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has anybody ever been involved with an abortion?

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Terzo said:
Since this seems to have turned into an opinion bit, I'll weigh in with my own.

At this point, I do not condone abortion, but I believe people should be able to choose for themselves. If someone were to ask my advice, I'd encourage them to look into adoption or something similar, but if they decide that abortion is the best choice I wont stop them.

Of course, this is all theoretical. If I actually found myself in such a situation, perhaps I would sing a different tune.
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I have no problem with that.

I also don't LIKE abortions...in fact, I dislike them so much that I'll never get one. (but I won't stand in the way of a woman who believes it's her best option.)
 
neckarb said:
Everything you've said is true, but a fertilized egg has more potential to become life, than unfertilized. If you get to the point of getting someone pregnant you should live with the consequences, I've never slept with someone I'm not prepared to get pregnant.
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I have...many times.

It's called birth control. Try it sometime.

Eggs are created in a woman's body every month and they are flushed from her body every month. Many women miscarry too, my wife did a few years ago. No big deal.
 
bhanson said:
Would you kill the President of the United States to save two alcoholic bums?
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No because the president could save many more lives through his life.

Is a mother giving up any chance at a life to raise a child that also has very little chance at life better than having an abortion and giving the mother a shot?
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Firstly, I would say adoption, secondly I would say that an often miserable life is better than no life at all. Plus it's impossible to say at the point of conception that a life isn't worth living.
 
Terzo said:
At this point, I do not condone abortion, but I believe people should be able to choose for themselves. If someone were to ask my advice, I'd encourage them to look into adoption or something similar, but if they decide that abortion is the best choice I wont stop them.
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This x1000
 
neckarb said:
They do pre-empt life, but they also destroy actual potential for life. I.e. something that left to it will create life, contraceptives do not.
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So contraceptives do not destroy the actual potential for life?

This discussion is over, i really can't say more and i'd get myself banned if i were to continue this debate because what i have to say isn't nice.
 
JohnOfSheffield said:
So contraceptives do not destroy the actual potential for life?

This discussion is over, i really can't say more and i'd get myself banned if i were to continue this debate because what i have to say isn't nice.
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No contraceptives destroy the action that could lead to actual potential for life.
🙂

I'm surprised you get so upset over moral theory.
 
zibYR.jpg
 
neckarb said:
I've heard this argument before and there is some validity to it, it is a womans body, but I would argue that finite pain, and hormone swings are not enough to remove the potential for life. I also believe that both parents have the right to choose, if abortion is ok it needs to be a choice by both parents not one. No one has the right to deprive their ex or current partner of their (potential) child.
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Wrong. Only exception is if the couple are married...then the guy should have some parental rights. Otherwise you shot your goo into her and you gave up all rights to your goo and what it might create. It is her body, neither you nor anybody else should be able to dictate what a woman does with her own body.
 
Yeah I did but it has no potential to ever be anything other than cellular life left to it's own devices.
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So how is killing one cell so much more morally acceptable than killing two cells?

True. But "In all likelihood" isn't good enough when talking about what I believe to be moral absolutes
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I'm kind of a tentative guy in terms of language. So when I say "in all likelihood" they will only live a week, I mean, "it will be a fucking miracle if they survive the first 2 days".

Not when an unfertilized egg or sperm are left to it.
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Wrong.

ok let me try an explain this differently, lets assume that I'm arguing that you shouldn't destroy a chair as it could become an old chair (stupid example but it's what came to me) destroying a chair = wrong, destroying wood that could become a chair is different, as a chair has actual potential to become an old chair by just leaving the chair alone but bits of wood don't unless you first build a chair with them.
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You don't have to feed the chair. You don't have to clothe the chair. You don't have to shelter the chair. You don't have to protect the chair from thousands of diseases that want to destroy the chair. You don't have any emotional attachment to the chair.

No explination for that... There is logic to my argument, there is logic to yours. different opinions don't mean you need to hurl insults.
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Pardon me, but I can't see your logic.

They do pre-empt life, but they also destroy actual potential for life. I.e. something that left to it will create life, contraceptives do not.
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Maybe you should try something else. Your 'potential life' thing isn't getting you anywhere.
 
neckarb said:
No because the president could save many more lives through his life.



Firstly, I would say adoption, secondly I would say that an often miserable life is better than no life at all. Plus it's impossible to say at the point of conception that a life isn't worth living.
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Would you kill your fiancée to save the President? Your mom? First child?
 
JulesMaximus said:
Wrong. Only exception is if the couple are married...then the guy should have some parental rights. Otherwise you shot your goo into her and you gave up all rights to your goo and what it might create. It is her body, neither you nor anybody else should be able to dictate what a woman does with her own body.
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I don't think the ceremony of marriage gives you any more rights to the womans body than you had over it before the ceremony.

Parental rights exist when you are a parent, you don't become a parent until after birth so perhaps i misunderstood what you were saying?
 
Religion is a poison that infects your mind. Break free.

Never been involved in an Abortion. However, when I was a Religious Teen I was constantly wracked with guilt every time I Fapped. It was pointless and completely due to Religious BS, having nothing to do with Right/Wrong.
 
Mr. Pedantic said:
So how is killing one cell so much more morally acceptable than killing two cells?
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One cell will stay one cell, two cells might become a lot more.
I'm kind of a tentative guy in terms of language. So when I say "in all likelihood" they will only live a week, I mean, "it will be a fucking miracle if they survive the first 2 days".
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This miracle happens on a regular basis though.
You don't have to feed the baby. You don't have to clothe the baby. You don't have to shelter the baby. You don't have to protect the baby from thousands of diseases that want to destroy the baby. You don't have any emotional attachment to the chair. You can give a baby up for adoption
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Ftfy
Pardon me, but I can't see your logic.
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Logic:

Premise1: Life/ Actual potential for life deservers respect
Premise2: A fetus is has an actual potential to become life
Conclusion: Premise1 + Premise2 = Abortion is not respecting life/ Actual potential for life

NB: Premise2: is based on the observation that pregnant women produce children. While men with sperm in testicles do not.

Maybe you should try something else. Your 'potential life' thing isn't getting you anywhere.
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It's got me here, and I'm happy with it.
 
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JulesMaximus said:
Wrong. Only exception is if the couple are married...then the guy should have some parental rights. Otherwise you shot your goo into her and you gave up all rights to your goo and what it might create. It is her body, neither you nor anybody else should be able to dictate what a woman does with her own body.
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Marriage = social contract, if your a father your a father regardless whether you have a contract with the mother.
 
neckarb said:
They do pre-empt life, but they also destroy actual potential for life. I.e. something that left to it will create life, contraceptives do not.
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Again, gametes are alive already before they fuse in conception, and you are a galactic moron.

Also, a fetus "left to it" will quite quickly die the same as any sperm or egg cell. It requires a willing woman to incubate it.
 
BoomerD said:
I have no problem with that.

I also don't LIKE abortions...in fact, I dislike them so much that I'll never get one. (but I won't stand in the way of a woman who believes it's her best option.)
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Can you rationalize why you feel that way? I can't explain it to myself. I blame my (semi) catholic upbringing, even though I was never religious; I only paid lip service to keep my grandma happy.
 
JohnOfSheffield said:
I don't think the ceremony of marriage gives you any more rights to the womans body than you had over it before the ceremony.

Parental rights exist when you are a parent, you don't become a parent until after birth so perhaps i misunderstood what you were saying?
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I'm saying if you are married and you knock up your wife you should have some say in whether she keeps the baby or not. I'm not sure what the law is regarding this, nor do I really care...I'm just speaking my own opinion here. Ultimately you cannot force her to do something she doesn't want to do but I'd think that you would have some say in the matter.

If you knock up a woman and you aren't married to her I don't think you have any rights as far as whether or not she aborts the fetus nor should you. Don't like it? Don't have unprotected sex with women you don't know or don't have a relationship with.

I agree on your second point though, you don't become a parent until the baby is born.
 
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Sure, I can rationalize it very well. It's not my body...I don't have to carry the child, I don't have to give birth. It's not my decision. If it's my wife...then I get to have an opinion...but I do NOT get to make the decision. I won't ever have an abortion because I can't get pregnant. (damn the luck...I could be a billionaire!!) 😛
 
neckarb said:
Marriage = social contract, if your a father your a father regardless whether you have a contract with the mother.
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Only once the child is born.

And I am a father. Here is a picture of my son about to perform a hundred post birth abortions.
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brainhulk said:
do you have trouble dealing with it after the fact? like have nightmares or go into depressive moods at times? how do you cope?
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Are you a guy or a girl? Did you get screwed over by your opinion not mattering or are you simply just dealing with the after-effects of your decision?
 
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