Fermi's already have significant price drops

[Skurge]

They actually sell quite well:
http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

Well if you wanna believe steam survey, then people are buying more GTX200 cards than GTX480/470

nice to see windows 7 almost overtaking XP

 

[nenforcer]

Nobody purchase any of these cards until the GTX 460 is unveiled next week on July 12th.

 

[StrangerGuy]

Low supply...

Even lower demand!

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Monday I get my GTX 480, shipped from a forum member total = 420$ woo hoo! EVGA too! still in shrink wrap!

 

[nyker96]

I believe the upcoming gtx 465 should be the one that puts some price pressure on ATI. It suppose to be smaller and runs quite a bit cooler than older 4xx series. designed with power consumption in mind and performance rumors to be quite high and price will be in 200s or lower. I hope all this turns out to be true since ati's 57xx series is pretty crapy, needs a nice NV competitor in that sector.

 

[hiddensniper11]

I believe the upcoming gtx 465 should be the one that puts some price pressure on ATI. It suppose to be smaller and runs quite a bit cooler than older 4xx series. designed with power consumption in mind and performance rumors to be quite high and price will be in 200s or lower. I hope all this turns out to be true since ati's 57xx series is pretty crapy, needs a nice NV competitor in that sector.

ATI will eventually reduce the price of their cards to compete if they can't win in terms of raw speed.

I wouldn't want either to be much better than the other, less competition = less price drops.

 

[Lonbjerg]

You're still trying to suggest the Steam hardware survey reflects sales? Really?

You find me a better sample size of how the market of gamers are currently, then we can talk.

GTX470 3%
GTX480 3%
HD5800 38%
HD5700 38%

So if Fermi sells "quite well", then Cypress sells "quite well times 10"!

Subtract the +6 months lead, before you make such a claim.
Infact this makes you look untruthfull:

NVIDIA's DX11 marketshare grew with 2.1%
AMD's DX11 markretshare dropped by 2.11%

Well if you wanna believe steam survey, then people are buying more GTX200 cards than GTX480/470

Lots of people still buying GT200's..and?
Dosn't alter that in DX11, NVIDIA is making a move...on the cost of AMD.

nice to see windows 7 almost overtaking XP

Now we just need 32 bit to die then

Observation:
Some people have a hard time accepting the fact that NVIDIA expanding it DX11 market share...and that the trend has been growing for the last 3 months :hmm:

Wonder what the excuse will be when the GTX465/460 hits?

 

[GaiaHunter]

You find me a better sample size of how the market of gamers are currently, then we can talk.



Subtract the +6 months lead, before you make such a claim.
Infact this makes you look untruthfull:

NVIDIA's DX11 marketshare grew with 2.1%
AMD's DX11 markretshare dropped by 2.11%



Lots of people still buying GT200's..and?
Dosn't alter that in DX11, NVIDIA is making a move...on the cost of AMD.



Now we just need 32 bit to die then

Observation:
Some people have a hard time accepting the fact that NVIDIA expanding it DX11 market share...and that the trend has been growing for the last 3 months :hmm:

Wonder what the excuse will be when the GTX465/460 hits?

You are still using the same silly example?

Didn't we already went through this in a past thread - 5800 series is still selling, on the worst case, 1:1 with NVIDIA GTX 470/480.

I can brake the numbers in a bit again.

 

[tincart]

Observation:
Some people have a hard time accepting the fact that NVIDIA expanding it DX11 market share...and that the trend has been growing for the last 3 months :hmm:

Wonder what the excuse will be when the GTX465/460 hits?

Finally bringing DX11 products to market will do that. It's rather easy to expand your market share when, not too long ago, it was nil.

 

[Lonbjerg]

You are still using the same silly example?

Didn't we already went through this in a past thread - 5800 series is still selling, on the worst case, 1:1 with NVIDIA GTX 470/480.

I can brake the numbers in a bit again.

No it's not, if it where breaking even, NVIDIA's total share wouldn't be growing:
GTX480:
April: 0.44%
May: 1.89%
June: 2.76%

GTX470:
April: 0.65%
May: 1.81%
June: 3.04%

NVIDIA's highend is selling more than AMD's lowend.
The arrival of GTX465/460 will only bolster that fact.

But please...run the numbers

 

[Tempered81]

No it's not, if it where breaking even, NVIDIA's total share wouldn't be growing:
GTX480:
April: 0.44%
May: 1.89%
June: 2.76%

GTX470:
April: 0.65%
May: 1.81%
June: 3.04%

NVIDIA's highend is selling more than AMD's lowend.
The arrival of GTX465/460 will only bolster that fact.

But please...run the numbers

You can tell yourself whatever you'd like to make you imagine Nvidia is doing well with "Fermi". However from the link you've provided, Steam's hardware survey shows that for every 2 gamers out there with a GTX470 or GTX480, there are 25 gamers with ATI Radeon HD5700's or HD5800's.

That's not just a staggering lead, that is being completely crushed my friend.

 

[PingviN]

"Fermi is so expensive because supply is limited"; "Fermi = fail"

"Fermi price is going down; stores can't sell them"; "Fermi = fail"

LOL

Apparantly Nvidia is always wrong with their pricing?

I don't think we're on the same page here.

Fermi was obviously too expensive to begin with, hence the cut - correct?
A way to fix this would be lowering the pricing - correct?
The high price is probably due to high manufacturing costs - correct?

You see, it's really not a contradiction here. Nvidia is NOT the same as retailers of Nvidia GPUs.

I think Fermi is a fail because it showed up half-a-year behind Cypress and brought nothing but better tesselation to the table.

 

[MrK6]

You can tell yourself whatever you'd like to make you imagine Nvidia is doing well with "Fermi". However from the link you've provided, Steam's hardware survey shows that for every 2 gamers out there with a GTX470 or GTX480, there are 25 gamers with ATI Radeon HD5700's or HD5800's.

That's not just a staggering lead, that is being completely crushed my friend.

Your logic probably falls on deaf ears, but I'm waiting to see if he'll actually try to rebut that bit. :awe:

 

[GaiaHunter]

But please...run the numbers

One thing we don't know is how many steam accounts there are or their evolution - but last known numbers reported was 25 million.

So I will use that and not be bothered by number of steam account variance (which we don't have data on).

I hope this is fine by you.

May - DX11 was 6.81% - 1,545,000 units.

ATI 5800 series was 39.72% of that number - 613,674 units

GTX 470 was 1.81% - 27,964.5 units (yeah .5 cards, just not doing any rounding).

GTX 480 was 1.71% - 26,491.5 units.

Now June - DX11 7.81% - 1,952,500 units.

ATI 5800 - 38.39% - 749,564.75 units - that is 135,893 more units (see despite the lower market share still more units sold - you can verify that by all cards total share increase).

GTX 470 - 3.04% - 59295.5 - 31,331 units increase.

GTX 480 - 2.14% - 41783.5 - 15,292 units increase.

So GTX470+480 - 46,623 units sold between May and June.

5800 - 135,893 units sold between May and June - so actually last month change was 3 5800 sold for each GTX470+480. (no data on GTX 465).

If you increase number of steam accounts it will be even worse for NVIDIA.

So around 75% market share DX11 for ATI high end (without including 5900) vs 25% for NVIDIA for last month high end DX 11 sales according to steam numbers.

Even if we suppose that GTX 465 is 0.11% (last DX11 card to show on the list is ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5800 Series with 0.11%) that would mean 2,147.75 units total and wouldn't change stuff that much (especially as I'm letting 5900 numbers out).

You sure you want to use this steam numbers?

 

[Unkle_Tar]

No it's not, if it where breaking even, NVIDIA's total share wouldn't be growing:
GTX480:
April: 0.44%
May: 1.89%
June: 2.76%

GTX470:
April: 0.65%
May: 1.81%
June: 3.04%

NVIDIA's highend is selling more than AMD's lowend.
The arrival of GTX465/460 will only bolster that fact.

But please...run the numbers

Did you think about that before you posted it? If ATI was outselling Nvidia 4 to 1 their percentage would still rise to 20% eventually.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Lonbjerg, AMD had 100.00% of the DX11 market. All Nvidia had to do was sel l 1 card to chew into their market share. AMD sold DX11 cards for nearly 6 months before Nvidia had any DX11 card to sell, and now that both companies have parts AMD appears to still be outselling Nvidia.

 

[GaiaHunter]

Lonbjerg, AMD had 100.00% of the DX11 market. All Nvidia had to do was sel l 1 card to chew into their market share. AMD sold DX11 cards for nearly 6 months before Nvidia had any DX11 card to sell, and now that both companies have parts AMD appears to still be outselling Nvidia.

Sometimes I get the feeling that some people will just repeat the same wrong/fallacious arguments again and again in the expectation those will go unanswered and if people disprove them, well they can just post again and then maybe people will simply not bother to correct the same argument for the nth time and people that are new to technology/these forums will just see those posts and will see nobody calling them out and might believe the erroneous claims.

 

[nitromullet]

You can tell yourself whatever you'd like to make you imagine Nvidia is doing well with "Fermi". However from the link you've provided, Steam's hardware survey shows that for every 2 gamers out there with a GTX470 or GTX480, there are 25 gamers with ATI Radeon HD5700's or HD5800's.

That's not just a staggering lead, that is being completely crushed my friend.

You're right, but to be fair the GTX 480/470 really only compete with the HD 5850 and up. The 5700s are in a different class (for which NV doesn't have any direct DX11 competition).

It doesn't really make sense to compare ~$130-150 HD 5750s to ~$300-500 GTX 470s and 480s. Of course, a lot more of the 5830s, 5770s, and 5750s are selling compared to the current Fermi cards.

 

[GaiaHunter]

You're right, but to be fair the GTX 480/470 really only compete with the HD 5850 and up. The 5700s are in a different class (for which NV doesn't have any direct DX11 competition).

It doesn't really make sense to compare ~$130-150 HD 5750s to ~$300-500 GTX 470s and 480s. Of course, a lot more of the 5830s, 5770s, and 5750s are selling compared to the current Fermi cards.

Based on steam data GTX 480/470 still gets trounced by the 5800 and 5970.

All the others are just there to rub in NVIDIA face - we talking
of 100,000 cards vs 800,000 - that is still 8 to 1 and will be regardless of how many steam accounts really is and how many DX 11 cards really is - it is still the same proportion.

 

[Lonbjerg]

You can tell yourself whatever you'd like to make you imagine Nvidia is doing well with "Fermi". However from the link you've provided, Steam's hardware survey shows that for every 2 gamers out there with a GTX470 or GTX480, there are 25 gamers with ATI Radeon HD5700's or HD5800's.

That's not just a staggering lead, that is being completely crushed my friend.

You still seem to be unable to graps the concept of that NVIDIA now is selling more DX11 CPU's than AMD.

Some how you confuse that fact with AMD's early lead with DX11 GPU's?

But I guess it's hard when Char-lie was wrong and not only is the "fermi" manufactable...but also selling good.

What will the excuse be next month when the trend continues?

 

[Lonbjerg]

You can tell yourself whatever you'd like to make you imagine Nvidia is doing well with "Fermi". However from the link you've provided, Steam's hardware survey shows that for every 2 gamers out there with a GTX470 or GTX480, there are 25 gamers with ATI Radeon HD5700's or HD5800's.

That's not just a staggering lead, that is being completely crushed my friend.

Based on steam data GTX 480/470 still gets trounced by the 5800 and 5970.

All the others are just there to rub in NVIDIA face - we talking
of 100,000 cards vs 800,000 - that is still 8 to 1 and will be regardless of how many steam accounts really is and how many DX 11 cards really is - it is still the same proportion.

You can't factor in the early lead sales too?

Is some kind of cognetive virus around, that eats logic?

 

[GaiaHunter]

You still seem to be unable to graps the concept of that NVIDIA now is selling more DX11 CPU's than AMD.

Some how you confuse that fact with AMD's early lead with DX11 GPU's?

But I guess it's hard when Char-lie was wrong and not only is the "fermi" manufactable...but also selling good.

What will the excuse be next month when the trend continues?

No, I proved to you that according the data from steam AMD sells more cards than NVIDIA.

How reliable steam data is I have no way of knowing. You on the other hand are trying to base that NVIDIA is selling more cards than AMD with steam numbers - The Steam numbers say otherwise.

You can't factor in the early lead sales too?

Is some kind of cognetive virus around, that eats logic?

Again - from the STEAM data AMD SOLD MORE CARDS THAN NVIDIA LAST MONTH - EARLY LEAD NOT A FACTOR.

Is the cognitive virus remark a tactic to make people step away from logical reasoning and MATHS and going on personal attacks?

Is the maths present by me and others wrong on any way - and if so please point to our mistakes - or you simply don't want to acknowledge that AMD is still SELLING MORE 5800 CARDS than NVIDIA is selling GTX470/480 on a ratio of about 3:1?

And if you have other data, please share - otherwise the data presented (STEAM SURVEY) only proves you wrong.

 

[Meghan54]

Is some kind of cognetive virus around, that eats logic?

It seems so, and you're quite heavily infected with it, given comments like this,

You still seem to be unable to graps the concept of that NVIDIA now is selling more DX11 CPU's than AMD.

Please feel free to post any facts to prove above point....if you can find any, that is.


PS....I know you're from Denmark, but your English grammar sucks. No comma was necessary in the sentence, "Is some kind of cognetive virus around, that eats logic?"

 

[dug777]

You still seem to be unable to graps the concept of that NVIDIA now is selling more DX11 CPU's than AMD.

Some how you confuse that fact with AMD's early lead with DX11 GPU's?

But I guess it's hard when Char-lie was wrong and not only is the "fermi" manufactable...but also selling good.

What will the excuse be next month when the trend continues?

Way to completely and utterly miss the point

I'll try a really, really simple example for you. Probably not simple enough, but I don't think I can make it any more dumbed down.

Say at Fermi launch, ATI has sold 10 cards. They have 100% marketshare.

After the following month, ATI has sold 2 cards, nVidia has sold 1 card.

ATI is now on 12 cards, nVidia is on 1. Total market is 13 cards.

This is where it gets tricky (watch carefully now ):

This means ATI has ~92% marketshare. nVidia has ~8% marketshare.

After the following month, ATI again sells two cards, nVidia again sells 1 card.

ATI is now on 14 cards, nVidia is now on 2. Total market is 16 cards.

This means ATI has ~87% marketshare. nVidia has ~13% marketshare.

Despite ATI outselling nVida 2:1, nVidia's marketshare still increased.

I don't think I can make that any clearer, your percentage of a total marketshare will increase from the date you enter a market EVEN if you are being comprehensively outsold.

 

[NoSoup4You]

An increase in marketshare does NOT mean you're selling more video cards than your competitor.