First called B.1.1.529, was named the Omicron variant of Covid-19

[weblooker2021]

Tribal identity doesn't mean you love Trump, you clearly align with a larger conservative tribal identity that is anti-vaccine. People don't like to admit they are motivated by tribal affiliations but we all are, and in this case it's causing you to reject science and put your own health in danger for no reason.

You're not going to admit that tribalism is what's pushing you do do this, I'm sure you'll continue to claim it's because you've 'done your own research', which largely amounts to talking to other people in your tribe.

I have friends on both side of the spectrum when it comes to vaccination. Some of them gotten booster the second they possible could and yet they are still being very cautious, do not go out much etc. Others never gotten vaccinated and they never stayed at home, been traveling during peak of 2020 infection and don't care to hear about vaccination at all. I guess it's true that i see those that are fully vaccinated+plus booster still staying at home and i ask what is the point in that case. On the other hand i also see friends with no vaccine at all and enjoying their life to the fullest

If you, like most people, got their second dose >6mo ago, you're effectively unvaccinated at this time.

This i will have to disagree with you completely. Just because someone gotten vaccinated over 6 months ago, it do not mean they are completely unvaccinated. It's true their protection is much lower but they are still protected against severe version of Covid. If what you're suggesting is true, then the world must get vaccinated against Covid every 6 months for the rest of their life.

 

[K1052]

This i will have to disagree with you completely. Just because someone gotten vaccinated over 6 months ago, it do not mean they are completely unvaccinated. It's true their protection is much lower but they are still protected against severe version of Covid. If what you're suggesting is true, then the world must get vaccinated against Covid every 6 months for the rest of their life.

Israel found waining protection from severe disease, not just infection. Care to try again?

 

[fskimospy]

I have friends on both side of the spectrum when it comes to vaccination. Some of them gotten booster the second they possible could and yet they are still being very cautious, do not go out much etc. Others never gotten vaccinated and they never stayed at home, been traveling during peak of 2020 infection and don't care to hear about vaccination at all. I guess it's true that i see those that are fully vaccinated+plus booster still staying at home and i ask what is the point in that case. On the other hand i also see friends with no vaccine at all and enjoying their life to the fullest.

I'm not sure if you understand what tribalism is. Just because you have friends outside of your tribe doesn't change the fact that you identify with the right wing tribe and that your tribal affiliation makes you irrationally vaccine hesitant. For example I'm tribally affiliated with liberal people but have a number of friends who are conservative.

It's true that some liberal people have reacted to covid irrationally as well, as staying home to protect yourself when fully vaccinated is similarly irrational to your unvaccinated friends, just the other way, but that's not really relevant to the conversation.

This i will have to disagree with you completely. Just because someone gotten vaccinated over 6 months ago, it do not mean they are completely unvaccinated. It's true their protection is much lower but they are still protected against severe version of Covid. If what you're suggesting is true, then the world must get vaccinated against Covid every 6 months for the rest of their life.

While I agree that it's not true that your protection is as low as someone who is unvaccinated, it's still likely considerably lower than it once was.

As far as boosters every 6 months or so indefinitely that seems like a possibility. Who cares though? That's about the tiniest imposition possible, it's common sense.

 

[fskimospy]

It's really weird how people think 'you might have to get vaccinated for the rest of your life!' is some kind of killer argument. Like, who cares about getting a shot? Are we six?

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

This i will have to disagree with you completely. Just because someone gotten vaccinated over 6 months ago, it do not mean they are completely unvaccinated. It's true their protection is much lower but they are still protected against severe version of Covid. If what you're suggesting is true, then the world must get vaccinated against Covid every 6 months for the rest of their life.

Yeah, that's kind of the reason scientists were absolutely losing their shit at the beginning of this, trying to get everyone to stay the fuck inside and not let this turn into a global pandemic, because it would mean precisely what you said, that we're looking at 6mo boosters for life. At that early point, they didn't know what the efficacy of the vaccines would be, but they would require global, routine vaccinations to keep this under control, just as we do with the flu, and a multitude of other diseases.

EDIT: Also:

COVID-19 Vaccines

Vaccines are seen as one of the best ways to stop COVID-19. Learn more about the types of vaccines, including the newly approved Novavax.

www.webmd.com

The Moderna two-dose vaccine went from being 89% effective in March to 58% effective in September, according to a story about the study in theLos Angeles Times.

Meanwhile, the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine went from being 87% effective to 45% effective over the same time period.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine showed the biggest drop -- from 86% effectiveness to 13% over those 6 months.

So best case, you're at 58% effectiveness after 6mo. Worst, 13%. I'd not take my own chances below 75%, so 6mo jabs for life it is.

 

[K1052]

On the every 6 months front it could turn out that a three dose series confers much more durable immunity. We'll have to wait to see.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

On the every 6 months front it could turn out that a three dose series confers much more durable immunity. We'll have to wait to see.

Another worrisome component is COVID-19's variant mutation speed. We've had 5 major variants in about a year and a half, that's a cadence that even if you have a 'durable' vaccine regime, it might just simply get outpaced by mutation rates.

 

[Sunburn74]

Another worrisome component is COVID-19's variant mutation speed. We've had 5 major variants in about a year and a half, that's a cadence that even if you have a 'durable' vaccine regime, it might just simply get outpaced by mutation rates.

Mutations are occurring largely due to the lack of herd immunity. Same thing will happen if you develop a COVID pill. If everyone isn't vaccinated, you're only going to perpetually select out variants that are resistant to the incomplete measures you're using to try and control the spread of the disease.

One of the reasons South Africa seems to be the hotbed for mutations is its high unvaccinated HIV+ population. These individuals can actively harbor the virus for 2/3 of a year and it makes for a perfect environment for mutations to occur over and over and over. You would think the world would respond by trying to vaccinate South Africa but instead the response has largely been ineffective travel bans and anti-vaccine propaganda.

 

[Jaskalas]

If you, like most people, got their second dose >6mo ago, you're effectively unvaccinated at this time.

???
The immune response improves with each exposure. Both antibody levels and T cell response will remain higher than the unvaccinated.
Of course antibody levels fall off months after exposure, but improved health outcomes remain.

Those who have had Vaccines AND Delta, will have an ever stronger response. I eagerly look forward to studies on the protection that provides, and just how much that falls off over time. Hopefully it is not confused or mixed in with booster results.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

???
The immune response improves with each exposure. Both antibody levels and T cell response will remain higher than the unvaccinated.
Of course antibody levels fall off months after exposure, but improved health outcomes remain.

Those who have had Vaccines AND Delta, will have an ever stronger response. I eagerly look forward to studies on the protection that provides, and just how much that falls off over time. Hopefully it is not confused or mixed in with booster results.

Only to a degree. The vaccine mfgs themselves already submitted numbers for that, maybe it'll be better with boosters but I'm not holding my breath for 1y+ of reasonable (75%+) protection.

 

[DaaQ]

???
The immune response improves with each exposure. Both antibody levels and T cell response will remain higher than the unvaccinated.
Of course antibody levels fall off months after exposure, but improved health outcomes remain.

Those who have had Vaccines AND Delta, will have an ever stronger response. I eagerly look forward to studies on the protection that provides, and just how much that falls off over time. Hopefully it is not confused or mixed in with booster results.

I think I fall into this category, are they paying for the studies? Have not gotten a booster yet, I am just about due.

If there is compensation for studies, link them up please. I am no longer in the middle class.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

At this point, get your vaccine, get your booster, let's get on with life. Covid-19 has gone flu. It's endemic to the population now.

Vaccines don't even stop transmission, but they prevent hospitalization and death, so all this news about "case rates" is starting to feel kinda BS as death rates remain extremely low.

Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

 

[DaaQ]

And at this point that is a sacrifice I am willing to make if paid handsomely for it, so my granddaughters and wife are well taken care of for it.
So links?

 

[weblooker2021]

At this point, get your vaccine, get your booster, let's get on with life. Covid-19 has gone flu. It's endemic to the population now.

Vaccines don't even stop transmission, but they prevent hospitalization and death, so all this news about "case rates" is starting to feel kinda BS as death rates remain extremely low.

Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

We got no idea if booster will do anything against Omicron. We don't even know if it's even serious mutation or if it's overblown concern.

 

[conehead433]

Reports from South Africa seem to suggest that omicron is not any worse than delta except that it seems to be even more transmissible. Overblown reaction maybe. But this type of reaction is what was needed when Covid first appeared. It didn't help for us to have an idiot-in-chief who dismissed it as 'just like the flu', and didn't want to alarm anyone because of popularity points.

 

[pmv]

Reports from South Africa seem to suggest that omicron is not any worse than delta except that it seems to be even more transmissible. Overblown reaction maybe. But this type of reaction is what was needed when Covid first appeared. It didn't help for us to have an idiot-in-chief who dismissed it as 'just like the flu', and didn't want to alarm anyone because of popularity points.

If it's significantly more transmissible, then even if's not worse, it could still push health systems over a cliff edge, surely?

The rate of growth of new infections in SA is looking a bit worrying. Be interesting to see how it goes over the next few days.

Omicron seems to carry higher Covid reinfection risk, says South Africa

Scientists warn of higher rate of repeat infections but say vaccines appear to protect against serious illness

www.theguardian.com

The Omicron variant of Covid-19 appears to be reinfecting people at a higher rate than previous strains, experts in South Africa have said, as public health officials and scientists from around the world closely monitor developments in the country where Omicron was first identified.

As the EU’s public health agency warned that Omicron could cause more than half of all new Covid infections in Europe within the next few months, evidence was emerging, however, that vaccines still appear to offer protection against serious illness.



“We believe that previous infection does not provide protection from Omicron,” said Anne von Gottberg, an expert at the National Institute for Communicable Diseases in South Africa.

In mid-November South Africa was reporting about 300 Covid cases a day. On Wednesday it reported 8,561 new cases, up from 4,373 the day before and 2,273 on Monday.

 

[SMOGZINN]

We got no idea if booster will do anything against Omicron. We don't even know if it's even serious mutation or if it's overblown concern.

So you do a Cost/Benefit analysis.

Cost: A few seconds of pain, and maybe a day of discomfort.
Benefit: You might be saved from dyeing (low probability outcome), you might be saved from being miserable for 2 weeks (high probability outcome), or it might do nothing (low-medium probability outcome).

Analysis: The cost is relatively minor, but the benefit could be potentially high. Even if it is completely useless against Omicron, it will still improve your protection against Delta which is still of concern, and If Omicron is as bad as Delta or worse, and the vaccine works against it even some, it will still significantly improve your odds against it.

Conclusion: Since the cost is so low, and the benefit so high, and the moderate bad outcome (being sick for two weeks) is very common, the booster is worth more then the cost. At worst you are trading a day of your choosing of feeling moderately bad for two random weeks of feeling miserable.

 

[Pohemi]

I am not religious at all , i consider myself atheist . My decision not to get vaccinated got absolutely nothing to do with religion

The tribalism you subscribe to is no different than how religious whackjobs justify and rationalize their thinking and feels. You prefer and base decisions for yourself and immediate family on heresay and rhetoric over widely-accepted medical and scientific data. Far from "educated decisions".

We got no idea if booster will do anything against Omicron. We don't even know if it's even serious mutation or if it's overblown concern.

So you do a Cost/Benefit analysis.

Using logic would destroy his FUD though, and that's what he's all about. His comment you replied to is just the latest example of it.

 

[WelshBloke]

We got no idea if booster will do anything against Omicron. We don't even know if it's even serious mutation or if it's overblown concern.

Clearly we should do nothing for 6 months or so and see what happens then!

🙄

Fucking idiot.

 

[Amused]

We got no idea if booster will do anything against Omicron. We don't even know if it's even serious mutation or if it's overblown concern.

A booster cannot hurt you. It will only strengthen your immune system.

That is the logic behind the boosters. And, yet again it is recommended by every single immunologist, virologist, epidemiologist and 99.99% of MDs IN EVERY COUNTRY ON EARTH.

Including your own family doctor.

There is literally no VALID reason NOT to get one other than the minor inconvenience of getting it.

 

[uallas5]

Reports from South Africa seem to suggest that omicron is not any worse than delta except that it seems to be even more transmissible. Overblown reaction maybe. But this type of reaction is what was needed when Covid first appeared. It didn't help for us to have an idiot-in-chief who dismissed it as 'just like the flu', and didn't want to alarm anyone because of popularity points.

If it's more transmissible than IT IS worse.

It may not be deadlier to an INDIVIDUAL but if more people can catch it, it's deadlier to a POPULATION. I seriously don't get why people don't see that.

 

[fskimospy]

The tribalism you subscribe to is no different than how religious whackjobs justify and rationalize their thinking and feels. You prefer and base decisions for yourself and immediate family on heresay and rhetoric over widely-accepted medical and scientific data. Far from "educated decisions".


Using logic would destroy his FUD though, and that's what he's all about. His comment you replied to is just the latest example of it.

I find it funny that self described atheists don’t realize they are engaging in the same behaviors as the religious people they think are so misled.

 

[weblooker2021]

If it's more transmissible than IT IS worse.

It may not be deadlier to an INDIVIDUAL but if more people can catch it, it's deadlier to a POPULATION. I seriously don't get why people don't see that.

More transmittable, less deadly is actually a good thing. If Covid becomes less deadly and spreads more seasonally, it will really be another flu.

 

[Pohemi]

More transmittable, less deadly is actually a good thing. If Covid becomes less deadly and spreads more seasonally, it will really be another flu.

We've already seen your medical knowledge and logic. Go back to the kid's table, and shut the fuck up.

 

[MichaelMay]

More transmittable, less deadly is actually a good thing. If Covid becomes less deadly and spreads more seasonally, it will really be another flu.

This variant is not known to be either more transmittable and nor less lethal.

Why would you state that? What is WRONG with you?