Good op-ed from David Brooks, "Dems, Please Don’t Drive Me Away"

[Jhhnn]

Heh. Concerned conservatrolls tell us to run the gay guy, because they'd vote him. You betcha.

 

[Jhhnn]

That’s a well thought response and I agree with a lot of what you say. Without labels of left and right and liberal or conservative I think you get at true answers from people. And when asking individual questions and scenarios to people you’ll also find they have their own unique thoughts and ideas on them as well. I wish politics could be driven more by individual topics and how best to address instead of siding with whatever the party line is on it, but that’s the stranglehold the two parties have (and frankly enjoy) on us.

Pathetic bothsides bullshit. If the poll is accurate, Dems vote for what they really want but a lot of Republicans obviously don't. The only explanation is tribalism.

 

[glenn1]

Heh. Concerned conservatrolls tell us to run the gay guy, because they'd vote him. You betcha.

Yep, you got us. It’s all just a long con job to get you to pick the guy. We thought about whether the smarter approach was to say we didn’t like him, or use the old reverse psychology and say we do like him. Smart cookie you are, you sussed us out. Hell, even the $100 donation I made to his campaign was just part of the act. Well played, @Jhhnn well played.

You run whoever you want. If you’re afraid you’ll lose because “th3 ghey” and don’t pick him for that reason then I guess it wasn’t meant to be. I’m sure the Dems have plenty other candidates who are Rhodes Scholars and war veterans on standby too that seem to be generating some support among voters who aren’t typically Dem supporters.

 

[Greenman]

Heh. Concerned conservatrolls tell us to run the gay guy, because they'd vote him. You betcha.

Odd that some folks are more concerned about where he puts his dick than how he'll run the country.

 

[glenn1]

Odd that some folks are more concerned about where he puts his dick than how he'll run the country.

I guess Dems like @Jhhnn have changed since the Bill Clinton days when it wasn’t a concern at all.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Odd that some folks are more concerned about where he puts his dick than how he'll run the country.

Honestly I don’t think his homosexuality would really matter. There will be some old people that would never vote for a gay man but they’d be voting Republican anyways. For moderates which is who the Dems need to win I don’t see it mattering much unless he brings it up and tries to make it some sort of issue, which I don’t see him doing. For the moment though he just seems like a well spoken thoughtful candidate which would contract greatly to Trump, and he seemed to keep his cool on stage also when a lot of the other candidates were being obnoxious.

 

[Jhhnn]

Honestly I don’t think his homosexuality would really matter.

Just because you preface a statement with "honestly" doesn't mean you're being honest.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Heh. Concerned conservatrolls tell us to run the gay guy, because they'd vote him. You betcha.

I was hoping the Democrats would run the veteran.

 

[glenn1]

Just because you preface a statement with "honestly" doesn't mean you're being honest.

Hey run the old white guy Biden if you think it will be more palatable to racist homophobes.

 

[Jhhnn]

Hey run the old white guy Biden if you think it will be more palatable to racist homophobes.

I'm sure he would be but we won't be running him, either.

 

[glenn1]

I'm sure he would be but we won't be running him, either.

So no gays, no women, no blacks... aren’t you running out of candidates? Or is the other old white guy (Sanders) who you’re looking to send up?

 

[UglyCasanova]

It does seem odd that I hear everyone talk about how age is a hinderance for Biden but I don’t really hear that about Sanders (who is older).

 

[Jhhnn]

So no gays, no women, no blacks... aren’t you running out of candidates? Or is the other old white guy (Sanders) who you’re looking to send up?

I didn't say any of that, did I?

 

[Jhhnn]

It does seem odd that I hear everyone talk about how age is a hinderance for Biden but I don’t really hear that about Sanders (who is older).

It's a hindrance for both of them.

 

[glenn1]

I didn't say any of that, did I?

Well you seem worried about running a gay guy, so it seems a black (or to a lesser degree, a woman) would have the same liability against bigoted voters. Is there some other young white (non-gay, that’s important) guy that you’re hiding somewhere ready to spring at just the right moment?

 

[Jhhnn]

Well you seem worried about running a gay guy, so it seems a black (or to a lesser degree, a woman) would have the same liability against bigoted voters. Is there some other young white (non-gay, that’s important) guy that you’re hiding somewhere ready to spring at just the right moment?

I'm not worried because Dems won't do it despite dishonest conservatives telling us what a great idea it would be.

 

[Greenman]

Honestly I don’t think his homosexuality would really matter. There will be some old people that would never vote for a gay man but they’d be voting Republican anyways. For moderates which is who the Dems need to win I don’t see it mattering much unless he brings it up and tries to make it some sort of issue, which I don’t see him doing. For the moment though he just seems like a well spoken thoughtful candidate which would contract greatly to Trump, and he seemed to keep his cool on stage also when a lot of the other candidates were being obnoxious.

I agree with all of that. I think the only reason he came out with that up front was to pull the teeth out of that particular rat before it could start nibbling on his toes. Pretty much everyone but farthest right got over gays a long time ago.

Edit: Just realized that you were responding to me saying pretty much what I just wrote here. We'll call this one a senior moment.

 

[Greenman]

I'm not worried because Dems won't do it despite dishonest conservatives telling us what a great idea it would be.

That's some serious paranoia you've got going on there.

 

[dank69]

The problem with this is that people are labeling themselves not quite based on how they react to polls but how they see themselves based on how they interpret a typical stereo typical Moderate, Conservative, and Liberal as being.

However if you poll people on the issues without bringing labels into the equation usually the poll results in most people poll answering the poll in the way a liberal leaning person or at the very least a moderate Liberal would answer poll.

According to this article
Most Americans Are Liberal, Even If They Don’t Know It


granted this article is a few years but we can still say that most of the polls are still less than 4 or 5 years old.

The Article contains links to all of the polls so you can see. And it's a fairly lengthy list of issues From Taxes to Workers Rights to Social programs...


Some examples to which (as stated previously) you can find the link within the article to the supporting poll.

• 82 percent of Americans think wealthy people have too much power and influence in Washington.
• 59 percent of Americans—and 43 percent of Republicans—think corporations make “too much profit.”
• 66 percent of Americans think money and wealth should be distributed more evenly.
• 96 percent of Americans—including 96 percent of Republicans—believe money in politics is to blame for the dysfunction of the U.S. political system.
• 78 percent think some wealthy people don’t pay their fair share of taxes.
• 87 percent of Americans say it is critical to preserve Social Security, even if it means increasing Social Security taxes paid by wealthy Americans.
• 76 percent believe the wealthiest Americans should pay higher taxes.
• 61 percent of Americans—including 42 percent of Republicans—approve of labor unions.
• 74 percent of registered voters—including 71 percent of Republicans—support requiring employers to offer paid parental and medical leave.
• 60 percent of registered voters favor “expanding Medicare to provide health insurance to every American.”
• 60 percent of Americans believe “it is the federal government’s responsibility to make sure all Americans have healthcare coverage.”
• 76 percent of voters are “very concerned” or “somewhat concerned” about climate change.
• 77 percent of gun owners support requiring background checks for all gun buyers.
• 65 percent of Americans—including 42 percent of Republicans—say immigrants strengthen the country “because of their hard work and talents.”
• 58 percent of Americans believe that abortion should be legal in all or most cases.
• 62 percent of Americans—including 70 percent of independents and 40 percent of Republicans—support same-sex marriage.

So based on the above examples of how people tend to answer polls on the individual issues (instead of how people see themselves on a political spectrum) a fair majority of people are arguably more liberal than they tend to believe and based on that I believe that a candidate who promotes liberal/populist ideas can bring in Moderate/Independent voters as well as the Base of the Democratic Party.
As long as that candidate actually believes in his or her positions (aka is not just pandering) and can articulate well why they believe in those positions

That is my hypothesis based on how people answer polls on separate issues without asking them about political labels

Remember Trump acted like a populist (he was lying of course). While his opponent planted her flag squarely in just left of center (mostly) political positions in regards to economics.

OP based on David Brooks' statements I believe that he, like most people answering the label polls, are paying more attention to the labels rather than the issues.



_____________

This is why I laugh at people who claim to be independent. They are only independent because they have been conditioned from birth to hate Democrats. They agree with Democrats on almost every issue right up until they find out that Democrats support their preferred policy. Then the shame they feel for being a liberal kicks in and they'll search for and accept any garbage excuse they can find from conservative media to stop supporting that policy.

 

[glenn1]

That's some serious paranoia you've got going on there.

You simply misunderstand what motivates him. Which is 100% exclusively his hatred of the rich and burning desire for higher taxes on them. He’ll say it’s because Mayor Pete is gay but it’s really that Buttigieg hasn’t promised tax increases on the rich as high as those by Sanders and Warren. Perhaps he will but so far it hasn’t been his major theme. @Jhhnn would have been perfectly fine voting Trump had he run as Dem if the rest of his platform including immigration, etc was the same but he promised to tax the rich more. His “core” political principles are really that shallow.

 

[cytg111]

Honestly..........

Yeeeeaaaaa ...... sure thing buddy.

 

[cytg111]

That's some serious paranoia you've got going on there.

The people that is actively rooting for Trump/PENCE *right now*, is telling us that they think Pete should be the dem pick.... cause then they may switch sides? UC is a confessed Trumpster, before and RIGHT now.
Ulterior motive detected at 99.95%.
And lets be honest, to be a Trumpster is a level of Anarchist.

 

[sandorski]

You simply misunderstand what motivates him. Which is 100% exclusively his hatred of the rich and burning desire for higher taxes on them. He’ll say it’s because Mayor Pete is gay but it’s really that Buttigieg hasn’t promised tax increases on the rich as high as those by Sanders and Warren. Perhaps he will but so far it hasn’t been his major theme. @Jhhnn would have been perfectly fine voting Trump had he run as Dem if the rest of his platform including immigration, etc was the same but he promised to tax the rich more. His “core” political principles are really that shallow.

Excuse me, but are you aware that you're stuck in a fucktardery bubble?

 

[zinfamous]

That I'm


Pro abortion
Pro environmental regulation including major investments in renewable energy
Anti tax cuts, although my reasons probably don’t line up with the lefts reasons
Pro women’s rights
Pro education and investments in it, just not pro free college (see my other thread)
Pro universal pre-k
Pro net neutrality
Anti war
Pro marijuana legalization (does that mean lean left?)
Pro tax reform and anti loopholes. Do that and I wouldn’t mind higher rates
Pro gay rights
Pro military spending cuts (massively)

I don't know anyone that is actually "pro abortion."

what a weird tucking thing to claim to be.

 

[Jhhnn]

That's some serious paranoia you've got going on there.

As if you or Glenn actually support Buttigieg's policy positions. From Wikipedia-

On April 14, 2019, Buttigieg announced his campaign for the Democratic nomination for president of the United States in 2020, after having formed an exploratory committee in January 2019.[7][8][9] His platform includes support for universal healthcare, reducing income inequality, pro-environmental policies, dialogue and cooperation between the Democratic Party and organized labor, universal background checks for firearms purchases, the Equality Act, and preserving the DACA program for children of illegal immigrants. Buttigieg also supports reforms that would end gerrymandering, overturn the Citizens United v. FEC decision, and abolish the Electoral College