Disorders that aren't disorders

[Miramonti]

If ignorance is a disorder, a number of people here have the affliction.

 

[SMOGZINN]

The evolutionary purpose of sex is reproduction. Something very hard for the modern society to understand, where sex is an industry. And a very lucrative one at that.

I think you need to be careful talking about 'purpose' when it comes to evolution. Evolution is not purpose driven.
Sex has multiple evolutionary advantages including reproduction, group bonding and cohesiveness, and stress relief.

 

[Jeff7]

Amazing how many disorder have developed in the last 30 years

Society advances, and you have more time to devote to other things.


We also have more known categories of rocks than we did 1000 years ago. The rocks are still the same. We just made the categories more specific thanks to better tools and more knowledge.

 

[Ronstang]

Sorry, ADD, ADHD...whatever you want to lump together are manufactured disorders of the late 20th century so families with two working parents could have a scapegoat for their bad parenting skills. We didn't have this crap when I was a kid and even if there was something similar it has been so overdiagnosed to the point I just shrug and laugh. ALL kids are born ADD....it's solved with discipline at a young age....can't do this in daycare people!!!

 

[DCal430]

ADD is so kids can get special treatment in school. There is no reason for any child to get so called accommodations such as extra time in exams.

I am sure some really do have issues, but the majority do not. Even those who have a legitimate disabilty do not deserve special treatment.

 

[Ns1]

how many on the board does this apply to?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empathy#Narcissistic_personality_disorder

 

[Ns1]

Sorry, ADD, ADHD...whatever you want to lump together are manufactured disorders of the late 20th century so families with two working parents could have a scapegoat for their bad parenting skills. We didn't have this crap when I was a kid and even if there was something similar it has been so overdiagnosed to the point I just shrug and laugh. ALL kids are born ADD....it's solved with discipline at a young age....can't do this in daycare people!!!

you probably did have this when you were kids except you called them stupid.

 

[Ronstang]

you probably did have this when you were kids except you called them stupid.

Maybe, but very few. Not enough to show up on radar. There were always discipline cases but they were rare....today they are the norm. You can't tell me something went undiagnosed for millenia to being prominent in the majority of our kids in a couple decades. These problems are caused by two things....parents....and a medical community looking to make a buck off their emotions.

 

[SunnyD]

Sorry, ADD, ADHD...whatever you want to lump together are manufactured disorders of the late 20th century so families with two working parents could have a scapegoat for their bad parenting skills. We didn't have this crap when I was a kid and even if there was something similar it has been so overdiagnosed to the point I just shrug and laugh. ALL kids are born ADD....it's solved with discipline at a young age....can't do this in daycare people!!!

I'll both agree and disagree with you at the same time. If you were to say somewhere something like "the majority of cases diagnosed are done falsely but a handful are legitimately caused by underlying physiological conditions" in the same manner as depression, then you'd be onto something.

When you have a society where zero tolerance is the rule and your kids can't blow off any steam, you're bound to have problems when you ask for perfection from something that's inherently flawed.

 

[Ns1]

Maybe, but very few. Not enough to show up on radar. There were always discipline cases but they were rare....today they are the norm. You can't tell me something went undiagnosed for millenia to being prominent in the majority of our kids in a couple decades. These problems are caused by two things....parents....and a medical community looking to make a buck off their emotions.

my personal feeling is that it's a combination of both - a mixture of real legit cases as well as kids/parents who use it as a crutch.

whether or not you believe ADD is real I'll tell you one thing - ADD drugs work.

 

[SunnyD]

my personal feeling is that it's a combination of both - a mixture of real legit cases as well as kids/parents who use it as a crutch.

whether or not you believe ADD is real I'll tell you one thing - ADD drugs work.

By turning that kid into someone they're not. I recall my nephew on Ritalin. That was a very, very sad chapter of life. I have never seen a more empty shell of a person than seeing kids on Ritalin.

 

[Ronstang]

ADD drugs work.

The question remains....what are they working on? I'm not saying the drugs don't have an affect but I can tell you the the two kids I helped raise didn't need them...yet many kids in the neighborhood did and I can identify by experience that the parenting involved could have prevented the need for the drugs....but they were too fucking lazy and wanted a scapegoat.

 

[Ns1]

The question remains....what are they working on? I'm not saying the drugs don't have an affect but I can tell you the the two kids I helped raise didn't need them...yet many kids in the neighborhood did and I can identify by experience that the parenting involved could have prevented the need for the drugs....but they were too fucking lazy and wanted a scapegoat.

I don't "need" them either, but they sure as fuck help.

 

[Ronstang]

I don't "need" them either, but they sure as fuck help.

I get that, but what are they helping? Of course psychotropic drugs have an affect....but they are merely masks. You can control the underlying reasons you take them...if you choose. It all comes down to will power...which most people lack these days because they are lazy and only want to live in the now.

Oh, and unlike most around here I'm not intending to insult you personally

 

[Ns1]

It all comes down to will power...which most people lack these days because they are lazy and only want to live in the now.

Can't argue with this. Sometimes willpower comes in 125mg/XR capsules.

 

[destrekor]

Maybe, but very few. Not enough to show up on radar. There were always discipline cases but they were rare....today they are the norm. You can't tell me something went undiagnosed for millenia to being prominent in the majority of our kids in a couple decades. These problems are caused by two things....parents....and a medical community looking to make a buck off their emotions.

Lower-grade cases of ADHD may potentially be solved with excessive fear of discipline, ridicule, and potentially pain. The risk of those same issues then causing an entirely DIFFERENT disorder, such as a variety of personality disorders, then increases drastically.

Most cases of the various personality disorders are thought to relate to emotional and physical abuse when growing up. If they were constantly thought of as stupid and treated as such, and weren't effectively coached, more issues crop up.

There is much to be said about effective behavioral therapy and behavior modification/coaching... so the very effective parents could get something productive.

That said, you are also ignoring the majority of cases of ADULTS who went their whole live either avoiding such a diagnosis as a kid, or doing what they could to get ahead without assistance, and then getting diagnosed with ADHD. [note: "ADD" no longer exists as a disease in of itself, it is a subtype of ADHD by modern definition. Mostly as ADHD-Inattentive Type]

Also, you are ignoring the possibility of environmental toxins. I'm not using this as a cop-out or trying to be an eco-kook or stand in the same group as the chemtrail and other conspiracy nuts.

There exists compelling evidence that environmental lead (toxic in basically every fashion a metal can be toxic, and the most minute of doses are toxic at the biological level) is directly linked to a rise in crime, mostly as a result of a rise in behavioral and mental health issues. This theory exists to explain the rise of crime that peaks in the late 80s and early 90s, and has been in a continuous slide since that peak (which continues, without fail, through today, regardless of how sensational the media may appear - all statistics across the country properly document the drop in crime rates).

All that just so happens to coincide with peak environmental lead contamination from leaded gasoline during formative years of high-crime generations.

That lead hasn't disappeared, it has merely diminished slowly. Those who may have become criminals, including those reaching maturity today, have been receiving far better mental health treatment or other behavioral modifications due to advances in treatment and therapy.

It doesn't explain ALL cases of ADHD or other mental health disorders, but it has contributed.


I know this is a wiki link, but the sources are valid and if one can access journal articles, I'm sure are terrific reads. I had read some of these before, I'm fairly sure, but cannot access them now that I am out of school and no longer have any kind of journal access.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_poisoning#Nervous_system

Forever ago I had read a full journal article on this very subject, but I haven't been able to track it down, sadly. I'll make an effort to do so, but in the mean time, this is an excellent read:

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2013/01/lead-crime-link-gasoline

 

[BoberFett]

I'll both agree and disagree with you at the same time. If you were to say somewhere something like "the majority of cases diagnosed are done falsely but a handful are legitimately caused by underlying physiological conditions" in the same manner as depression, then you'd be onto something.

When you have a society where zero tolerance is the rule and your kids can't blow off any steam, you're bound to have problems when you ask for perfection from something that's inherently flawed.

Every minute variance in every species is caused by an underlying physiological "condition". That does not make everything outside of "the norm" a disorder.

 

[destrekor]

I get that, but what are they helping? Of course psychotropic drugs have an affect....but they are merely masks. You can control the underlying reasons you take them...if you choose. It all comes down to will power...which most people lack these days because they are lazy and only want to live in the now.

Oh, and unlike most around here I'm not intending to insult you personally

When willpower is directly effected by a low availability or low production of either norepinephrine or dopamine (or reuptake that is too fast leading to early shortage) you should see the issue in that statement.

Your brain works entirely due to chemical interactions. Your statement of self-control and willpower, your personal dialogue with your brain to get it into gear, is simply a starter-motor for some chemical interactions to start producing a desired goal. When you have ineffective chemical interactions due to a failing at some point in the line, well, that leads to problems getting your brain to do the very thing you want to do.

That's like telling someone to stop being depressed, because they are weak and clearly should have better willpower to make themselves happier! If they have temporary depression due to misfortune but generally have a solid healthy brain, this will work. If they have Major Depression, you might just kill them with those words.

The older generations and the ignorant youth these days simply do not understand higher sciences, and I get that, only people who invest effort to study them will. But that doesn't mean that the people who do understand these things are only trying to make a racket of the situation and laugh all the way to the bank.

There are, unfortunately, self-serving psychiatrists or general doctors who will help the pharm giants make their sales and money. However, there are far more honest professionals who would prefer to use therapy to help the cases that can be helped without medication, and do what they can to find the lowest dose and right chemical to actually treat someone.

----
As a side note: I have dealt with what I assume to be some psychiatric disorder for my entire adult life, and have done everything in my power to adjust what needs adjusting, in order to perform better or otherwise simply be a better person. I felt it in middle and high school but then just figured I was weak-willed, I assumed I didn't meet the stereotypes for ADD or ADHD. As life has progressed, I've come to believe I do have it, but that I could control or even fix it. I have failed on that front, and am actually investigating this with professionals starting next week. I don't WANT chemicals to be the answer, but after all the efforts I've invested, I don't actually expect the answer to be anything but some prescription. I've honestly avoided this my whole life, but I'm not making significant progress toward being a more production, more capable, more self-reliant individual, and so I think it's time to lean on a professional and see what they suggest.

You may call my weak-minded, weak-willed, stupid, a failure, lazy... I don't care. I've made every effort to correct those faults, and I'm beginning to feel it is entirely rational to say that it is literally not within myself to correct those faults. The answer lies, potentially, in drugs that may very well correct the chemical messenger issues within the brain, and only at that point can I take the self-improvement steps to correct faults.
That said, I'd love to be wrong and find that basic therapy without drugs is the "fix" I need.

 

[KeithP]

Anything that a pharmaceutical company can develop a drug for is a disorder. Duh.

-KeithP

 

[Rakehellion]

Lets start with premature ejaculation.

Of course the two-pump chump creates a rant thread justifying his lack of sexual prowess.

 

[Rakehellion]

Its not a disorder brother. Its called being human.

Humans have disorders.

 

[nickbits]

Dysthymia--just a way to label a shitty personality.

 

[bradly1101]

If they can make money on a pill for it (or other treatment), it's a new disorder or disease. Example: 'Low-T' is normal for aging men.

 

[Rakehellion]

Anything that more than 10% of our nations young boys is diagnosed with cannot be a disorder. That's what you call a racket.

So because x% of people are diagnosed with it, it is a myth. 10% isn't even that high.

60% of people are obese. I guess that's healthy too.

 

[BoberFett]

So because x% of people are diagnosed with it, it is a myth. 10% isn't even that high.

60% of people are obese. I guess that's healthy too.

You clearly don't understand the conversation. Nobody said it doesn't exist. They're saying it's not a disorder, something outside the norm.

And obesity isn't a disorder. It's being lazy and gluttonous. Hence people ridiculing the fat acceptance movement.

If a large percentage of people have a "disorder" then the problem is not with the individual, it's a problem with society and the expectations being set on those individuals with the supposed "disorder". If society is too busy, too distracting, too structured for a massive number of people to deal with, then society needs to figure out how to be more flexible and slow things down rather than tell those people they're defective, and that they now need to fuck their brain up with drugs in order to meet society's ridiculous expectations.