Havoc in Kiev: Snipers fire on protesters/opposition (NSFW)

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Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
yanukovych did not sign that document on his own decision

Do you know anything about document they wanted to put him to sign?
Would it be good for EU? Would it be same as good for Ukraina?
Maybe you'll post here some paragraphs from this document with your opinions about?

Can you?
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
33,412
11,563
136
What do you know about EU? what do you know, how people did live in USSR?

I just don't want you to parrot media - tell, what do you know about - in your own words, about experiences of people you do or you did know....

What does it matter what I know?

The fact is a lot of people in the Ukraine are fed up with years of heavy control by the state and think that things would be better with stronger links to the EU.
 

Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
What does it matter what I know?

The fact is a lot of people in the Ukraine are fed up with years of heavy control by the state and think that things would be better with stronger links to the EU.

The Fact is - before EU and East Europe - Ukraina,. Moldova, Georgia meeting in Vilnius in november 28-29, when EU expected Yanukovich to sign that document, there was no word about "people in the Ukraine are fed up with years of heavy control by the state and think that things would be better with stronger links to the EU"...

You must be an idiot to not uinderstand how things started - in Kiev after November 29-29 and why...And who orchestrated all...
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
33,412
11,563
136
The Fact is - before EU and East Europe - Ukraina,. Moldova, Georgia meeting in Vilnius in november 28-29, when EU expected Yanukovich to sign that document, there was no word about "people in the Ukraine are fed up with years of heavy control by the state and think that things would be better with stronger links to the EU"...

You must be an idiot to not uinderstand how things started - in Kiev after November 29-29 and why...And who orchestrated all...

Really?

Because what the EU really wants now is another basket case economy trying to join.

You cant see why people living in the Ukraine might actually want to have a bit less of the Russian bear leaning on them?
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
The Fact is - before EU and East Europe - Ukraina,. Moldova, Georgia meeting in Vilnius in november 28-29, when EU expected Yanukovich to sign that document, there was no word about "people in the Ukraine are fed up with years of heavy control by the state and think that things would be better with stronger links to the EU"... You must be an idiot to not uinderstand how things started - in Kiev after November 29-29 and why...And who orchestrated all...

you are apparantly ignoring hundreds of years of history of eastern europe. and the orange revolution happened 10 years ago not 10 days ago. and people hated yushchenko because he did not carry out his promises and was very corrupt.
 

Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
so where exactly do you live?

you have first hand knowledge of ukraine or russia or both?

How should it matter - where do I live?
I do speak and understand a few languages and I do communicate with a lot of people...
And I do have a lot of sources to get news and news analysis...in different languages...
 

Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
you are apparantly ignoring hundreds of years of history of eastern europe. and the orange revolution happened 10 years ago not 10 days ago. and people hated yushchenko because he did not carry out his promises and was very corrupt.

What a magical word: Corruption...Isn't it?
No corruption in US? Because it's legalized - it's called Fundrising...

Some fools giving money with no expectations for a return.
Just you - a "wise" guy - pay money @ McDonalds and won't go away untill they don't give you a Big Mac...Corporations are different than you - they pay money just in good deeds?

And you don't hate yourself about your own idiocy?
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
What a magical word: Corruption...Isn't it? No corruption in US? Because it's legalized - it's called Fundrising... Some fools giving money with no expectations for a return. Just you - a "wise" guy - pay money @ McDonalds and won't go away untill they don't give you a Big Mac...Corporations are different than you - they pay money just in good deeds? And you don't hate yourself about your own idiocy?

have you even read any of my posts here?
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
your actions come straight out of the far right handbook. throw out a biased opinion and ignore or deflect questions and just repeat the same content with different words. you are either a troll with knowledge of eastern europe or you are a pro russia far right slav
 

Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
your actions come straight out of the far right handbook. throw out a biased opinion and ignore or deflect questions and just repeat the same content with different words. you are either a troll with knowledge of eastern europe or you are a pro russia far right slav

I wouldn't anymore argue with an idiot - idiot would bring me down to this level and would beat me with an experience....

Right now, I'm Pro-US: Every morning I go to work and help americans to live better. I don't post on here or any other sites while I'm at work...
I don't mix my work with my personal opinions. I would help any person while I'm at work, no matter of his/her nationality, race or anything else...

My world is fence less world...Media hypnosis won't work on me. And I've lived in 2 different political systems, have something to compare.
But humans are everywhere the same - head, 2 legs, 2 arms...etc...
Try to google(if you're interested) what can be done to a any human in any system - famous quote from Hermann Goering...
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
I wouldn't anymore argue with an idiot - idiot would bring me down to this level and would beat me with an experience.... Right now, I'm Pro-US: Every morning I go to work and help americans to live better. I don't post on here or any other sites while I'm at work... I don't mix my work with my personal opinions. I would help any person while I'm at work, no matter of his/her nationality, race or anything else... My world is fence less world...Media hypnosis won't work on me. And I've lived in 2 different political systems, have something to compare. But humans are everywhere the same - head, 2 legs, 2 arms...etc... Try to google(if you're interested) what can be done to a any human in any system - famous quote from Hermann Goering...

gud mit du

and why should we believe anything you say. you have given us various pro russian statements and other tolling like statement or vague answers. so there is no way we can be sure of anything you say
 

Gintaras

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2000
1,892
1
71
gud mit du

and why should we believe anything you say. you have given us various pro russian statements and other tolling like statement or vague answers. so there is no way we can be sure of anything you say

Why do you use "WE", "US" instead of "I"?
Are you a spokesman for All and Everyone on this board?
 

theeedude

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,198
126

It's a more nuanced picture, Crimea is only 2M people out of 46M, and not all are Russian. They would actually benefit most from joining EU, because with European investment and customers, they could become a major travel destination, but the new government needs to find an approach to the region that respects their Russian identity and autonomy.
In the other regions, it's less about wanting to join Russia than not wanting some people who seized power in Kiev telling them how to live. I said before, going in seizing buildings and tearing down monuments would provoke a reaction from the locals in the east. It's basic human nature, and on top of that there is a lot of history in the east that they want respected.
Plus one of the first laws the new parliament passed to appease nationalists is banning use of Russian language in official business, which is another insult to the Russian speakers in the east, who perceive it as Ukrainian being forced on them. It's been widely condemned, including even in western Ukraine (Ukrainian speaking Lviv even had a speak Russian day to show respect for minority languages) and Europe. It's unnecessarily divisive move when the country needs unity, and a major mistake on the part of the new government. They need to learn from multicultural and multi-language countries in Europe and Canada how to manage this situation, so you can have regional cultural diversity together with a national identity. If they don't, then the country will fall apart.
 
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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
36,290
10,589
136
It's a more nuanced picture, Crimea is only 2M people out of 46M, and not all are Russian. They would actually benefit most from joining EU, because with European investment and customers, they could become a major travel destination, but the new government needs to find an approach to the region that respects their Russian identity and autonomy.
In the other regions, it's less about wanting to join Russia than not wanting some people who seized power in Kiev telling them how to live. I said before, going in seizing buildings and tearing down monuments would provoke a reaction from the locals in the east. It's basic human nature, and on top of that there is a lot of history in the east that they want respected.
Plus one of the first laws the new parliament passed to appease nationalists is banning use of Russian language in official business, which is another insult to the Russian speakers in the east, who perceive it as Ukrainian being forced on them. It's been widely condemned, including even in western Ukraine (Ukrainian speaking Lviv even had a speak Russian day to show respect for minority languages) and Europe. It's unnecessarily divisive move when the country needs unity, and a major mistake on the part of the new government. They need to learn from multicultural and multi-language countries in Europe and Canada how to manage this situation, so you can have regional cultural diversity together with a national identity. If they don't, then the country will fall apart.

...o_O
Thank you for that clear picture of how things are going. Not so well it appears.

Can't believe the boneheaded moves they are making. It seems that to keep things together they needed to calm and reassure those in the East. Instead they are provoking them. Their lives are on the line and they do not seem to care or understand.
 

theeedude

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,198
126
...o_O
Thank you for that clear picture of how things are going. Not so well it appears.

Can't believe the boneheaded moves they are making. It seems that to keep things together they needed to calm and reassure those in the East. Instead they are provoking them. Their lives are on the line and they do not seem to care or understand.

The nationalists are the ones who provided the muscle to make the revolution happen and succeed. And they haven't gone home yet, so they can do it again. That's why you are seeing these unanimous votes in parliament, the lawmakers fear the mobs outside. That's why even the new government had to go outside and get approval of the mob on Maidan before assuming their posts.
Also, a precedent has been set, that if you get a sufficiently large violent and aggressive mob, seize buildings, etc, you can get what you want. No need to go through elections and democratic channels, just do what you want. But there are plenty of violent and aggressive people in the Russian speaking east, and they can do it too, especially if provoked.