Coast Guard shuts down oil skimmers

[Darwin333]

Absolutely. It would have only taken a couple hours to get those coasties to drive to the barges and confirm equipment, or GIVE IT TO THEM.

Instead, they pull the standard beareaucratic bullshit and tell them they can't go out.

No, the coast guard deserves to be shitfaced for this incident. You can buy those items at any marine store for a couple hundred bucks.

"I don't know who is in charge," Plaquemines Parish President Billy Nungesser told the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Subcommittee, one of four panels holding hearings Thursday into the massive oil spill, three of which occurred simultaneously.

"Is it BP? Is it the Coast Guard? I have spent more time fighting the officials and the Coast Guard than fighting the oil," Nungesser said.

While BP America Vice President Ray Dempsey told the subcommittee that no effort is being spared and Juliette Kayyem, assistant secretary for the Department of Homeland Security, said that the federal government has assigned a Coast Guard official to every parish to cut through the red tape, Nungesser said the effort is failing.

"If they have the authority, they aren't using it," he said of the Coast Guard officials assigned to work directly with parish officials. Nungesser said it's taking five days for requests to reach Thad Allen, the retired Coast Guard rear admiral who is overseeing the federal response.


"For example, on May 24, during a town hall meeting at Plaquemines Parish, a local participant suggested to BP that they use a specific skimmer used by the Dutch government in the response effort," Kayyem said. "After favorable review of demonstration videos and encouragement by the Coast officials at the meeting, the suggestion was taken for action and BP was ordered to hire the skimmers."

Still, Nungesser said that "it's a crime" that neither BP nor the government has brought in skimmers capable of collecting oil from as low 500 feet to reduce the oil reaching vital marshes and wetlands.

Sen. Mary Landrieu, D-La., said changes are needed.

Landrieu said she didn't know whether the Army or Navy could do a better job than the current command, "But the command structure is broken," she said.


Yup, bang up job the Coast Guard is doing. Oh how I long for the good ole days of FEMA after Katrina.

 

[Darwin333]

If thats the case then why didnt they have them in the first place? RAGE!!!!!!

Here is the funny part and it just shows that you have no idea whatsoever as to what you are talking about. They DID in fact have them in the first place. What they didn't have was an official US Coast Guard inspection to prove they had them.

Go ahead and strong up the cg over this one day lost of oil skimming? With oil still pumping into the gulf even today? What was lost hmmm? Everything would of been ALL better huh?

Just give it up. You have already been proven wrong, the CG has and is failing miserably. I don't mean to condemn the entire Coast Guard for this but the folks they have down here running the show (let me repeat that for you) the United States Coast Guard personal who are, according to Obama, in charge are not only not getting the job done they are SLOWING IT DOWN. Can you comprehend that or is your only answer RAGE!! RAGE!! Damn right we are pissed off, the Coast Guard is harming our attempts to save our coast because they have utterly failed to do any job they have been tasked with. If your house was on fire and your wife and kids were trapped inside and I was preventing fire fighters from getting to your house you would be a little pissed too.

What was lost? Only a few more miles of wetlands, no big deal right? I guarantee you would be singing a different tune if it was YOUR backyard being fucked up due to some asshole bureaucrats getting in the way, impeding progress, taking FIVE DAYS to get info from Parish presidents on the front line to Admiral Thad (the one who is supposed to be in charge). The parish presidents aren't even sure if he really is in charge, that is how bad it is.

So you can say all the bullshit you want about "rage" but that rage is very well deserved for an utterly piss poor performance by the CG. I am sorry if that makes your political team look bad but that doesn't change the facts.

Thanks for playing though, feel free to try again.

Edit: One last thing, if they would have brought in the equipment we had requested when we originally requested it we could have saved tons of currently oiled wetlands, marshes and bayous. The fact that oil is still spewing into the Gulf to this day only indicates that we need MORE ASSETS REMOVING THE OIL FROM THE WATER, not less as you seem to advocate.

 

[JSt0rm]

Here is the funny part and it just shows that you have no idea whatsoever as to what you are talking about. They DID in fact have them in the first place. What they didn't have was an official US Coast Guard inspection to prove they had them.


Just give it up. You have already been proven wrong, the CG has and is failing miserably. I don't mean to condemn the entire Coast Guard for this but the folks they have down here running the show (let me repeat that for you) the United States Coast Guard personal who are, according to Obama, in charge are not only not getting the job done they are SLOWING IT DOWN. Can you comprehend that or is your only answer RAGE!! RAGE!! Damn right we are pissed off, the Coast Guard is harming our attempts to save our coast because they have utterly failed to do any job they have been tasked with. If your house was on fire and your wife and kids were trapped inside and I was preventing fire fighters from getting to your house you would be a little pissed too.

What was lost? Only a few more miles of wetlands, no big deal right? I guarantee you would be singing a different tune if it was YOUR backyard being fucked up due to some asshole bureaucrats getting in the way, impeding progress, taking FIVE DAYS to get info from Parish presidents on the front line to Admiral Thad (the one who is supposed to be in charge). The parish presidents aren't even sure if he really is in charge, that is how bad it is.

So you can say all the bullshit you want about "rage" but that rage is very well deserved for an utterly piss poor performance by the CG. I am sorry if that makes your political team look bad but that doesn't change the facts.

Thanks for playing though, feel free to try again.

Edit: One last thing, if they would have brought in the equipment we had requested when we originally requested it we could have saved tons of currently oiled wetlands, marshes and bayous. The fact that oil is still spewing into the Gulf to this day only indicates that we need MORE ASSETS REMOVING THE OIL FROM THE WATER, not less as you seem to advocate.

what I see is someone mad at government. RAGE!!

SO through some misinformation they lost 24 hours of skimming. THAT did not destroy the gulf.

 

[spidey07]

what I see is someone mad at government. RAGE!!

SO through some misinformation they lost 24 hours of skimming. THAT did not destroy the gulf.

Never underestimate the most powerful emotion. Mock it at your own peril. Just sayin'

this is is where resolve kicks in.

 

[JSt0rm]

Never underestimate the most powerful emotion. Mock it at your own peril. Just sayin'

this is is where resolve kicks in.

huh?

Everyone knows the most powerful emotion is love

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bW5E9sx9gU

 

[Darwin333]

what I see is someone mad at government. RAGE!!

SO through some misinformation they lost 24 hours of skimming. THAT did not destroy the gulf.

No that didn't destroy the Gulf, just a few more miles of our wetlands.

You didn't address the rest of my post either, the Coast Guard is slowing shit down. Period. Why are you defending them for slowing shit down?

 

[JSt0rm]

Because the rest of your post was opinion.

I doubt you, a guy floating around in a skiff, can say that the CG is slowing shit down when I'm sure the best logistical minds are at work on this problem. Everything is fucked up! Thats how it was going to be! You are outraged that its all fucked up but I think you point that outrage in the wrong direction.

 

[Darwin333]

Because the rest of your post was opinion.

I doubt you, a guy floating around in a skiff, can say that the CG is slowing shit down when I'm sure the best logistical minds are at work on this problem. Everything is fucked up! Thats how it was going to be! You are outraged that its all fucked up but I think you point that outrage in the wrong direction.

Would you mind terribly pointing out exactly what you assume is "simply opinion from some guy floating around in a skiff"?

Unlike you, I can back up what I have said with cold hard facts just like I did in your little "game" that you stopped playing. "I'm sure the best logistical minds are at work on this problem", not even the Democrats buy that bullshit. Every Democrat in an effected state I have heard so far says damn near the exact same thing, that the command structure is broken and no one knows who is really in charge, no one knows what assets they really have and where (at least no one that the senators have access to), and the red tape/bureaucratic bullshit is deeper than the leaking well.

Bottom line is EVERYONE who is anywhere near the situation disagrees with you, including people on your "side". So pretty please, go grab all those quotes you think are opinions. I have made a ton of claims so you should easily be able to grab a dozen or so and I will prove you dead wrong, again.

I doubt you will do that though because it is quite obvious you have no clue what you are talking about. It doesn't even sound like you glance at the headlines concerning the spill. Hell, did you even read the article in the OP? Thats what you consider the "best logistical minds"?

 

[PeshakJang]

Yes the President has the power to fix things if they are actually going wrong, but in the command center the President is not the one running the show. He might have oversight of the indecent, but he is not in command.

So you agree that the CEO of BP is not to blame for the accident, right?

 

[Gand1]

So you agree that the CEO of BP is not to blame for the accident, right?

I could not say...supposedly the reason for the blow outs was the fact they used too little support rings when drilling/cementing the well. If the approval and oversight of these rings was definitely the cause and the CEO of BP had anything to do with or knowledge of the misuse of the technology, hell yeah I blame him. If he did not, then he is not to blame specifically for the accident, but is definitely the one who has to make sure shit gets fixed right. If they are not done right, or well, he is to blame.

 

[highland145]

huh?

Everyone knows the most powerful emotion is love

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bW5E9sx9gU

But the most productive, positive or negative, is anger.

 

[OutHouse]

nm

 

[Pulsar]

Because the rest of your post was opinion.

I doubt you, a guy floating around in a skiff, can say that the CG is slowing shit down when I'm sure the best logistical minds are at work on this problem. Everything is fucked up! Thats how it was going to be! You are outraged that its all fucked up but I think you point that outrage in the wrong direction.

Huh?

What part was opinion? The part where it's taking ridiculous amounts of time to get information back and forth because of a broken command structure? Or the part where the coast guard is slowing things down rather than speeding them up through the addition of ridiculous political games?

I'm not sure what type of game you're trying to play, but I get the distinct impression that you're some guy sitting far far away from the actual problem who really doesn't give two shits either way. You seem to be far more interested in arguing ridiculous and incorrect ideas and scoring cheap points than actually discussing the issues.

RAGE RAGE ANGER ANGER.

There. Now you have something to pay attention to in my thread, rather than all the factual information.

 

[JSt0rm]

Would you mind terribly pointing out exactly what you assume is "simply opinion from some guy floating around in a skiff"?

What would you guys prefer? Hmmm? Everybody gets to charge out into the water and feel good about cleaning it up? Its a logistical nightmare and I don't think you or the politicians in your area are qualified to either 1 make suggestions as to a multi-state response and 2 throw the cg under the bus because this is going to end badly.

IT WAS ALWAYS GOING TO END BADLY.

Look at the fucking thing for Christ sake. You want to be angry at the CG like its somehow able to be fixed. It's not able to be fixed and it wont be for a long long time. Sorry.

 

[Darwin333]

What would you guys prefer? Hmmm?

I have outlined various things that the government could be doing or could be doing better. All of them are extremely realistic, the assets exist and are available as well as the manpower/expertise to implement them. You refuse to listen to anything anyone with more knowledge about the situation and actual solutions has to say though so I won't bother typing them all out again, you are more than welcome to view my previous posts.

I will list one very simple thing I would prefer. I would greatly prefer if the CG stopped SLOWING DOWN and or IMPEDING the cleanup and mitigation. Except to you, it doesn't seem like a whole lot to ask

Everybody gets to charge out into the water and feel good about cleaning it up?

How about taking less than 5 days to get a simple request moved up the chain to the proper people? By the time answers to simple requests come, something that should be able to happen in minutes-hours, it is too late and the answer is irrelevant. When the CG is told that oil is 3 days away from XYZ inland waterway and it takes them 5 days to mobilize equipment to prevent the oil from entering those waterways (the equipment was a few miles away and sitting idle) the oil is already in them.

Why is it that the Parish presidents to this day aren't sure who is in charge? The same things are now being said by local leaders in Mississippi and Alabama.

Its a logistical nightmare and I don't think you or the politicians in your area are qualified to either 1 make suggestions as to a multi-state response and 2 throw the cg under the bus because this is going to end badly.

Yes, this is going to end badly the only question is exactly how bad. The CG, COE, and EPA have ensured that it will end worse than it could have and continue to do so. Its not the mistakes I have a problem with, it is their unwillingness to fix the problems so that we can effectively fight this battle. As far as the "logistical nightmare", you are correct, it is. Luckily we happen to have the finest command and control structure in the entire world, the US .mil. The CG recently stated that they can not even communicate with the boats that are conducting the cleanup (working under their supervision). What kind of sick joke is that? I can figure out a plan to do that my damned self with a dozen or two boats with decent comms gear. As far as tracking what assets are assigned where, something else the CG has stated they can not do (not real time tracking, they flat out don't know what boats they assigned to go where) we got a guy down here that is coordinating over 60 boats with google earth. Your argument is the .mil has nothing better than some guy with a laptop and google earth?
IT WAS ALWAYS GOING TO END BADLY.

Look at the fucking thing for Christ sake. You want to be angry at the CG like its somehow able to be fixed. It's not able to be fixed and it wont be for a long long time. Sorry.

You ar ethe one that needs to "look at the fucking thing for Christ sake". I am not asking that they fix the unfixable. I am asking that they fix the things they are doing wrong and at the very least get the hell out of the way. As far as throwing the CG under the bus, this thread just happens to be about them and they are the ones "in charge" but its not the CGs response that has been woefully lacking. It is the response of almost every Federal agency that is involved especially the COE and the EPA.

IMO, the only reason you are trying to disagree with me is because you think it makes your political club look bad. I really don't give a damn about your club or the other one.
I take it you couldn't find any "opinion" of mine that would backup your previous statement.

 

[werepossum]

I have outlined various things that the government could be doing or could be doing better. All of them are extremely realistic, the assets exist and are available as well as the manpower/expertise to implement them. You refuse to listen to anything anyone with more knowledge about the situation and actual solutions has to say though so I won't bother typing them all out again, you are more than welcome to view my previous posts.

I will list one very simple thing I would prefer. I would greatly prefer if the CG stopped SLOWING DOWN and or IMPEDING the cleanup and mitigation. Except to you, it doesn't seem like a whole lot to ask


How about taking less than 5 days to get a simple request moved up the chain to the proper people? By the time answers to simple requests come, something that should be able to happen in minutes-hours, it is too late and the answer is irrelevant. When the CG is told that oil is 3 days away from XYZ inland waterway and it takes them 5 days to mobilize equipment to prevent the oil from entering those waterways (the equipment was a few miles away and sitting idle) the oil is already in them.

Why is it that the Parish presidents to this day aren't sure who is in charge? The same things are now being said by local leaders in Mississippi and Alabama.


Yes, this is going to end badly the only question is exactly how bad. The CG, COE, and EPA have ensured that it will end worse than it could have and continue to do so. Its not the mistakes I have a problem with, it is their unwillingness to fix the problems so that we can effectively fight this battle. As far as the "logistical nightmare", you are correct, it is. Luckily we happen to have the finest command and control structure in the entire world, the US .mil. The CG recently stated that they can not even communicate with the boats that are conducting the cleanup (working under their supervision). What kind of sick joke is that? I can figure out a plan to do that my damned self with a dozen or two boats with decent comms gear. As far as tracking what assets are assigned where, something else the CG has stated they can not do (not real time tracking, they flat out don't know what boats they assigned to go where) we got a guy down here that is coordinating over 60 boats with google earth. Your argument is the .mil has nothing better than some guy with a laptop and google earth?
IT WAS ALWAYS GOING TO END BADLY.



You ar ethe one that needs to "look at the fucking thing for Christ sake". I am not asking that they fix the unfixable. I am asking that they fix the things they are doing wrong and at the very least get the hell out of the way. As far as throwing the CG under the bus, this thread just happens to be about them and they are the ones "in charge" but its not the CGs response that has been woefully lacking. It is the response of almost every Federal agency that is involved especially the COE and the EPA.

IMO, the only reason you are trying to disagree with me is because you think it makes your political club look bad. I really don't give a damn about your club or the other one.
I take it you couldn't find any "opinion" of mine that would backup your previous statement.

Well said. What this whole sorry episode shows is that the federal government does very little well. Unfortunately there are things we really need it to do well. Unlike oil companies we have only one federal government, and as we've seen with both Arizona and the clean-up it seems to not only be determined to shirk its duties, but to actively prevent others from doing them as well.