iversonyin
Diamond Member
- Aug 12, 2004
- 3,303
- 0
- 76
Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
who cares, i hate domestic.
I don't like most Chevy cars, BUT DAYAM the Corvette is sweet!!!!!!
I don't like most Chevy cars, BUT DAYAM the Corvette is sweet!!!!!!
Most cars these days are boring. However, Ford has done an excellent job over the years keeping the Mustang exciting and reasonably fresh. And the current Dodge Charger is of interest as well, though I don't think you can get them with manual transmissions, which is what I would want. I exclude vehicles like the Corvette and Viper because they are in price brackets not reachable by most people. US companies have always been strong with trucks and muscle cars (has there ever been a foreign muscle car?), but in a market where those segments have grown weaker, they really need to improve on the image of their small and mid-range cars.
Many people talk about where the dollars go in foreign vs domestic, but something that rarely gets mentioned is national pride. I like being proud of my country's accomplishments, and in that respect, seeing our domestic auto industry overrun by foreign industry is not a good thing.
Many people talk about where the dollars go in foreign vs domestic, but something that rarely gets mentioned is national pride. I like being proud of my country's accomplishments, and in that respect, seeing our domestic auto industry overrun by foreign industry is not a good thing.
I believe we are going to see a consolidation in the US of car manufactures just like all the other large industries(ie airlines, retail, etc) have gone thru. Im not sure who will be around or who will not.
i do now that the current state that the american car companies are in isn't going to last.
you will see them ditching pension plans for 401k, limited the union ability to hold companies hostage on wages and especially health care, etc.
if not they will not exist because there is no way for a unionized labor force such as the autos have to compete with non unionized labor companies....period.
i know pro union people don't like to hear that but it is a fact. I personnally think globalization is bad for america but it is happening and there is no way to stop it. Our companies must adapt or risk being put out of business.
I also don't buy the idea that you don't buy foriegn because the profits don't flow back to the US. In a true free market you always buy the best product for the cheapest price.
The economy will work dictate which companies go under and which ones will not..........
-fish
i do now that the current state that the american car companies are in isn't going to last.
you will see them ditching pension plans for 401k, limited the union ability to hold companies hostage on wages and especially health care, etc.
if not they will not exist because there is no way for a unionized labor force such as the autos have to compete with non unionized labor companies....period.
i know pro union people don't like to hear that but it is a fact. I personnally think globalization is bad for america but it is happening and there is no way to stop it. Our companies must adapt or risk being put out of business.
I also don't buy the idea that you don't buy foriegn because the profits don't flow back to the US. In a true free market you always buy the best product for the cheapest price.
The economy will work dictate which companies go under and which ones will not..........
-fish
Because they can't from a competitive pricing standpoint; domestic costs for retirees are too high and they still have significantly higher man-hour/vehicle labor costs.
GM certainly could build it, but not remotely at the same price point. What Toyota and Honda could sell for $25K, GM would have to sell for not less than $30K and likely upwards of $35K. Whose going to pay that much more for the same thing? As with any other consumer good, pricing rules.
Toyota and Honda use state-of-the-art factories that spare no automation or technology, while our unions still are zealously opposed to the loss of ANY manual positions due to technology. They "claim" not to be opposed to technology, but the union fights tooth and nail when the company wants to eliminate the positions that are made obsolete by technology.
So GM might spend $200 million for new automation at one plant and still have to retain or pay the workers whose positions are made obsolete by that automation. Where is the cost savings or advantage? It actually costs them many times more to adopt technology and automation because they can't get rid of the manual positions!
Forget building a better car at a competitive price, we can't build an equal car at a competitive price.
IF the big three could get their heads out of their arse when it comes to interior i'd gladly buy one. I'm a huge chevy fan, love to support american companies, but when they give me no options...i can't buy them. I wanted a fun to drive, 20-30k car, with a somewhat nice interior. the mazda 3 fits all those bills with an interior better than even 30-40k chevy's ...and the fact that I got a mazdaspeed 3, something nothing in the big 3 camp can compete with...well, i went mazda
I'll buy a vette someday, but their offerings for me as a 20 something male...are nil
-matt
I'll buy a vette someday, but their offerings for me as a 20 something male...are nil
-matt
Originally posted by: Mellman
IF the big three could get their heads out of their arse when it comes to interior i'd gladly buy one. I'm a huge chevy fan, love to support american companies, but when they give me no options...i can't buy them. I wanted a fun to drive, 20-30k car, with a somewhat nice interior. the mazda 3 fits all those bills with an interior better than even 30-40k chevy's ...and the fact that I got a mazdaspeed 3, something nothing in the big 3 camp can compete with...well, i went mazda
I'll buy a vette someday, but their offerings for me as a 20 something male...are nil
-matt
Mazda has partial Ford investment and control.
And some of you guys make it sound like the Big 3 aren't moving any cars at all.
Ktulu
Diamond Member
- Dec 16, 2000
- 4,354
- 0
- 0
Originally posted by: Mellman
IF the big three could get their heads out of their arse when it comes to interior i'd gladly buy one. I'm a huge chevy fan, love to support american companies, but when they give me no options...i can't buy them. I wanted a fun to drive, 20-30k car, with a somewhat nice interior. the mazda 3 fits all those bills with an interior better than even 30-40k chevy's ...and the fact that I got a mazdaspeed 3, something nothing in the big 3 camp can compete with...well, i went mazda
I'll buy a vette someday, but their offerings for me as a 20 something male...are nil
-matt
If you could get your head out of your arse, then you'd see what kind of interiors GM has been developing and has coming down the product pipeline.
example
Here's how I see GM and Ford:
reliability - check
exterior - check
interior - check
performance - check
price - check
value - buzz ( resale value is still in the sh!tter)
All and all not bad IMHO.
mrSHEiK124
Lifer
- Mar 6, 2004
- 11,488
- 2
- 0
Originally posted by: Ktulu
Originally posted by: Mellman
IF the big three could get their heads out of their arse when it comes to interior i'd gladly buy one. I'm a huge chevy fan, love to support american companies, but when they give me no options...i can't buy them. I wanted a fun to drive, 20-30k car, with a somewhat nice interior. the mazda 3 fits all those bills with an interior better than even 30-40k chevy's ...and the fact that I got a mazdaspeed 3, something nothing in the big 3 camp can compete with...well, i went mazda
I'll buy a vette someday, but their offerings for me as a 20 something male...are nil
-matt
If you could get your head out of your arse, then you'd see what kind of interiors GM has been developing and has coming down the product pipeline.
example
Here's how I see GM and Ford:
reliability - check
exterior - check
interior - check
performance - check
price - check
value - buzz ( resale value is still in the sh!tter)
All and all not bad IMHO.
Most of those steering wheels look nice. The two unbranded ones (1st column, 1st row, and 2nd column, 2nd row) look nasty, and surprisingly, IMO the best looking one, is the Buick wheel. All the gauges in the top row look silly. That dash console looks nice though, complicated, but nice.
Of course they will fold.
It is a designed plan to shed having to pay for medical costs for employees and former employees as well as retiree costs.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,785
- 6,345
- 126
GM might survive intact, but will continue to shrink
Ford might just disappear, though some other Auto Corp might buy it and continue to use the name for Marketing purposes
Chrysler, I dunno, it might just disappear or be used(like Ford) for Marketing purposes by someone else. Predict: bought by Chinese Corp
The Big 3 is no more, but will likely continue to be used until at least 1 of them is completely gone.
Ford might just disappear, though some other Auto Corp might buy it and continue to use the name for Marketing purposes
Chrysler, I dunno, it might just disappear or be used(like Ford) for Marketing purposes by someone else. Predict: bought by Chinese Corp
The Big 3 is no more, but will likely continue to be used until at least 1 of them is completely gone.
I have a Jeep that I bought used, and I'd buy a new Chrysler or GM product, but not Ford... not knowing what Henry Ford did during WWII.
I believe you're mistaken....unless you're denying that a 5-year, 100,000 mile warranty adds value.
I'd say it does
I drive an 05 Malibu ltz, it's a good daily driver and gets 23cityMPG with a 200HP V6.
domestics have been improving but they have make good products for a long time
before the public forgets the Tempo, celebrity, craptacular cars of past. Remember
Hundia's Accell? classic $hitbox. took them 10 yrs. to recover from that one, now
they are a respected manufacturer. Big 3 are in this stage now...
domestics have been improving but they have make good products for a long time
before the public forgets the Tempo, celebrity, craptacular cars of past. Remember
Hundia's Accell? classic $hitbox. took them 10 yrs. to recover from that one, now
they are a respected manufacturer. Big 3 are in this stage now...
Meh, I have only owned domestics, two fords and one Chevy, my parents growing up owned Lincoln and Cadillac, my wife has owned a few foreign, My next car will not be domestic...the build quality just isn't that good...reliability of my current ford is ok, but nothing spectacular.
I have been unable to find a better car for my commuting needs than a new Chevy Cobalt with manual transmission, windows, and locks for $13,500 after taxes.
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