Hillary makes it official

[ivwshane]

Nice job of deflecting and attacking.

You stated the jobs are there. I stated there are damn near 100 million people not working.

Please tell me which of us is wrong.

Like I said, you aren't capable of evaluating the OP's claim, your follow up post proves it. Perhaps you can reread the original post and see if you can figure it out

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Nice job of deflecting and attacking.

You stated the jobs are there. I stated there are damn near 100 million people not working.

Admittedly the job market still stinks, its hard to find a good job so I accept that part.
Please tell me which of us is wrong.

Many of those 100 million are retired. They have worked their entire lives now choose or are forced to retire. Personally at some point during my life I'd like to retire.
I'll admit the job market is still tough, good jobs are too hard to find.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Many of those 100 million are retired. They have worked their entire lives now choose or are forced to retire. Personally at son point during my life I'd like to retire.

They are retired, students, disabled etc... It's a completely bullshit argument that keeps getting trotted out because, for some reason, some just can't accept that things aren't as bad as they want to believe they are.

You have, what, 46 million that are over 65. 40 million between 55-64. 40 million between 16-24 of which something like 31 million are in school.

Unless you believe that every last person in those demographics wants/needs to/can work the you'd have to be developmentally delayed to keep bringing it up as some sort of argument.

 

[rudeguy]

Many of those 100 million are retired. They have worked their entire lives now choose or are forced to retire. Personally at some point during my life I'd like to retire.
I'll admit the job market is still tough, good jobs are too hard to find.

That's the whole point.

Pretending the job market is good is just idiotic. Its not good. But we have a large portion of posters on here who refuse to not believe anything Dear Leader tells them. The applaud (literally) jobs reports that they know are fudged and ignore the numbers that show record numbers of Americans not working and on public assistance.

This country has no chance of improving if people like them won't even admit there is a problem.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

So is it about the 100 million or fudged job numbers?
To me its simple, reports are not needed. Growth starts at the bottom, then moves up. I will not state the job market is good until any regular person with regular skills can leave their current job and have a new job offer that has something better about it over the old job within 7-10 days.
Perpetual bickering and derping over who did what 5,10,15,20,25,30,50 years ago is irrelevant but good to be aware of. The real question is do we do the same thing and expect different results or do something new?

 

[ivwshane]

That's the whole point.

Pretending the job market is good is just idiotic. Its not good. But we have a large portion of posters on here who refuse to not believe anything Dear Leader tells them. The applaud (literally) jobs reports that they know are fudged and ignore the numbers that show record numbers of Americans not working and on public assistance.

This country has no chance of improving if people like them won't even admit there is a problem.

So is it about the 100 million or fudged job numbers?
To me its simple, reports are not needed. Growth starts at the bottom, then moves up. I will not state the job market is good until any regular person with regular skills can leave their current job and have a new job offer that has something better about it over the old job within 7-10 days.

Straw man.

 

[nickqt]

That's the whole point.

Pretending the job market is good is just idiotic. Its not good. But we have a large portion of posters on here who refuse to not believe anything Dear Leader tells them. The applaud (literally) jobs reports that they know are fudged and ignore the numbers that show record numbers of Americans not working and on public assistance.

This country has no chance of improving if people like them won't even admit there is a problem.

There you go projecting again.

You're claiming that there are "record numbers" of Americans not working.

Well, here's the thing. See, there were less Americans 5 minutes ago than there are now. Repeat ad nauseum, going back about 235 years.

So, there are record numbers of Americans, right this second. An hour from now, there will be a brand new record number of Americans breathing.

The only thing that matters is the ratio, and there, you have to bob and weave to try to claim that unemployment is greater now than it was in say, 2009. Which it isn't.

So, what does it matter that there are "record numbers" of Americans not working, when the ratio of Employed:Unemployed means a whole lot more, and currently there isn't a record unemployment rate.

So, what does it matter? Besides the fact that you're obfuscating and moving goal posts because libruuuuls hate America so much that they aren't jumping down Obama's throat because he hasn't delivered unicorns to every able-bodied American.

 

[Jhhnn]

That's the whole point.

Pretending the job market is good is just idiotic. Its not good. But we have a large portion of posters on here who refuse to not believe anything Dear Leader tells them. The applaud (literally) jobs reports that they know are fudged and ignore the numbers that show record numbers of Americans not working and on public assistance.

This country has no chance of improving if people like them won't even admit there is a problem.

The job market has obviously *improved* since January 2009. The rest is just usual right wing conspiracy theory.

Looting sprees have long lasting consequences. I'll bet things were rough in Rome for years after the Visigoths cleared out.

 

[ivwshane]

The job market has obviously *improved* since January 2009. The rest is just usual right wing conspiracy theory.

Looting sprees have long lasting consequences. I'll bet things were rough in Rome for years after the Visigoths cleared out.

Well to be fair, righties do believe in fairytales like trickle down economics, 100% border control, saint reagan, and I can only assume they believe that had a republican been elected president that the economy would be at 100% employment with a 100% participation rate. Fairytales are nice but the problem with them is that they don't deal with reality and there never seems to be a full explanation of how.

 

[First]

I always love the Jobs Truthers pretending numbers BLS numbers can't be trusted while linking to Breitbart.

 

[rudeguy]

I always love the Jobs Truthers pretending numbers BLS numbers can't be trusted while linking to Breitbart.

Forbes better for you?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2014/01/24/after-five-years-of-obamanomics-a-record-100-million-americans-not-working/



I always love the idiots who attack the source and ignore the facts.

 

[rudeguy]

The job market has obviously *improved* since January 2009. The rest is just usual right wing conspiracy theory.

Looting sprees have long lasting consequences. I'll bet things were rough in Rome for years after the Visigoths cleared out.

So the job situation has improved but more people are on welfare.

Please explain how that works.

 

[brycejones]

Forbes better for you?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterfe...s-a-record-100-million-americans-not-working/



I always love the idiots who attack the source and ignore the facts.

Opinion piece? I love the idiots who don't vet their sources before posting.

 

[JSt0rm]

I wish I was as dumb as rudeguy. Imagine being so dumb you think youre smart. That is bliss my friends.

 

[nickqt]

So the job situation has improved but more people are on welfare.

Please explain how that works.

Welfare?

You do realize that you can work full time at some jobs and still qualify for Federal and state aid programs?

Right?

Right?

 

[rudeguy]

Opinion piece? I love the idiots who don't vet their sources before posting.

I love the idiots who attack the source and ignore the facts

 

[ivwshane]

I love the idiots who attack the source and ignore the facts

Well this link says you are wrong

http://www.cbpp.org/research/chart-book-tanf-at-18?fa=view&id=3566

So the question then becomes, do you admit you are wrong or do you become a parody of yourself?

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37348503&postcount=28

 

[UberNeuman]

I love the idiots who attack the source and ignore the facts

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I'm still digesting the 100 million figure. Are you suggesting we should all work from cradle to grave to be successful?

 

[First]

Forbes better for you?

lol, because partisan Forbes opinion pieces are better than, uh, partisan news web sites from the same conservative thinktanks this piece was written by.

Herrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp, a derp.

I'm still digesting the 100 million figure. Are you suggesting we should all work from cradle to grave to be successful?

He doesn't know what he's suggesting, knuckle draggers struggle with constructs like Florida retirements or school enrollments.

 

[Jhhnn]

So the job situation has improved but more people are on welfare.

Please explain how that works.

It works because the world isn't black & white false equivalency.

And then there's the whole top down class warfare looting spree & aftermath you seem to want to avoid rather desperately. You know, the mighty Job Creators running amok with orgiastic greed & then crashing the economy.

Economic, fiscal & financial policy of the Roaring 20's created the Great Depression and the same sort of policy from the Bush Admin during the "ownership society" created the Great Recession of today. Any fool knows that only a complete reversal of the Bush Admin hands off the financial sector policy & action by the FRB prevented a re-run of 1930.

We still have a somewhat dysfunctional economy because too few people own & control too much of it, something that Repub ideology can't even begin to address, other than to blame Obama for letting them get in the way.

 

[rudeguy]

Well this link says you are wrong

http://www.cbpp.org/research/chart-book-tanf-at-18?fa=view&id=3566

So the question then becomes, do you admit you are wrong or do you become a parody of yourself?

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37348503&postcount=28

You mean your link that shows over a million more families in poverty since 08?

Or am I missing something? I have been doing a ton of soldering lately and I've probably breathed in a pound of lead this week. I'm not being intentionally dense here. Well at least not at the moment.

 

[rudeguy]

It works because the world isn't black & white false equivalency.

And then there's the whole top down class warfare looting spree & aftermath you seem to want to avoid rather desperately. You know, the mighty Job Creators running amok with orgiastic greed & then crashing the economy.

Economic, fiscal & financial policy of the Roaring 20's created the Great Depression and the same sort of policy from the Bush Admin during the "ownership society" created the Great Recession of today. Any fool knows that only a complete reversal of the Bush Admin hands off the financial sector policy & action by the FRB prevented a re-run of 1930.

We still have a somewhat dysfunctional economy because too few people own & control too much of it, something that Repub ideology can't even begin to address, other than to blame Obama for letting them get in the way.

Or it could be that we reward people for not working like never before.

Let's be honest. If you or I were single moms trying to raise kids would we bust our tales for $500 a week and take home maybe $350 and barely make rent or let the government pay us to stay at home and watch soaps?

If we don't give people a reason to work, a lot won't. Add in how tough it is for businesses right now and you have a perfect storm. People don't really need to work and businesses aren't in a position to pay more than what the government gives.

Hell I work for a small company that will do $750M in sales this year and we still are afraid to hire new people. No one knows if the bottom is going to fall out if the economy and it's beyond expensive to pay for their health care. So we pay out the nose for consultants since there is no commitment.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Or it could be that we reward people for not working like never before.

Let's be honest. If you or I were single moms trying to raise kids would we bust our tales for $500 a week and take home maybe $350 and barely make rent or let the government pay us to stay at home and watch soaps?

If we don't give people a reason to work, a lot won't. Add in how tough it is for businesses right now and you have a perfect storm. People don't really need to work and businesses aren't in a position to pay more than what the government gives.

Hell I work for a small company that will do $750M in sales this year and we still are afraid to hire new people. No one knows if the bottom is going to fall out if the economy and it's beyond expensive to pay for their health care. So we pay out the nose for consultants since there is no commitment.

All the more reason to raise the minimum wage.
While I'm not a business owner I have run locations for big companies, I've also been accountable for keeping a good margin. To me 750 million in sales that is growing(I assume). Unless its real bad margins I'd say hire more. Leaders take smart risks, growing sales means adding more people. Yes its a risk but a few extra bodies generally won't bankrupt a company.

 

[JSt0rm]

You mean your link that shows over a million more families in poverty since 08?

Or am I missing something? I have been doing a ton of soldering lately and I've probably breathed in a pound of lead this week. I'm not being intentionally dense here. Well at least not at the moment.

You need to learn proper soldering breathing technique. (exhale while actually soldering) Fuck man. You inhale lead and then come into a p&n forum and debate with people who have degrees in what you want to debate? Just stop it.