GOP Debate #1

[BonzaiDuck]

Bush & Walker looked the worse of the top tier, Trump was being Trump and Fox & the RNC were out to get him.

And that was your perception.

But Right-wing media, such as my local "Inland Empire" newspaper, is already starting to hype something else:

http://www.pe.com/articles/debate-776286-one-trump.html

I think if you DVR'd the debate as I did, it would pay off to go through the painstaking process of analyzing each question by "the Host."

You'd begin by defining what a "loaded question" or "straw man" question might look like.

As for the Perkins op-ed, note that I'd already suggested that oil-defense-state* candidates are well-represented in both categories -- the ones who made the cut for this debate, and the others slated for a later event. And Perkins suggests someone like Carly Fiorina getting vetted for a VP nomination.

Where's the PAC money coming from? That's just the first question.

As regards the newspaper and the local base, the front-page features a clip noting that Inland viewers favored Trump and Huckabee. The paper had been run out of a Dallas office-building until it was bought by the Orange County Register, and had been bolder in its promotion of Texas heavy-industry while featuring Leonard Pitts and other "liberal" op-ed writers in counterpoint. Today, there is no counterpoint. Of some 700,000 registered voters in the county served by the paper, the gap between party registrations is a mere 30,000 or so favoring the GOP.

Media matters. It just doesn't matter the way the cliché "Liberal Media" makes it seem to matter.

* Or oil-defense families with longer association with a big-oil state than the short-term resume' builder for having been a Florida governor.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

I predict that Carly Fiorina will get the VP nod.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I predict that Carly Fiorina will get the VP nod.

I guess nobody else sees it as much as I do. Palin came from a similar industrial influence in Alaska. California had always been big in the two industries going back to Doheny and Howard Hughes.

That's why I'm very upset today at the Citizens United decision, the creation of Super-PACs, and cockamamie arguments against disclosure in face of the FEC's original mission.

This trouble over the IRS pursuing some persecution of Republicans in the 501(c) debacle is a case in point. The Tea Party organizations could've had automatic tax-exempt status if they'd filed with FEC. But that whole process with the 501(c) approach was already corrupted by misinterpreting the statute going way back when, and advocacy groups like Sierra Club had already paved the way.

At least with full disclosure of contributors and contributions, the influence would be more apparent and could give a bit more thoughtful people some pause as to what they'd get by electing one candidate over another.

But some on the Hard Right seem blind about who has been paying their bills and bus-rides. No distinction between the "freedoms of the Koch brothers" and the freedoms of everyone else.

Historical analogies often raise my contempt. There's the old Neville Chamberlin story. You'll see comparisons today between Iran and N. Korea like comparing a cantaloupe to a Fava bean.

But there once was an organization called the Sturm Abteilung, or SA. If someone like Jeb gets the nomination, the Tea Party base (I THINK it is still there, isn't it?) will either turn out to vote for him anyway, or they won't. Either way -- they won't get their way. That's the only basis for any analogy with the Brown Shirts.

 

[alien42]

I predict that Carly Fiorina will get the VP nod.

highly likely, if the GOP have a white male as their candidate, the VP has to be some sort of minority. that's the only reason Sarah Palin was chosen.

 

[soundforbjt]

I predict that Carly Fiorina will get the VP nod.

I think it will be Kasich to help with Ohio. Fiorina looked too angry every time the camera was on her. Had zero personality...but it worked for Cheney.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Didn't have a chance to watch any yesterday... How did Rand do? Pretty much consider him our only chance =/

If they choose any other dipshit as the candidate I'll just fully pull for Bernie over anything else we have.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I like Kasich as well. But didn't get a chance to watch the debate...how did he do?

I thought he did well. Came across articulate with a cohesive message. Kept his focus on a positive, inclusive view of what he thinks the country needs to move forward successfully.

His answer to the question of what he would do if one of his children came out as gay was perfect I thought. THey are my children. I'd love them no matter what.

 

[soundforbjt]

Didn't have a chance to watch any yesterday... How did Rand do? Pretty much consider him our only chance =/

If they choose any other dipshit as the candidate I'll just fully pull for Bernie over anything else we have.

Rand did not score points last night. He has no chance of getting the nomination by his performance last night. He'll probably drop in the polls.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Rand did not score points last night. He has no chance of getting the nomination by his performance last night. He'll probably drop in the polls.

Yeah he did not come off well at all. He will fall out soon for sure.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Rand did not score points last night. He has no chance of getting the nomination by his performance last night. He'll probably drop in the polls.

I guess the only thing we can do is continue making our speculations as we wait and see. Even with him, the "state of origin" factor is blurred, given his father's history.

There's the old maxim "Don't visit the sins of the fathers on the sons."

But this is an election campaign for the highest office in the country still regarded as the most powerful in the world.

And the flow of money has a marvelous effect on all of it.

 

[Mxylplyx]

You know, if it wouldn't hand Republicans full control of Washington, I'd have no problem voting for Kasich. He just exemplifies competence and decency.

 

[jonks]

I predict that Carly Fiorina will get the VP nod.

Looks good on the surface, but what does she bring to the ticket? A political neophyte who lost the only prior election she ran in, isn't helpful in delivering any state, and can't get above 1% in polls.

 

[nageov3t]

Looks good on the surface, but what does she bring to the ticket? A political neophyte who lost the only prior election she ran in, isn't helpful in delivering any state, and can't get above 1% in polls.

historically, VP's have never been very useful in "delivering" states that the Presidential candidate wouldn't have won anyways... if anything, Fiorina would at least provide an attack dog against Hillary (if she's the Democratic nominee) who wouldn't be as easy to brand as a sexist as a male candidate.

 

[MongGrel]

I wasn't even going to watch it, but just from this thread I think I'll have to after the fact.

 

[MongGrel]

Who also said "my brother is my top Middle East advisor"

Scarey, isn't it ?

 

[Drako]

LOL @ Walker :awe:

“It’s sad to think right now, but probably the Russian and Chinese government know more about Hillary Clinton’s email server than do the members of the United States Congress.”

 

[MongGrel]

The thing with Rubio, sure maybe he made some progress within this debate format, this time, but as so many before him have done, next time Rubio might crash and burn.
And people will ask "what the hell happened to Rubio tonight?".
"Last time he was so much on point, and then ???? Ka-Boom".

If Rubio survives and Trump survives down to five or six, THEN we will see what they are truly made of.
Think of this as your first date.
You go home afterwards believing you made A GREAT impression.
Then... next date you piss her off, throw up on her new dress, and while backing out of her driveway in disgrace you run over her cat.

What comes to mind for me with Rubio is that weird sneaky look he made when Rubio gave that state if the union rebuttal back when.
That weird sneaky look on his face as he took a swig of bottled water.
No.... Rubio is definitely NOT presidential material.
This debate wasn't a test. It was a joke.

The bottom line is, what do they "believe" and what are their policy goals?
All of which they all, every single one of them, have in common.
Which are anti middle class and stuck back in the 1950's.

I've lived near Rubio too long, he shouldn't even be a consideration.

Jeb would be better than he.

 

[MongGrel]

That's why we got Hillary. Once she gets into office who do you think is going to be running the show? Bill!

I think this is one of the only times I've ever agreed with you.

Bill Clinton as the 1st First Husband would be interesting.

Cheney was basically running many things when Dubya was in office.

:sneaky:

 

[Strk]

historically, VP's have never been very useful in "delivering" states that the Presidential candidate wouldn't have won anyways... if anything, Fiorina would at least provide an attack dog against Hillary (if she's the Democratic nominee) who wouldn't be as easy to brand as a sexist as a male candidate.

Yeah, but I think they would just be interested in her being a she. I mean, what exactly did Palin bring to the table? She was the mayor of a tiny town and served a partial term as governor. But it was a female Republican.

 

[MongGrel]

I saw a bunch of blind men swinging clubs to try and hit an imaginary piñata.

:awe:

:biggrin:

 

[dank69]

Trump at the Roxbury:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fo7P1ERN5uY

 

[jonks]

I think this is one of the only times I've ever agreed with you.

Bill Clinton as the 1st First Husband would be interesting.

Cheney was basically running many things when Dubya was in office.

:sneaky:

Yeah, Hillary really strikes me as the type of subordinate and deferential person who would fight for decades to become president and then hand over all decisions to someone else....

 

[LegendKiller]

I loved the Huckabee argument that we don't spend enough money on defense because we're still flying the B52 and Carson's nonsensical recycled Romney talking point that the navy is weak because it's smaller than it was in the 1910s. Almost all the candidates wanted to do away with the sequester (for defense only) and increase the size of the military. Walker in particular exuded a brand blunt bellicosity that was creepy as fuck, probably extending from his weakness on foreign policy in general.

The only person who didn't come off as either totally insincere or flat out batshit crazy was Kasich. He'll be duly rewarded by being pushed aside with all possible speed by the party's base. Rubio did better than I expected but admittedly my bar was pretty low and he flat out lied about his record at least once plus made up some stats out of thin air.

Yeah, the whole b-52/navy/air force thing is ridiculous. I just shook my head and was amazed that anybody would say something so stupid and inane.

 

[MongGrel]

Yeah, Hillary really strikes me as the type of subordinate and deferential person who would fight for decades to become president and then hand over all decisions to someone else....

I'm sure she wouldn't...

Wasn't the point I was making to begin with I suppose.

 

[theeedude]

Trump at the Roxbury:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fo7P1ERN5uY

He MUST run as an independent if GOP doesn't nominate him. This MUST not stop with the primaries.