GeForce Titan coming end of February

[tviceman]

Its a given it will be hot and loud. Its got too many transistors making it good for HPC to be an efficient gaming card, and the price. But still it will be the fastest single card despite its drawbacks and that is ultimately what a buyer of this card is looking for.

Nvidia's reference designs since the gtx480/470 debacle have been increasingly better and quieter than AMD's. Why would this be any different? GF110 had plenty of transistors dedicated to HPC to be an efficient gaming card, yet the much smaller hd6970 was only about 10% more efficient in perf/watt http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6970/30.html. Furthermore, AMD sucks at making coolers that are actually worth a damn dissipating less heat but unable to be quieter http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/24 http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6970/28.html

Really it's been AMD's reference cards that have been abysmal vs. Nvidia's in cooling and noise for some 2+ years now.

 

[tviceman]

2 Ghz? Jesus.

That would imply the Titan is 75-80%+ faster than HD7970Ghz. At 1328mhz HD7970 is ~21-33% faster than a GTX680. I find this claim hard to believe. That would make the card way faster than a GTX690.

I hope I don't do anything stupid come release time....

Just like with every new flagship launch (except maybe GK104, since everyone expected that to be slower out of the gate than hd7970) expectations are getting out of hand now.

 

[tviceman]

I was wondering, since the Titan doesn't seem to be part of the 600 or a possible 700 series does anyone think that "Titan" will be a new high-end brand, similar or a one-off?

As long as Nvidia continues to make much bigger dies than AMD, and can create a performance delta >=35% over AMD's best single card, then yes I think Nvidia will continue this type of super high end halo product.

 

[Nintendesert]

I figure these halo cards simply build brand name for Nvidia. It trickles down to the rest of the cards in the lineup. I can't wait to see the performance but the price will keep me using my 680, that and no good games with great graphics are on the horizons. Hopefully that changes when the PS4/Xbox6000 hit, as sad as that is for us PC gamers.

 

[Elfear]

Nvidia's reference designs since the gtx480/470 debacle have been increasingly better and quieter than AMD's.

Nvidia's coolers have generally been better designed than AMD's but I wouldn't include the whole reference design in that statement of "better". AMD's PCBs have been more robust except for a few exceptions (GTX 480 and 580 were pretty robust). The dinky 670/680 reference PCBs were pretty weak IMO.

 

[n0x1ous]

Nvidia's coolers have generally been better designed than AMD's but I wouldn't include the whole reference design in that statement of "better". AMD's PCBs have been more robust except for a few exceptions (GTX 480 and 580 were pretty robust). The dinky 670/680 reference PCBs were pretty weak IMO.

Yes I think this better describes things. I would expect Titan's PCB to be of the "more robust" nature due to chip size, memory size, and power draw compared to GK104

 

[RussianSensation]

Really it's been AMD's reference cards that have been abysmal vs. Nvidia's in cooling and noise for some 2+ years now.

The reference design term here wrt to the Titan should be used carefully. GTX690 "reference cooler" and fan quality are not at all similar to GTX470/480/570/580 coolers. The cooler on my 6950 was superior to the 470 in noise levels and performance at full load but NV's actual fan is higher quality since it sounds much quieter at higher RPMs. I haven't used 570/580 cards so I cannot comment. The Titan's "reference cooler" is probably going to be very high quality, similar to after-market coolers and likely twice as expensive as the coolers on reference 570/580 cards.

The main advantage in NV's reference and AMD's reference cards in the last 2 years has been the fan, not really the heatsink.

GTX570 reference heatsink with vapor chamber

HD6970 reference heatsink with vapor chamber

GTX690 was different - it used significantly higher quality heatsinks and fans than used on 570/6970s

The quality of the heatsink fins is at Thermalright Archon / Prolimatech Megahalems level and the fan bearings are much higher quality than used in standard reference AMD/NV cards. NV could utilize a similar design to the EVGA Classified 680 but replace that cheap heatsink with similar quality used on the 690. With a much larger fan, the card would be quiet.

 

[tviceman]

The cooler on my 6950 was superior to the 470 in noise levels and performance at full load but NV's actual fan is higher quality

Yeah I said since the 470.

Nvidia's reference designs since the gtx480/470 debacle have been increasingly better and quieter than AMD's.

 

[Elfear]

Yes I think this better describes things. I would expect Titan's PCB to be of the "more robust" nature due to chip size, memory size, and power draw compared to GK104

I expect the same thing especially if TDP turns out to match the rumors of 235-250W.

 

[wand3r3r]

The GTX 690 was neither cool nor very quiet compared to any custom cooled card in the latest generation(s) that I've owned. (lightning, DCUII, etc)

Granted I haven't used a true 'reference' cooler for years.

 

[SirPauly]

Personally like the differentiation offered by the AIB's for a modest premium.

 

[MrK6]

I thought it was pretty simple. That was an anticipation of arguments AMD fans will pose against Titan after launch.
Titan will be a big hungry die, and folks like you might like to exploit that fact.
I can understand your antagonistic response above because the wind is already been taken out of your sails and that can be frustrating.
Pretty simple, no?

I'll comment on its strengths and weaknesses like I would any other card. Also I would avoid the personal attacks. Unless you try to maintain some level of maturity when interacting on the forums, your marketing crusade will be pointless. :thumbsup:

I expect the same thing especially if TDP turns out to match the rumors of 235-250W.

I think nvidia has experience here considering the lash back after the GTX 400 series coolers. They improved the designs with the 500 series, but the 600 series' lower TDP didn't really stress HSF designs as much I would suspect. If they keep the TDP low with lower clock speeds, they could easily get away with lower sound output at stock operation.

 

[blackened23]

The GTX 690 was neither cool nor very quiet compared to any custom cooled card in the latest generation(s) that I've owned. (lightning, DCUII, etc)

Granted I haven't used a true 'reference' cooler for years.

To be fair, it's by far the best design ever created for a single card dual GPU setup. If you compare the 690 to the 590, 6990, etc - the 690 is far better. That being said, my beef with the 690 was mostly related to the relative lack of overclocking (due to 70C throttle, high temps, lack of over-voltage, etc) but the card itself was great. If I didn't care about high overclocks I would have kept it; I guess I just kept going back to the fact that the 690 as a single card solution wasn't worth it in comparison to the much higher performing 680 lightning x2.

 

[tviceman]

The GTX 690 was neither cool nor very quiet compared to any custom cooled card in the latest generation(s) that I've owned. (lightning, DCUII, etc)

Granted I haven't used a true 'reference' cooler for years.

That is because your lightning and DCUII cards have open air coolers with multiple fans, meaning they aren't exhausting/directing any of the air outside of the case. Reference designs cooling cards with 100's of watts of dissipating heat need to vent at least half of the air outside.

Compare nvidia's gtx690 to anything high end from AMD's reference designs. It's quieter than AMD's reference hd7970 cooler, night & day quieter than AMD's 6990 and 7990.

 

[Hauk]

@ Russian,

Good points on nV cooler design. They'll likely go back to a GTX 580 style:
http://pcper.com/images/reviews/1034/inside1.jpg
perhaps extending the heatsink towards the fan for additional surface area. My guess, typical stuff, temps in the mid 80's with fan ramping to ~60% under load yielding tolerable noise levels.

 

[MrK6]

That is because your lightning and DCUII cards have open air coolers with multiple fans, meaning they aren't exhausting/directing any of the air outside of the case. Reference designs cooling cards with 100's of watts of dissipating heat need to vent at least half of the air outside.

Compare nvidia's gtx690 to anything high end from AMD's reference designs. It's quieter than AMD's reference hd7970 cooler, night & day quieter than AMD's 6990 and 7990.

That's because it's an axial fan which is quieter and moves less air by design. Whatever design nvidia chooses will greatly affect the sonic signature.

 

[Keysplayr]

I liked the Vapour Chamber design used on the 580. That is a quiet cooler.

 

[Zanovar]

I liked the Vapour Chamber design used on the 580. That is a quiet cooler.

Im quite impressed with the noise/cooling with this giga,the older i get the less noise i seem to be im willing to put up with.kind of want to try wc but i may fook it up hahah

 

[RussianSensation]

The GTX 690 was neither cool nor very quiet compared to any custom cooled card in the latest generation(s) that I've owned. (lightning, DCUII, etc)

In relation to its 274W power consumption, it was quiet considering the GTX680 peaks at 186W and is hardly quieter.

Yeah I said since the 470.

HD7970 is longer than GTX680 and its heatsink is larger in size. Both have vapor chambers. Both cards have nearly equal thickness. That means the heatsink on the 7970 has a larger surface area. How can the heatsink on the 680 be superior? It's the fan that continues to be the greatest downfall on reference AMD cards. If you ever were to compare the noise levels at idle, you can force the AMD fan to spin at 45% and it'll sound WAY louder than an NV fan at 70%. Since the heatsink is not stressed in any way, that allows you to isolate that the fan/bearings are the biggest differences in the heatsink designs. I have no idea why AMD continues to use their reference fan generation after generation.

GTX680

HD7970

Most of us don't bother getting reference cards since they are inferior to after-market cards in nearly every way - component quality, noise levels, overclocking headroom, temperature, etc. The few circumstances (very small case with poor airflow or Tri-SLI/CF or waterblocks) is where the reference design shows its greatest strengths. If you were to replace the GTX690's heatsink with something like this, it would blow the 690's reference design out of the water. For anyone serious about overclocking their cards, while NV's reference noise levels are decent, the heatsink is still garbage overall. Once you move to reference 670, the heatsink design is a cruel joke. The reason it stays relatively quiet is because the card only uses 152W of power in games. If that card drew as much power as the 7970, it would have sounded like a jet engine taking off.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

670 is a cut mid-range card, it's cooler is more than enough to cool such a dinky card.

 

[Zanovar]

670 is a cut mid-range card, it's cooler is more than enough to cool such a dinky card.

You still might possibly buy it though?*grins*

 

[SirPauly]

670 is a cut mid-range card, it's cooler is more than enough to cool such a dinky card.

What the GK-104 reminds me of is the G-92 and G-71.

 

[RussianSensation]

670 is a cut mid-range card, it's cooler is more than enough to cool such a dinky card.

That's why the statement that NV universally has superior reference coolers is not entirely true. NV's key advantages in heatsink design are fan and superior performance/watt (esp. with Kepler).

 

[parvadomus]

I cant believe ppl discuss about "reference" coolers/heatsinks/fans etc.

 

[RussianSensation]

I cant believe ppl discuss about "reference" coolers/heatsinks/fans etc.

Because the perpetuated myth that blower coolers are more preferable continues. A lot of DIY PC enthusiasts still do not understand the importance of good case airflow and then complain their after-market cards run hot and loud because their case can't dissipate 270W of power. AMD and NV are then forced to make reference blower designs that account for these users' stubbornness of getting a modern case with good airflow, instead of going with an open-air design right off the bat.

A very good open air design can give 20-30*C of headroom. You could just lower the fan speeds and have a whisper quiet card. With a reference blower card you are pretty much stuck with a loud solution from the beginning. If you start overclocking and overvolting on reference blower cards, good luck!