Hate Mask and Vaccine Mandates? Just Wait For The Electric Cars

[hal2kilo]

I could imagine there being at least some resistance, on the grounds that electric cars are not 'manly' enough. i.e. not dirty and loud enough. And not enough scope for repairing/modifying it yourself? On the other hand, maybe that would be countered by love of anything high-tech and "advanced"?

Main issue seems to me to be the much greater distances people travel in the US compared to Europe.

As I recall, there were electric cars right back at the start of the development of the automobile, and the idea was for them to be marketed to women, while manly men (who were _expected_ to get dirty) used the combustion engine.

So far, watching Formula E just doesn't do it for me. They need noise generators. Plus you think managing tires is like a science in racing, so is managing how much battery you have left. Needs work.

 

[Greenman]

Thinking about it the wrong way. Those millions of batteries connected are a store of power, available during peak times. NOT a draw from the grid. Just gotta change how we do things a little.

Very good point.

 

[Captante]

Wow.... I'm simply SHOCKED (lol) that adding an EV to your personal electric bill would increase the amount of power you potentially use.

🙄

Somehow this seems so obvious an outcome it doesn't even rate mentioning unless your a true moron.

 

[Greenman]

Thinking about it the wrong way. Those millions of batteries connected are a store of power, available during peak times. NOT a draw from the grid. Just gotta change how we do things a little.

I originally thought that this was a very good point that I had overlooked, but a bit of digging shows that for the most part, it doesn't work. The car charging systems are one way, the only exception I found was the F150.
So we're back to an overloaded grid.

 

[Brainonska511]

I originally thought that this was a very good point that I had overlooked, but a bit of digging shows that for the most part, it doesn't work. The car charging systems are one way, the only exception I found was the F150.
So we're back to an overloaded grid.

It's only an overloaded grid if you have an assumption of demand always being close to or at of the possible capacity, and that infrastructure wouldn't improve alongside electric car adoption.

 

[Captante]

It's only an overloaded grid if you have an assumption of demand always being close to or at of the possible capacity, and that infrastructure wouldn't improve alongside electric car adoption.

Given the way most power companies seem to "plan ahead" I wouldn't bank on this until they're literally forced to do it.

 

[Greenman]

It's only an overloaded grid if you have an assumption of demand always being close to or at of the possible capacity, and that infrastructure wouldn't improve alongside electric car adoption.

We have an overloaded grid right now. It's common to get a text message telling us to shut down everything possible to avoid rolling blackouts.
Every system has a working capacity, be it roads, sewers, or the power supply grid. Northern California's power grid regularly hit's it's limit during the summer months. It's reasonable to assume that electric cars will increase that load. It's also reasonable to assume that we won't address the energy production issue until the system fails. Burning anything for energy is out, nuclear energy is out. That leaves us with wind and solar. Both are viable, but would be a much better option if we had large scale energy storage.
On top of all of that, some city's are banning the use of natural gas in new construction. That will add a considerable load to the power grid for home and domestic hot water heating.

My only issue with all of this is that it's simply rules handed down without addressing any sort of solution. Rather than planning we're going to create an emergency then throw buckets of money at it. California excels at blowing budgets, I fully expect our looming power grid disaster to set all new records for money pissed down a hole.

 

[fskimospy]

We have an overloaded grid right now. It's common to get a text message telling us to shut down everything possible to avoid rolling blackouts.
Every system has a working capacity, be it roads, sewers, or the power supply grid. Northern California's power grid regularly hit's it's limit during the summer months. It's reasonable to assume that electric cars will increase that load. It's also reasonable to assume that we won't address the energy production issue until the system fails. Burning anything for energy is out, nuclear energy is out. That leaves us with wind and solar. Both are viable, but would be a much better option if we had large scale energy storage.
On top of all of that, some city's are banning the use of natural gas in new construction. That will add a considerable load to the power grid for home and domestic hot water heating.

My only issue with all of this is that it's simply rules handed down without addressing any sort of solution. Rather than planning we're going to create an emergency then throw buckets of money at it. California excels at blowing budgets, I fully expect our looming power grid disaster to set all new records for money pissed down a hole.

It seems to me that if your issue is that California won’t build more power generation and transmission capacity that this is the real problem, not electric cars.

NIMBYism isn’t solely a housing construction problem. It also creates issues like this one.

 

[K1052]

It seems to me that if your issue is that California won’t build more power generation and transmission capacity that this is the real problem, not electric cars.

NIMBYism isn’t solely a housing construction problem. It also creates issues like this one.

The problem is that its not even true. The state has moved to boost its generation resources and CASIO has approved billions in transmission upgrades (in addition to the PG&E work required to not set Northern California ablaze regularly). For example I'm not sure how he can say the state is against nuclear power after reversing its position and deciding to keep Diablo Canyon online through at least 2030. Like much of the country California coasted on old infrastructure for too long and it's going to take a while to fix it but the work is underway.

 

[Greenman]

It seems to me that if your issue is that California won’t build more power generation and transmission capacity that this is the real problem, not electric cars.

NIMBYism isn’t solely a housing construction problem. It also creates issues like this one.

That's exactly right, we need power plants.
My only issue with banning ICE cars is that it was done by CARB. My hunch is that the decision will be set aside or dramatically revised in the future. Though I won't have any skin in the game by that time.

 

[K1052]

That's exactly right, we need power plants.
My only issue with banning ICE cars is that it was done by CARB. My hunch is that the decision will be set aside or dramatically revised in the future. Though I won't have any skin in the game by that time.

I just moved form a place with tons of power plants that has increasingly chronic issues. It's not just about the plants it's about overall resources.

 

[feralkid]

I will be utterly unsurprised when they offer an EV aftermarket add-on kit to give you a button-push coal roller option, stacks and all...

Yes, there will absolutely be an app for that.

 

[drnickriviera]

I originally thought that this was a very good point that I had overlooked, but a bit of digging shows that for the most part, it doesn't work. The car charging systems are one way, the only exception I found was the F150.
So we're back to an overloaded grid.

Nissan had it from the very beginning with Chademo. They offered bidirection home chargers in Japan. Looks like bidirectional is in the CCS standard, so just a matter of getting the auto companies to do it. I imagine Cali has enough clout to say all EV's by 20xx need to have it and it would be done

 

[skyking]

Talk to anyone in the area about their solar installs. Utilities are becoming more hostile to residential solar each day. Some are requiring sell all, buy all contracts. Meaning all solar you generate goes to the grid and is bought at wholesale rates as low as 0.01c/kwh and you then have to buy all your electricity at retail rates. Great deal huh? You may want to consider a ground mount off grid setup or a bandit install after your house is done. Off grid will require the high cost of a storage battery.

They just need to put a more patriotic spin on EVs. I can generate my own electricity to charge my Leaf. I can't make my own gas. (I did make biodiesel for a while, but that still required methanol) They need to come up with a marketing campaign like Use Freedom Photons to reduce our dependence on evil Russian oil!

here is the Washington state law regarding net metering. It is 1 to 1, no buying at wholesale and selling back to the consumer at retail.
https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=80.60.030

Our future PUD's fact sheet on net metering.
https://clallampud.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Net-Metering-Fact-Sheet.pdf
Please show me an example of a net metering scheme that works as you have stated.

 

[skyking]

The car market is so screwed up right now.
Do you like the i3?

Wife saw a post about the first F150 lightning in the area. It went for over $100K

that's nuts. An online friend put a trailer hitch on his very used Leaf and can haul anything and more that you would put in an f150 ( tiny tiny) truck bed.

 

[Captante]

I'm really hoping my Honda lasts another couple years.... maybe the market will come back to reality in that time!

 

[Brovane]

Nissan had it from the very beginning with Chademo. They offered bidirection home chargers in Japan. Looks like bidirectional is in the CCS standard, so just a matter of getting the auto companies to do it. I imagine Cali has enough clout to say all EV's by 20xx need to have it and it would be done

Bi-direction wouldn't be to hard of a thing to add. Now that Ford has done it with the F-150 lightning I think that going forward more manufacturers are going to add in that capability.
Tesla is probably not going to be adding bi-direction anytime soon because it would compete against their Powerwall Product.

 

[K1052]

Tesla is probably not going to be adding bi-direction anytime soon because it would compete against their Powerwall Product.

If most US carmakers start putting it on they'll follow. Wait time for a PW is about a year (optimistically) at this point anyway and the company doesn't want to divert cells to it from the car lines or utility scale storage.

 

[Ken g6]

Anybody seen Trump's latest rant on this?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1566222102180528128

He's right about one thing: Charging networks need to be better for road trips (in anything but a Tesla). From what I've heard on YouTube it seems like the first generation of CCS chargers are breaking down and not being fixed. Probably because there's incentive money to install new chargers, but not to fix old ones.

 

[darkswordsman17]

There's a story about a Rivian being used to power a doctor's office so they could perform a vasectomy. Checkmate, right wingers, good luck stopping all the electric car powered vasectomies!

 

[Brovane]

He's right about one thing: Charging networks need to be better for road trips (in anything but a Tesla). From what I've heard on YouTube it seems like the first generation of CCS chargers are breaking down and not being fixed. Probably because there's incentive money to install new chargers, but not to fix old ones.

The charging network is a problem if you don't own a Tesla.

When charging stations have issues it can takes months sometimes for the owner of the charging stations to fix the issue. Right now for example, multiple Electrify America charging stations have issues and Electrify America claims the issues that they cannot get parts to fix the problem.

The other issues is lack of consistency of charging speeds for DC fast charging. Most people that are not early adopters are not really going to understand the nuance between the 50kw and a 150kw DC Fast charging station. All they see is a DC fast charging station and think they are the same when they are not.

The WSJ article below is a great example of someone really not understanding the speed difference with DC Fast charging.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/i-rent...ha6wfvloluc&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink

 

[nOOky]

I think electric may make sense for a lot of folks daily uses. Urban commuters, those with access to charging stations, those that don't take long road trips. I am rural, so my daily use is different. For one, I don't want to plug and unplug a vehicle every time I park. That may be on me, but I tend to keep devices with batteries topped off. My wife would probably take off without unplugging, unless there's a sensor that won't let the vehicle drive while plugged in, I dunno.

For long road trips I want to fill my tank, grab a chicken sandwich and a pop, and go. I suspect infrastructure will improve over time as gas stations start adding charging spots. Right now I think it will be several years before I consider an EV, and I'll likely keep a ICE vehicle around as I transition.

 

[theeedude]

I can't really see myself getting a gasoline car again given how much oil industry supports GOP.

 

[Brainonska511]

I think electric may make sense for a lot of folks daily uses. Urban commuters, those with access to charging stations, those that don't take long road trips. I am rural, so my daily use is different. For one, I don't want to plug and unplug a vehicle every time I park. That may be on me, but I tend to keep devices with batteries topped off. My wife would probably take off without unplugging, unless there's a sensor that won't let the vehicle drive while plugged in, I dunno.

For long road trips I want to fill my tank, grab a chicken sandwich and a pop, and go. I suspect infrastructure will improve over time as gas stations start adding charging spots. Right now I think it will be several years before I consider an EV, and I'll likely keep a ICE vehicle around as I transition.

I think people way overestimate their driving needs. Most car trips are under 10 miles; many people would probably be just fine switching 1 of their 2+ car households over to an electric.

Even moving to PHEVs or HEVs would be a great benefit to our fossil fuel usage, and should alleviate any "range anxiety" people have.

 

[Brovane]

I think electric may make sense for a lot of folks daily uses. Urban commuters, those with access to charging stations, those that don't take long road trips. I am rural, so my daily use is different. For one, I don't want to plug and unplug a vehicle every time I park. That may be on me, but I tend to keep devices with batteries topped off. My wife would probably take off without unplugging, unless there's a sensor that won't let the vehicle drive while plugged in, I dunno.

For long road trips I want to fill my tank, grab a chicken sandwich and a pop, and go. I suspect infrastructure will improve over time as gas stations start adding charging spots. Right now I think it will be several years before I consider an EV, and I'll likely keep a ICE vehicle around as I transition.

Is the ability to cover 2,000+ miles in less than 48-hours fast enough for you? Yeah a Tesla is capable of doing this for long road trips.
A EV doesn't let you engage the motor while you are charging so that isn't going to happen Unlike a ICE vehicle which will let you drive away with the gas station hose still in the gas tank.

If you have a 200+ mile range EV, that for most rural users that covers you for the day. You unplug in the morning and then plug back in the evening when you are done for the day. Usually for me with my EV I will let the charge get below 40% and then I charge it back up to 80%. I rarely charge it to 100% unless I have a longer trip planned the next day.