Disorders that aren't disorders

[NikolaeVarius]

You clearly don't understand the conversation. Nobody said it doesn't exist. They're saying it's not a disorder, something outside the norm.

And obesity isn't a disorder. It's being lazy and gluttonous. Hence people ridiculing the fat acceptance movement.

What. Now you're just being ignorant.

Obesity is 99.99% caused by poor life choices, but that doesn't stop it from being a disorder.

 

[Rakehellion]

They're saying it's not a disorder, something outside the norm.

If only a minority of people have it, then it is outside the norm by definition. And it also exists. And it can be detrimental. Sound like it fits the bill.

So what's your ad-hoc definition of a disorder then?

 

[Ronstang]

What. Now you're just being ignorant.

Obesity is 99.99% caused by poor life choices, but that doesn't stop it from being a disorder.

It's a character flaw, doesn't make it a disorder. Just about anyone with any will power what so ever can loose weight if they choose....they just choose to be fat slobs. That is the very definition of a character flaw. Eating chips and candy all day sitting on the couch is bad character...not a disorder.

 

[Slacker]

WTF? That ain't right. Also, why do you now that?

The purpose of ejaculation is procreation, god doesn't care how long it takes, but you have to hit the target.

 

[BoberFett]

If only a minority of people have it, then it is outside the norm by definition. And it also exists. And it can be detrimental. Sound like it fits the bill.

So what's your ad-hoc definition of a disorder then?

Is being uglier than average a disorder? It's physiological, outside the norm, and detrimental.

Is being dumber than average a disorder? It's physiological, outside the norm, and detrimental.

 

[Ronstang]

Stop trying to make yourselves feel better by labeling everything wrong in your life a disorder. Take a little responsibility for yourself, change your life....it's a much more powerful drug and longer lasting than the ones you pay the pharma companies for.

 

[NikolaeVarius]

Is being uglier than average a disorder? It's physiological, outside the norm, and detrimental.

Is being dumber than average a disorder? It's physiological, outside the norm, and detrimental.

Being ugly is a subjective thing. If you're ugly because you never developed a brow ridge, then yes it's a disorder, otherwise, completely subjective.

Intelligence has never been a hard science, however, yes, being significantly outside a intelligence curve at a certain age is considered a disorder.

 

[BoberFett]

Being ugly is a subjective thing. If you're ugly because you never developed a brow ridge, then yes it's a disorder, otherwise, completely subjective.

Intelligence has never been a hard science, however, yes, being significantly outside a intelligence curve at a certain age is considered a disorder.

Sorry to hear about your disorders.

 

[moonbogg]

You clearly don't understand the conversation. Nobody said it doesn't exist. They're saying it's not a disorder, something outside the norm.

And obesity isn't a disorder. It's being lazy and gluttonous. Hence people ridiculing the fat acceptance movement.

If a large percentage of people have a "disorder" then the problem is not with the individual, it's a problem with society and the expectations being set on those individuals with the supposed "disorder". If society is too busy, too distracting, too structured for a massive number of people to deal with, then society needs to figure out how to be more flexible and slow things down rather than tell those people they're defective, and that they now need to fuck their brain up with drugs in order to meet society's ridiculous expectations.

This is true and correct.

The number of things people of today need to focus on, remember, anticipate, plan for etc etc is totally and absolutely off the charts insane. The stresses placed on humans in the work place is indeed inhumane. We are expected to be like a computer. We are expected to have perfect judgment of complex situations and arrive at the perfect outcome, quickly, efficiently and in expert fashion.
We used to hunt, eat, fuck and shit. We didn't even have to wipe our ass. The most complex thing we had to worry about was making a spear and harnessing fire. This wasn't long ago. We are the same people.

 

[squarecut1]

The number of things people of today need to focus on, remember, anticipate, plan for etc etc is totally and absolutely off the charts insane. The stresses placed on humans in the work place is indeed inhumane. We are expected to be like a computer. We are expected to have perfect judgment of complex situations and arrive at the perfect outcome, quickly, efficiently and in expert fashion.
We used to hunt, eat, fuck and shit. We didn't even have to wipe our ass. The most complex thing we had to worry about was making a spear and harnessing fire. This wasn't long ago. We are the same people.

Yes. I should add that while life has gotten more stressful and hectic everywhere, there are still many societies where there is nowhere quite like the above. But America is the extreme of the extreme. A society completely driven by money. What we are seeing all around us now, in so many forms of social, physical, physiological ills is the natural, inevitable outcome of a greed based society.

 

[MrDudeMan]

Love how you jump on fake science and completely shun real science just to prove to yourself how smarter you than everyone else.

PTSD isn't a thing. Man up and get over it. Right? Depression isn't a real thing. Just stop being sad, right?

He's totally wrong. I mean all the way, completely, indefensibly wrong.

Sorry, ADD, ADHD...whatever you want to lump together are manufactured disorders of the late 20th century so families with two working parents could have a scapegoat for their bad parenting skills. We didn't have this crap when I was a kid and even if there was something similar it has been so overdiagnosed to the point I just shrug and laugh. ALL kids are born ADD....it's solved with discipline at a young age....can't do this in daycare people!!!

You know what else didn't exist a long time ago? AIDS. Is that fake, too? Just because depression and ADD don't have obvious physical effects doesn't make them fake. In all seriousness, you must be willfully ignorant to have such a dated and simple view of modern medicine. You don't need to be a doctor or have a deep understanding, only the will to actually learn, which you seem to lack. Daycare isn't the cause of this particular problem, either. One of my kids, as seen below, is disciplined regularly and never went to daycare, but he still has a real issue.


There's a huge amount of ignorance in this thread. Let's take something that flat out didn't exist 40 years ago and today is absolutely real: Sensory Processing Disorder. One of my kids has it and every single one of the fuckwads in this thread would have said "bad parenting" instead of "disorder."

He acts like a fucking hellion and has uncontrollable fits of rage because of his disorder. For the first two years of his life, my wife and I knew something was up because things were off even though everyone said the kind of stuff you guys would probably say: put him to bed earlier, use timeout more, make him do xxxx or yyyy, etc. We knew our kid well enough to know it was all bullshit and that we were doing all of the right things, especially considering he wasn't our first kid.

His disorder, even though we didn't know what it was yet, was absolutely causing unnecessary pain and suffering, which was obvious when he wouldn't walk on mulch like all the other kids even though he was crying because he wanted to play. For a non-idiot who actually thinks about the behavior instead of screaming "get over it," that was a very serious sign that he had an issue.

We weren't too proud to admit he had an issue, so we brought him to a doctor who recognized the symptoms, however subtle they were, and told us to see a specialist. Sure enough, he was diagnosed with SPD and all of our lives immediately changed. He never slept well and he cried a lot as a baby, which we thought was colic even though there was something slightly different about it. The therapist told us to make a weighted blanket and after putting it on him he slept all the way through the night for the first time in his entire life at 2 years old. The next morning, he was a completely different child.

SPD is one of the disoders the shitheads in this thread would call "junk science" because it casts such a wide net, but every inch of that coverage is necessary. Kids who act out or look like bad kids aren't always a result of bad parenting and you guys definitely have absolutely no basis to make the distinction. My son still has issues with SPD a year later and he's probably going to struggle with it for his whole life, but his disorder would have been written off as being bad as recently as 20 years ago, which is totally not the case. He would have survived to adulthood with behavioral issues had we not had him tested, yes, but his life is totally different now. I'm thankful every day that I'm not an ignorant asshole who would have spanked my kid too much or yelled at him when it was totally out of his control.

To give you an idea of how he feels, go stuff yourself in an MRI machine for 16 hours and then gradually make the opening smaller and smaller. Eventually you would start screaming and go crazy, which is exactly how he feels. To help him, we have to rub his arms and legs with a stiff brush every two hours and then make him jump 10 times - a treatment plan most people would scoff at - but he needs it because his nerves are severely under-stimulated. If we don't do it, he very quickly degenerates into a total mess and it's obvious he's not in control.

 

[Rakehellion]

Is being dumber than average a disorder? It's physiological, outside the norm, and detrimental.

Yes. If your IQ is below 70, you have to go to a special school. And I asked your definition of a disorder, a question which you conveniently ignored.


A disorder does not need to be outside the norm. You're the one who said that 10% isn't outside the norm. Incorrect and irrelevant.

 

[Rakehellion]

The evolutionary purpose of sex is reproduction. Something very hard for the modern society to understand, where sex is an industry. And a very lucrative one at that.

Evolution doesn't have a consciousness and sex does not have a purpose. Sexual reproduction exists because it was a evolutionarily successful trait to those who used it. And many organisms reproduce asexually.

Cliffs: Keep your morality bullshit in P&N.

 

[squarecut1]

Evolution doesn't have a consciousness and sex does not have a purpose. Sexual reproduction exists because it was a evolutionarily successful trait to those who used it. And many organisms reproduce asexually.

Cliffs: Keep your morality bullshit in P&N.

And humans are not amongst those who reproduce without sex. I see you are saying the same thing as I did. But just being angry about it for some reason. By the way, my post had nothing to do with morality. Go drink a glass of water.

 

[moonbogg]

The thread title is "disorders that aren't disorders" The title is not "disorders don't exist". Everyone calm down and go take a Ritalin or something. Jesus.

 

[Mixolydian]

I get that, but what are they helping? Of course psychotropic drugs have an affect....but they are merely masks. You can control the underlying reasons you take them...if you choose. It all comes down to will power...which most people lack these days because they are lazy and only want to live in the now.

Oh, and unlike most around here I'm not intending to insult you personally

Stop trying to make yourselves feel better by labeling everything wrong in your life a disorder. Take a little responsibility for yourself, change your life....it's a much more powerful drug and longer lasting than the ones you pay the pharma companies for.

Two incredibly false, moronic statements.

 

[GrumpyMan]

Halitosis, do you have to be on the Halo Deck to get it?

 

[shortylickens]

Sandy Vagina disorder?

 

[Rakehellion]

my post had nothing to do with morality.

"Something very hard for the modern society to understand." Sounded pretty judgmental.


99% of all sex is recreational. One of those little caveats that that makes a reproductively successful species.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

I was developmentally very normal. I suffer from a disorder deficiency. It's crippling. Everything is fine and I have nothing interesting to talk to strangers about.

 

[MrDudeMan]

The thread title is "disorders that aren't disorders" The title is not "disorders don't exist". Everyone calm down and go take a Ritalin or something. Jesus.

I think you missed the point. You have absolutely no idea how to diagnose a disorder, but you feel confident in calling a very major one "fake" because you supposedly have experience with it. That makes sense because one person with a practically unquantifiable experience can speak for millions of others, right? The thread title may literally be "disorders that aren't disorders," but you very clearly meant "disorders that aren't actually real."

I provided my son's experience as an example because, to the uninitiated like Ronstang, he would look like a simple case of bad behavior due to bad parenting, which would also be completely false. We've had idiots similar to Ronstang say as much right to our faces. "He's taking his clothes off and throwing a tantrum because you don't discipline him." Hey, dumbass, actually it's because the sensation of clothes on his skin is so irritating that he will pass out from screaming if we don't take them off sometimes. Stuff like that is what parents go through when ignorant idiots judge them. Throwing toys away, spanking, timeout... you name it, we've tried it. However, after getting a real diagnosis and what's called a sensory diet, I can calm him down in a matter of seconds and he willingly wears clothes, diapers, and shoes; those are all things he flat out refused to do for years. I duct taped diapers on him at one point because he would take them off every single night and pee on his mattress. When you find yourself doing things like that, there's only one reason it wouldn't occur to you that your kid has a real problem - you're a total and complete dumbass. Kids with other disorders do similar things with respect to their disorders. My wife is an ABA therapist now who works with autistic kids and it is incredibly obvious how even very mild cases affect their lives. Some of the kids seem normal and even parents of other autistic kids don't recognize the symptoms, but they're still real and treatable. Waving your hands at the disorder only hurts the kid and it isn't their fault. Thankfully, most people in a position to do something about these types of issues don't do a bunch of pointless hand waving and real money is being spent on research.

You're probably right that some people don't really have ADD, but you're definitely wrong about the disorder not being real. Also, some people are probably misdiagnosed with ADD, ADHD, SPD, etc. because we don't even know what their particular flavor of disorder really is yet. The ignorance of people who espouse your opinion on this issue is a huge roadblock to the people who actually suffer with one of the 'fake' disorders getting real help.

 

[Mixolydian]

I think you missed the point. You have absolutely no idea how to diagnose a disorder, but you feel confident in calling a very major one "fake" because you supposedly have experience with it. That makes sense because one person with a practically unquantifiable experience can speak for millions of others, right? The thread title may literally be "disorders that aren't disorders," but you very clearly meant "disorders that aren't actually real."

I provided my son's experience as an example because, to the uninitiated like Ronstang, he would look like a simple case of bad behavior due to bad parenting, which would also be completely false. We've had idiots similar to Ronstang say as much right to our faces. "He's taking his clothes off and throwing a tantrum because you don't discipline him." Hey, dumbass, actually it's because the sensation of clothes on his skin is so irritating that he will pass out from screaming if we don't take them off sometimes. Stuff like that is what parents go through when ignorant idiots judge them. Throwing toys away, spanking, timeout... you name it, we've tried it. However, after getting a real diagnosis and what's called a sensory diet, I can calm him down in a matter of seconds and he willfully wears clothes, diapers, and shoes - things he flat our refused to do for years. I duct taped diapers on him at one point because he would take them off every single night and pee on his mattress. When you find yourself doing things like that, there's only one reason it wouldn't occur to you that your kid has a real problem - you're a total and complete dumbass.

You're probably right that some people don't really have ADD, but you're definitely wrong about disorder not being real. Also, some people are probably misdiagnosed with ADD, ADHD, SPD, etc. because we don't even know what their particular flavor of disorder really is yet. The ignorance of people who espouse your particular opinion of this issue are actually a huge roadblock to the people who actually suffer with one of the 'fake' disorders getting real help.

:thumbsup:

The ignorance of some people is sickening.

 

[moonbogg]

:thumbsup:

The ignorance of some people is sickening.

Bullshit. Some diseases are real with an identifiable, physical cause. Others, like ADD, are mostly disease mongering for profit. ADD used to be a kid thing, but in the recent past an explosion of "adult ADD" advertisements swept the scene, taking advantage of adults with stressful lives and making them think it was caused by a disorder. These people aren't disordered, they just have stressful lives as they try to make it in a fast paced, high demand world which they simply aren't cut out for.
If you were to increase the demands on the public by two fold, you would have millions more people who suddenly wouldn't be able to cope, and the drug industry would come out with a cure for them, guaranteed. After all, if they aren't happy and living a good life, something must be wrong with them.

 

[Ns1]

Bullshit. Some diseases are real with an identifiable, physical cause. Others, like ADD, are mostly disease mongering for profit. ADD used to be a kid thing, but in the recent past an explosion of "adult ADD" advertisements swept the scene, taking advantage of adults with stressful lives and making them think it was caused by a disorder. These people aren't disordered, they just have stressful lives as they try to make it in a fast paced, high demand world which they simply aren't cut out for.
If you were to increase the demands on the public by two fold, you would have millions more people who suddenly wouldn't be able to cope, and the drug industry would come out with a cure for them, guaranteed. After all, if they aren't happy and living a good life, something must be wrong with them.

just because some of them full of shit doesn't mean all of them are.

 

[SlitheryDee]

I always thought restless leg syndrome sounded a little like BS.

"Oh no my legs won't stop moving! Whatever will I do"!

Seems more like what pretty much everyone feels when they're worried or anxious. You can't sleep because you're thinking about shit. You're consciously trying to stay still because you think that might help you doze off, and that makes you more aware of your body. There's no significant sensory input except whatever you can feel with your body, so you start focusing on that to take your mind off of whatever you were worried about. Suddenly you can't be still because you start noticing all the little weird twitches and sensation you normally don't pay attention to. Boom, full blown RLS.