Committee.

Sowers received a five-year prison term for each of the 10 counts, but Circuit Court Judge Charles Webster permitted Sowers to serve those terms concurrently, according to the Tunica Times, the only media outlet to cover the sentencing.

Anybody else catch this? As has been generally the case, the examples of voter fraud provided by ID proponents have been poor examples like this one, where voter photo IDs would NOT have prevented the fraud. This was a case of absentee ballot fraud, not in-person fraud.

The simple fact is that absentee ballot fraud is far more common, far less risky, and just plain easier to commit than in-person fraud, especially on any meaningful scale. Yet the Republicans, for all of their sudden devotion to preserving the integrity of our elections, remain silent on securing absentee ballots. Why? Forgive my cynicism, but given that absentee ballots tend to favor Republicans, I'm afraid I suspect a lack of sincerity in their motives.

 

[CallMeJoe]

For those who want actual numbers:

Brennan Center for Justice statistics on electoral fraud
If the studies cited by the Brennan Center are correct, substantiated voter fraud in the United States since the 2000 elections (inclusive) occurred at a rate <0.0003%, and none of the fraudulent votes detected could have been prevented by the current fad of Voter ID laws.

The South Carolina Republican solution to this rampant fraud is to require picture IDs at the same time that personnel levels at the state-run DMV offices (where those IDs would be issued) have been reduced by 20%...

 

[Jhhnn]

Once again, "man-made global warming"...

Which of your Constitutional rights has been infringed by concerns about climate change?

 

[Jadow]

Depends what the statute says. If it says that giving false identity to an election worker is a crime, then he should be prosecuted.

he never gave a false identity. He said "do you have an Eric Holder?" he never said "I am" he also never signed anything and never touched the ballot.

 

[senseamp]

he never gave a false identity. He said "do you have an Eric Holder?" he never said "I am" he also never signed anything and never touched the ballot.

So there was no voter fraud on that tape?

 

[FuzzyBee]

Which of your Constitutional rights has been infringed by concerns about climate change?

The same ones that "rapture insurance" and "a giant meteorite" infringed upon.

 

[Jhhnn]

The same ones that "rapture insurance" and "a giant meteorite" infringed upon.

In other words, it has no bearing on the subject at hand. Well, unless you're trying to sell me on rapture insurance the same way you're trying to sell me on "voter fraud" insurance.

Maybe everybody should be required to buy insurance against home invasion by bigfoot, too... I mean, it's a helluva problem, huh?

"Voter Fraud" has not been shown to be anything more than an imaginary problem whose real world solution would negatively impact the constitutional right of every American to vote. Given the origins of the whole attempt, that's not surprising-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GBAsFwPglw

Some things never change.

 

[monovillage]

Anybody else catch this? As has been generally the case, the examples of voter fraud provided by ID proponents have been poor examples like this one, where voter photo IDs would NOT have prevented the fraud. This was a case of absentee ballot fraud, not in-person fraud.

The simple fact is that absentee ballot fraud is far more common, far less risky, and just plain easier to commit than in-person fraud, especially on any meaningful scale. Yet the Republicans, for all of their sudden devotion to preserving the integrity of our elections, remain silent on securing absentee ballots. Why? Forgive my cynicism, but given that absentee ballots tend to favor Republicans, I'm afraid I suspect a lack of sincerity in their motives.

You seem to be perfectly happy with the knowledge that voter fraud is taking place as long as it's in your parties favor. I'd like to see more security with absentee ballots also. My mother-in-law had a caregiver that so helpfully marked her ballot for her. Marked it in a straight Democrat ticket btw even though my mother-in-law was a lifetime Republican. How nice of the caregiver, how thoughtful, how typically Democrat.

btw I took her down and she voted at the polls that year. We fired the caregiver.

 

[Jhhnn]

You seem to be perfectly happy with the knowledge that voter fraud is taking place as long as it's in your parties favor. I'd like to see more security with absentee ballots also. My mother-in-law had a caregiver that so helpfully marked her ballot for her. Marked it in a straight Democrat ticket btw even though my mother-in-law was a lifetime Republican. How nice of the caregiver, how thoughtful, how typically Democrat.

btw I took her down and she voted at the polls that year. We fired the caregiver.

Standard false attribution followed by an anecdote of dubious merit. But you've made up your mind, and will resort to anything to maintain your position.

 

[monovillage]

Standard false attribution followed by an anecdote of dubious merit. But you've made up your mind, and will resort to anything to maintain your position.

Not anything, but I usually tell the personal anecdotes since those are the ones I think about when I discuss issues. I have no problem if you dismiss it or think I lie, since I know it's true. I don't understand why people are so against more security in voting such as a form of ID shown at the polls and stricter controls on absentee ballots, but security at airports by the TSA is perfectly fine.

 

[monovillage]

Always nice to find a timely opinion article from Malkin.

On Tuesday, a New York judge set new trial dates for Democratic officials and political operatives accused of another ballot fraud conspiracy. A first round of prosecutions against Democratic Elections Commissioner Edward McDonough and his co-defendant, former Councilman Michael LoPorto, ended in mistrials last month. The two men also face separate voter fraud charges involving a plot by Democrats to win the radical Working Families Party primary back in 2009. The WFP is a front group for President Obama's dear old friends at fraud-plagued ACORN.

According to law enforcement authorities, the ring of Democrats tried to rig the primary election for city council and county legislature by forging absentee ballots and ballot applications to ensure that their candidates also won the Working Families Party primary line.

Fox News Channel investigative reporter Eric Shawn noted that a whistle-blower in the case, WFP employee Sarah Couch, told investigators that her bosses "asked her to issue a Working Families Party press release that would 'point blame at the Republican Party,' and she refused to do so." Another whistle-blower, Democratic operative Anthony DeFiglio, told police that "faking absentee ballots was a commonplace and accepted practice in political circles, all intended to swing an election."

Meanwhile, in Wisconsin, the state's Medical Examining Board decided last month to investigate 11 additional doctors for writing fake sick notes for public union teachers who ditched their classrooms to protest GOP Gov. Scott Walker. Nine other medical professionals have already received slaps on the wrist.

Primary petitions. Absentee ballots. Doctors' orders. Fraudulent signatures are becoming the signature of desperate Democrats who play the electoral game by one set of rules: By Any Means Necessary.

Yet, progressives in the media and White House continue to strike a see-no-election-fraud, hear-no-election-fraud, speak-no-election-fraud pose.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...democrats_election_forgery_racket_113722.html

 

[Moonbeam]

I will stipulate that voter fraud has not been proven in many cases but for many reasons, the most valid being that to do so would require breaking the law. The left must stipulate that it has been proven that voter fraud can be committed, and in some cases, quite easily. Now, I am not about to start putting a label on a group saying who would perpetuate such fraud. The fact that it is so easy to commit voter fraud anyone could do it and its so simple to eliminate a very large avenue to it. This pretty much screams for a common sense solution, i.e. voter ID. Same exact discussion comes into play with regards to purchasing a firearm. It so easy to eliminate a majority of issues by requiring ID.

How is requiring a voter ID going to disenfranchise a single voter. Every state that has these laws also provides ID free of charge for the purpose of voting. Again, aside from lazy asses, who is getting left out?

The fact that I can easily kill people with all the weapons I own pretty much screams for common sense gun control.

The few folk who do the strategic thinking for the Republican party know that the conservative mind is paranoid so they always play on that to gin up ways to pass laws that suppress the Democratic vote. There is no other issue behind these voter ID laws than that, keep more disadvantaged folk away from the polls. They are nothing more than anti democratic scum hiding behind a moral fabrication to solve a problem that doesn't exist. They will pretend that the three votes they keep from being cast by cheats is worth the thousands of votes they disenfranchise. Just human scum parading behind another phony moral crusade.

 

[FuzzyBee]

In other words, it has no bearing on the subject at hand. Well, unless you're trying to sell me on rapture insurance the same way you're trying to sell me on "voter fraud" insurance.
.

Hey - you brought it up. Why not stick with your original comments?

 

[Bowfinger]

You seem to be perfectly happy with the knowledge that voter fraud is taking place as long as it's in your parties favor.

Wrong on two fronts. First, I have no party. I am independent, think both parties suck, and vote for people, not parties.

Second, I am not happy with any voting fraud, contrary to your slur. You still haven't shown there is any material level of in-person voting fraud taking place, however, let alone any that could not be easily circumvented if there was a photo ID requirement. Your continued assertions about in-person fraud are as meaningless as cries to stop Big Foot home invasions (to borrow from Jhhnn). In both cases, I do NOT favor disenfranchising a significant number of Americans based on empty allegations... especially when the far simpler explanation is obvious self-interest by the people making the claims.

I'd like to see more security with absentee ballots also.

Good for you, but your party has shown no interest in anything except in-person voter IDs. Why? Because the groups disenfranchised by such laws -- elderly, minorities, poor, and students -- are more likely to vote for Democrats. By imposing arbitrary restrictions to "fix" a problem they cannot show exists, they know they can reduce Democratic votes. They do NOT push to restrict absentee ballots, even though there are more examples of absentee ballot fraud, because absentee ballots tend to be somewhat more favorable to Republicans.

My mother-in-law had a caregiver that so helpfully marked her ballot for her. Marked it in a straight Democrat ticket btw even though my mother-in-law was a lifetime Republican. How nice of the caregiver, how thoughtful, how typically Democrat.

btw I took her down and she voted at the polls that year. We fired the caregiver.

Good. You should. The caregiver was out of line and should be fired. But this has nothing to do with in-person voter fraud, does it? Indeed, it's yet another example of how absentee ballots are being abused.

 

[Bowfinger]

Always nice to find a timely opinion article from Malkin.



http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...democrats_election_forgery_racket_113722.html

Did you read your own propaganda piece? Once again, over and over, this was an example of absentee ballot fraud, NOT in-person voting. The right is being incredibly dishonest, screeching about voter ID, then "proving" their case with anecdotes that would not be prevented by such IDs. Yet the RNC faithful lap it up, unable to demonstrate even rudimentary critical thinking skills.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Where's the *proof* of "many, many" people being "disenfranchised"?

 

[classy]

This is so not a story. And if anyone thinks Obama won because of voter fraud, they are completely delusional.

 

[Jhhnn]

Where's the *proof* of "many, many" people being "disenfranchised"?

Where's the proof of "Voter Fraud" that would be eliminated by picture ID?

You claim there's a problem requiring solution- demonstrate that it exists at some significant level greater than the Brennan Center's observed rate of <.0003%. They even offer that picture ID wouldn't change that in the slightest.

The burden of proof is on you & your team, not the other way around, and your contentions don't even pass the sniff test.

 

[Jhhnn]

The fact that I can easily kill people with all the weapons I own pretty much screams for common sense gun control.

The few folk who do the strategic thinking for the Republican party know that the conservative mind is paranoid so they always play on that to gin up ways to pass laws that suppress the Democratic vote. There is no other issue behind these voter ID laws than that, keep more disadvantaged folk away from the polls. They are nothing more than anti democratic scum hiding behind a moral fabrication to solve a problem that doesn't exist. They will pretend that the three votes they keep from being cast by cheats is worth the thousands of votes they disenfranchise. Just human scum parading behind another phony moral crusade.

Thank you, Moonbeam.

 

[xBiffx]

Where's the proof of "Voter Fraud" that would be eliminated by picture ID?

You claim there's a problem requiring solution- demonstrate that it exists at some significant level greater than the Brennan Center's observed rate of <.0003%. They even offer that picture ID wouldn't change that in the slightest.

The burden of proof is on you & your team, not the other way around, and your contentions don't even pass the sniff test.

If you really need someone to explain to you how positive ID works then I can understand why you think this is all smoke and mirrors and sounds like the boogeyman. Waste of time trying to convince you otherwise. I love the observed rate figure. Nice job bringing a figure, with nothing to back it up though.

Edit: Even if that figure were to be true, the 2000 election was decided by almost that exact same amount. But then that is only what they found, and we know how people committing fraud do everything they can to be detected and caught.

 

[FerrelGeek]

I agree with you in that we need to do a better job in securing absentee ballots. I'm not a big fan of 'early voting' or that anybody can just get an absentee ballot. One should have a reason for needing one: disability, out of town on election day, pregnancy, etc.

Given that, do you have any thoughts on how to better secure these? I'd genuinely like to know.

Anybody else catch this? As has been generally the case, the examples of voter fraud provided by ID proponents have been poor examples like this one, where voter photo IDs would NOT have prevented the fraud. This was a case of absentee ballot fraud, not in-person fraud.

The simple fact is that absentee ballot fraud is far more common, far less risky, and just plain easier to commit than in-person fraud, especially on any meaningful scale. Yet the Republicans, for all of their sudden devotion to preserving the integrity of our elections, remain silent on securing absentee ballots. Why? Forgive my cynicism, but given that absentee ballots tend to favor Republicans, I'm afraid I suspect a lack of sincerity in their motives.