CIA Torture Report Set to Go Nuclear

[Brainonska511]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

Right... this is at the same level of seriousness as Benghazi. Are you daft?

 

[khon]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

No, it isn't.

Benghazi is a "scandal" about talking points.

This is a scandal about actions that are illegal and universally considered abhorent.

An easy way to check the difference is to look outside the US political bubble. The rest of the world doesn't give a shit about Benghazi, but obviosly does care about torture.

 

[fskimospy]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

I'm excited to hear you explain how.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The greatest thing about this man is he's steady. You know where he stands. He believes the same thing Wednesday that he believed on Monday, no matter what happened Tuesday. Events can change; this man's beliefs never will.

Seems he's in the same company of ISIS and Al Qaeda. The same quality of person but with a different allegiance.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

Would you like to try that line of reasoning with me? If the seriousness and magnitude of enormity counts I'd not down that road if I were you. Note- I'm not generally considered a political lap dog in anyone's camp.

 

[Genx87]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

Not even close. In this version there is actual verifiable proof of terrible crimes against humanity committed by the CIA under directive from our executive branch with briefings to our legislative.

 

[utahraptor]

I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of Torture, and to the Corporations for which it stands, one nation, under surveillance, enslaved, with brutality and incarceration for all.

 

[BurnItDwn]

This report is just a report.
Need to have real court case with real lawsmiths, sort of like the war trials against the nazis at the end of WW2.

People talk about freedom, and how much they love it, but then they bitch about "we did not keep our torturing secret", to me, that is the highest and lowest form of hypocrisy.

 

[Remobz]

I thought the Americans were the good guys safeguarding their Country and the world by any means from evil Muslims hell bent on destroying the Western way of life?

What am I missing here?

 

[Caravaggio]

Stand by your bunks.
Cheney has arrived and will inspect you all.
His safety catch is OFF

 

[ivwshane]

I thought the Americans were the good guys safeguarding their Country and the world by any means from evil Muslims hell bent on destroying the Western way of life?

What am I missing here?

If you can't beat them, join them!


/s

 

[ivwshane]

A good article with a time line. Rumsfelds involvement is very telling as well.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/12/1...-abiding-by-us-standards-.html?_r=0&referrer=

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

A good article with a time line. Rumsfelds involvement is very telling as well.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/12/1...-abiding-by-us-standards-.html?_r=0&referrer=

I don't have he particular article but I think it's telling that the rest of the WH went to lengths to keep Powell from knowing what was going on, because loyalty to the chain of command notwithstanding, they figured he'd not stand for it and hang everyone up to the top man for abuse.

 

[Newell Steamer]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...ture-investigation-the-report-is-full-of-crap

Cheney was combative and unrepentant, saying both he and then-President George W. Bush knew full well the techniques being used on detainees. Bush, he said, was an "integral part of the program" and "had to approve it before we went through with it."

 

[Jhhnn]

Given your own inability to acknowledge the culpability of the present administration as regards issues like rendition and extrajudicial assassination (including American citizens) that's more than a touch, um, damn, what's that word again?

You've been reaching hard for that conclusion for some while, haven't you?

Even to the point of dodging questions yourself & comparing apples to oranges.

When asked if I should condemn the killing of Bin Laden, you didn't answer.

When discussing rendition, you falsely equate the sharing of intelligence with foreign law enforcement with kidnapping. Should we fail to inform other govts about suspects traveling in their countries? Should we not extradite suspects in their custody when we have just cause? Are we responsible for their treatment by those govts? Is that the same as snatching a suspect from the streets of Milan or shipping a Canadian citizen from our soil to Syria? Is it the same as maintaining torture facilities abroad to avoid the complications of US law? Is it the same as creating what really was a torture facility at Gitmo?

I'll agree that US Law enforcement should not observe or participate in interrogations that do not meet our standards nor should they turn chickenshit about putting any American abroad on the no-fly list as a coercive measure.

OTOH, dealing with Terrorism as an international police problem rather than a military problem is an enormous step away from ordering the deaths of many, many thousands incurred in the invasion & occupation of Afghanistan & Iraq.

Yes, it's right to condemn torture, but it's really just a footnote to the monstrous nature of Neocon foreign policy in the wake of 9/11. It's not like we can escape that legacy or discredit the perps easily at all, certainly not until we as a people are willing to own up to it.

If this serves to discredit the Bush Admin, I'm all for it. It's a start, but there's really a whole lot more to be done.

 

[ivwshane]

I don't have he particular article but I think it's telling that the rest of the WH went to lengths to keep Powell from knowing what was going on, because loyalty to the chain of command notwithstanding, they figured he'd not stand for it and hang everyone up to the top man for abuse.

It's very telling and if I were to trust anyone's version of events it would be Powell and his staff.

http://crooksandliars.com/2014/12/col-wilkerson-dick-cheney-fully-informed

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It's very telling and if I were to trust anyone's version of events it would be Powell and his staff.

http://crooksandliars.com/2014/12/col-wilkerson-dick-cheney-fully-informed

I wonder just how much Bush knew. Please don't take this as a defense of him, far from it. If he didn't know the full truth it's because he didn't want to.

The Big Three Bad Guys in all this are in no particular order Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Wolfowitz, the last not often named, but who played the part of Joseph Goebbels, ensuring the "correct" version of what was happening in Iraq was told and you know what those quotes meant.

I don't know if you were aware but Cheney had always been looked at with suspicion and fear in the circles which mattered. There was one person who had absolutely no time for his nonsense and Cheney's attempts at domination were so pathetic that he retreated, and that was the first Bush, who had considerable knowledge of how intelligence and war worked, including the horrors of the latter.

Bush the Lesser proved to be just that.

 

[jhbball]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

nope, you fucking fail-fuck.

 

[ivwshane]

I wonder just how much Bush knew. Please don't take this as a defense of him, far from it. If he didn't know the full truth it's because he didn't want to.

The Big Three Bad Guys in all this are in no particular order Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Wolfowitz, the last not often named, but who played the part of Joseph Goebbels, ensuring the "correct" version of what was happening in Iraq was told and you know what those quotes meant.

I don't know if you were aware but Cheney had always been looked at with suspicion and fear in the circles which mattered. There was one person who had absolutely no time for his nonsense and Cheney's attempts at domination were so pathetic that he retreated, and that was the first Bush, who had considerable knowledge of how intelligence and war worked, including the horrors of the latter.

Bush the Lesser proved to be just that.

I forgot where I read it it but there was a quote by president bush to the affect of, 'don't tell me all the details, I don't want to know', this was specifically regarding CIA techniques.
I certainly don't think bush was the mastermind, far from it, his crime is being complaisant.

To add to your list of "bad guys" or as I see it, people who should be prosecuted, john yoo for crafting the legal framework to justify torture, and George tenet for lying to officials.

 

[trenchfoot]

Let this be a lesson to us all that we shouldn't elect neocons and corrupted big businessmen to high office ever again.

 

[Victorian Gray]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

No, unlike Benghazi, this is an actual scandal. But, in the end, it will become just another historical footnote because nobody 'important' really gives a damn.

 

[Angry Irishman]

LOL! The frothing at the mouths....

 

[Victorian Gray]

You've been reaching hard for that conclusion for some while, haven't you?

Even to the point of dodging questions yourself & comparing apples to oranges.

When asked if I should condemn the killing of Bin Laden, you didn't answer.

When discussing rendition, you falsely equate the sharing of intelligence with foreign law enforcement with kidnapping. Should we fail to inform other govts about suspects traveling in their countries? Should we not extradite suspects in their custody when we have just cause? Are we responsible for their treatment by those govts? Is that the same as snatching a suspect from the streets of Milan or shipping a Canadian citizen from our soil to Syria? Is it the same as maintaining torture facilities abroad to avoid the complications of US law? Is it the same as creating what really was a torture facility at Gitmo?

I'll agree that US Law enforcement should not observe or participate in interrogations that do not meet our standards nor should they turn chickenshit about putting any American abroad on the no-fly list as a coercive measure.

OTOH, dealing with Terrorism as an international police problem rather than a military problem is an enormous step away from ordering the deaths of many, many thousands incurred in the invasion & occupation of Afghanistan & Iraq.

Yes, it's right to condemn torture, but it's really just a footnote to the monstrous nature of Neocon foreign policy in the wake of 9/11. It's not like we can escape that legacy or discredit the perps easily at all, certainly not until we as a people are willing to own up to it.

If this serves to discredit the Bush Admin, I'm all for it. It's a start, but there's really a whole lot more to be done.

And you still will not condemn the present administration for continuing renditions (hand wave all you want, it's known that CIA/other agents of the US are often present and even directing the 'interrogations' of people that have been renditioned), continuing and expanding extrajudicial assassinations or, as I recall, even the expanded spying on American citizens/the world.

In short, you are as much a blind partisan as those on 'the other side' you constantly belittle.

It's *all* Bush/Republicans.

Except it's not...

For example:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...593aa0-5102-11e2-984e-f1de82a7c98a_story.html

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/01/remix-rendition-proxy-detention

http://www.propublica.org/article/the-best-reporting-on-detention-and-rendition-under-obama

 

[blankslate]

This is the liberals version of Benghazi controversy.

If only there was no torture and it was the liberal's version of the Benghazi "controversy".

I don't know if you were aware but Cheney had always been looked at with suspicion and fear in the circles which mattered.

Have you read Angler? It details how Cheney ran the committee to find a nominee to run as President Bush's VP candidate during the campaing (funny how that worked).

Furthermore, when the Bush administration and the Obama administration met during the transition a general question was asked about advice for the incoming president.
Cheney said something along the lines of "The President should keep control of his Vice President." I'm sure President Bush new about the torture but I wouldn't be surprised if VP Cheney was the main impetus for it.


....

 

[Jeff7]

I thought the Americans were the good guys safeguarding their Country and the world by any means from evil Muslims hell bent on destroying the Western way of life?

What am I missing here?

If you can't beat them, join them!


/s

If you can't beat them, imprison them in a different country.