Does American society view homosexuality as moral?

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Does American Society see homosexuality as morally acceptable?

  • Yes, the majority of American society does view homosexuality as morally OK

  • No, The majority of American society does not view homosexuality as morally OK

  • America is, more or less 50/50 split on homosexuality

  • I have no idea, and just wanted to vote in the poll.


Results are only viewable after voting.

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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1. I'm not sub defining it, the definition of homophobia sub defines it (in brackets)

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Homophobia

"unreasoning fear of or antipathy toward homosexuals and homosexuality."

"Prejudice" is not included, either literally or by implication.

2. It is impossible to think that a fundamental characteristic about a persons life is immoral, without thinking that the person's lifestyle is immoral, that person would therefore think that the person acts immorally, a person who acts immorally is an immoral person. Thinking someone is an immoral person based on their sexual orientation, is prejudicial. Homophobic.

What do you mean "lifestyle"? Do you honestly think people who find homosexuality immoral are referring to anything other than sexual activities? If you define your life by only the who, what, where, when, and how of your sexuality then yes.. those who find homosexuality immoral will be passing judgement on you as a person as well. If, however, you don't define yourself by those things, then those who find homosexuality immoral will not be passing judgement on you as a person. Either way, it's all down to how you define yourself.. not how others define you.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Homophobia

"unreasoning fear of or antipathy toward homosexuals and homosexuality."

"Prejudice" is not included, either literally or by implication.



What do you mean "lifestyle"? Do you honestly think people who find homosexuality immoral are referring to anything other than sexual activities? If you define your life by only the who, what, where, when, and how of your sexuality then yes.. those who find homosexuality immoral will be passing judgement on you as a person as well. If, however, you don't define yourself by those things, then those who find homosexuality immoral will not be passing judgement on you as a person. Either way, it's all down to how you define yourself.. not how others define you.

So we are changing definitions now because the last one didn't work out for you?

by lifestyle I mean the actions you take in your life, sexual activities included.

I'm not saying that I define myself by my sexual orientation, but it is a characteristic of mine, so people who are prejudiced against it, are prejudiced against a part of me.
 

Elfear

Diamond Member
May 30, 2004
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Sorry I missed that, they aren't bigots but they could be prejudiced to people who steal. The same as i'm prejudiced to nazi's. I've not met one, but I think that Nazi-ism is immoral.

It's an interesting point, but I would argue the reason that we call homophobes bigots and people who are prejudiced against thieves non-biggots is because thieves negatively effect others, homosexuality doesn't.

After googling "bigot" - A bigot is a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices, especially one exhibiting intolerance, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs. I suppose if someone is "obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices [regarding thieves]" then bigot is a valid term for them....

A thieves lifestyle does negatively effect joe average, so I see no reason why being prejudiced to them should be a problem.

Hmm. So everybody in the world is a bigot because they label certain things right and certain things wrong? I'm not on the same page with you about that definition. Being a bigot would be something I hope someone would try to correct while labeling things right or wrong is how we help define our world.

I would also argue that the people directly affected by thieves is rather small. I think in my whole life I have had maybe a handful of insignificant things stolen from me. It really doesn't affect me but I still find stealing immoral.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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The reality is that it is not a blanket problem from area to area. Some are worse then others. If this is where you are from I apologize for offending you about your home

I'm from and live in Wisconsin. I take no offense, but most of what you've said in this thread strikes me as just as naive and ignorant as those you criticize.

the midwest is the capital of bigotry, ignorance and intolerance.

As lies go, that's a whopper. No region in the US has the balance between liberal/conservative, Democrat/Republican as even as the midwest.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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Yes, most of the time they usually think you are a minion of their antichrist or something behind your back and tolerate you. How could you defend such hypocrites? You are like a african slave who shrugs at his lot in life because "mastah treats meh well enuff I guess, -the whippings are only when I mess up."

So, where in the US do you live? Where are you from?
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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Hmm. So everybody in the world is a bigot because they label certain things right and certain things wrong? I'm not on the same page with you about that definition. Being a bigot would be something I hope someone would try to correct while labeling things right or wrong is how we help define our world.

I'm just arguing that people who is "obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices, especially one exhibiting intolerance, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs" is a bigot. that is all. It's the definition you take issue with not me. On a side note I've been arguing about prejudice not bigotry, homophobes = prejudiced.

I would also argue that the people directly affected by thieves is rather small. I think in my whole life I have had maybe a handful of insignificant things stolen from me. It really doesn't affect me but I still find stealing immoral.

So you have been effected by thieves, so have I, so have most people.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
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I'm from and live in Wisconsin. I take no offense, but most of what you've said in this thread strikes me as just as naive and ignorant as those you criticize.



As lies go, that's a whopper. No region in the US has the balance between liberal/conservative, Democrat/Republican as even as the midwest.

It is not about political parties but the opinions in the region are out of whack with the rest of the country. It's a fact, not a generalization, it's pretty embarrassing really as we have international posters in here. Lets not go there where I have to pull up stats ok?
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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So we are changing definitions now because the last one didn't work out for you?

Not changing anything. I've always used dictionary.com in this thread. It came up in a Google search.

I'm not saying that I define myself by my sexual orientation, but it is a characteristic of mine, so people who are prejudiced against it, are prejudiced against a part of me.

And that prejudice about a part of you makes them homophobes? It shouldn't.. unless your sexual orientation is a much bigger part of your self-definition than you're willing to admit.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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It is not about political parties but the opinions in the region are out of whack with the rest of the country. It's a fact, not a generalization, it's pretty embarrassing really as we have international posters in here. Lets not go there where I have to pull up stats ok?

No, let's go there. I want to see your stats, facts, and figures. I'd especially like to see how those stats stack up to the south.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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Not changing anything. I've always used dictionary.com in this thread. It came up in a Google search.

Really? the definition you first mention was different. I assumed it was the Princeton dictionary.

prejudice against (fear or dislike of) homosexual people and homosexuality
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn


And that prejudice about a part of you makes them homophobes? It shouldn't.. unless your sexual orientation is a much bigger part of your self-definition than you're willing to admit.

It's just a part of me, to me, but if you are prejudiced against homosexuals, what else is it other than their sexual orientation that you are going to pick on as a homophobe?
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
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I'd especially like to see how those stats stack up to the south.



You do realize you just compared middle-west to a area known for brutal racist terrorism and armed insurrection against our country as a gauge of bigotry in your area per your own example from the get-go? Really? is that where the bar is lowered as an example? Ouch man, you just tripped over the starting rope in this race.
 
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JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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hahahahaaaaa...it`s interesting reading this thread that quite a few people are closet homophobes.
What buisness of anybodys is it?
Live and let live.
Let Brian and Mathew or Beverly and Kim have the same rights and privileges that Joe and Barbara have. Including the right to get married, if they so choose!
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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hahahahaaaaa...it`s interesting reading this thread that quite a few people are closet homophobes.
What buisness of anybodys is it?
Live and let live.
Let Brian and Mathew or Beverly and Kim have the same rights and privileges that Joe and Barbara have. Including the right to get married, if they so choose!

Yeah there do seem to be a couple :hmm:
 

manimal

Lifer
Mar 30, 2007
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what I find immoral is the demonization going on in the US. I know its been there for a century now with shifting targets but I refuse to go gently....


seriously the hate and the hyperbole going on with the bullshit defence of marriage bullshit makes me vomit..


I say either EVERYONE gets the same rights under marriage or NONE


I am stepping away from this bourgeois table and saying "NO MORE JELLO FOR ME MOM"
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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Really? the definition you first mention was different. I assumed it was the Princeton dictionary.

prejudice against (fear or dislike of) homosexual people and homosexuality
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

The first definition I referenced was the "prejudice".. and it was from dictionary.com. The second was "homophobia", also from dictionary.com

It's just a part of me, to me, but if you are prejudiced against homosexuals, what else is it other than their sexual orientation that you are going to pick on as a homophobe?

I don't buy your premise. If someone feels that homosexuality is immoral and your sexuality is just a part of you, there's a lot more about you that they're going to notice than just your sexuality.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
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You do realize you just compared middle-west to a area known for brutal racist terrorism and armed insurrection against our country as a gauge of bigotry in your area per your own example from the get-go? Really? is that where the bar is lowered as an example? Ouch man, you just tripped over the starting rope in this race.

Hey, I wasn't the one to call the midwest the "capital of bigotry, ignorance and intolerance."... you did that.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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The first definition I referenced was the "prejudice".. and it was from dictionary.com. The second was "homophobia", also from dictionary.com



I don't buy your premise. If someone feels that homosexuality is immoral and your sexuality is just a part of you, there's a lot more about you that they're going to notice than just your sexuality.

I agree, there is a lot more, it doesn't mean I shouldn't fight injustice as a principle regardless of how it may or may not be practically applied.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
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I agree, there is a lot more, it doesn't mean I shouldn't fight injustice as a principle regardless of how it may or may not be practically applied.

And if there's a lot more how can their belief that homosexuality is immoral automatically be translated to mean they're "homophobes"? It cannot, because their belief that homosexuality is immoral need not be rooted in what defines homophobia: fear or hatred.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
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I watched an episode of Happy Days where the Fonz was "allergic to women" and no one in Milwaukee seemed to care.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
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Believing homosexuality to be immoral doesn't fit any of those definitions of homophobia.

Homophobia is a range of negative attitudes and feelings towards lesbian, gay, bisexual, and in some cases transgender and intersex people and behaviour. Definitions refer variably to antipathy, contempt, prejudice, aversion, and irrational fear.

..
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
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Nope... that section cites Webster.com and Dictionary.com as sources... and a European Parliament resolution (which has no relevance to the US). Nothing in those two sources indicates anything about prejudice.

Additionally, further down in the Dictionary.com page on homophobia, it lists this as the definition, from the Collins English dictionary:

intense hatred or fear of homosexuals or homosexuality